The seal has a flap or wing on one side of it. I need to know whether that flap/wing points towards the door or away from it…for example, at the top does the “flap” point towards the rear quarter light or towards the front of the car?
Many thanks in advance.
Les;
If I understand your question correctly and my 70 2+2 has the same weather stripping as your 68 2+2 does, the flap ‘points’ or is orientated towards the front of the car.
Regards, Joel.
Excellent! Thank you Joel.
Hi Les
I have been looking for a supplier of these B post seals with the correct profile of a forward facing flap and a foot which slides into the channel rivetted to the B post for my S3 without success for some time. Part numbers are the same as for later S1 and S2 cars. I would be grateful to know if you bought your seals recently and if so who from?
Regards,
Bob
Hi Bob,
I use SNG for all my stuff and I got the seals in my pics from them about a week ago.
Hello Bob,
I’m taking a stab in the dark here, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the seal Les has for his B pillar is the exact same profile as the seal with part number BD20500, which is the seal for the Rear Quarter Glass. It seem that this seal is being supplied for the B Pillar with the correct B Pillar Part number (BD28434) applied.
The problem with some of this type of seal being supplied by some suppliers, is that the seal is being molded from two distinct consistencies of rubber; a very dense, quite hard rubber for the T section that locates in the Seal Retaining Channel, and quite soft, spongy rubber for the remainder of the profile. See following picture:
The issue with this construction of seal, is that it resists the closure of the door with a vengeance. So much so, that it makes a good fitting, easy closing door into a rubbish fit and a real door slammer. I experienced this scenario recently with a car in work approaching completion of full restoration, where the doors were a perfect fit and closed well on the old seals. When the new seals were fitted, you would have to take a run up to be able to slam the door hard enough to have them close fully on the locks, (we resisted doing so, of course).
It happened that I had another car in work that had new rubbers fitted from another supplier and the BD20500 seals used on the B Pillar were made from the same soft consistency rubber throughout. As a test, we fitted the softer rubbers to the car we were doing the final fit up before paint preparation, and low and behold, the problem was solved.
On examination of other cars in work for minor repairs, I found that some had the two consistency molded material with the seal cut for its full length, close to the T section on the side with the long flap and a section of the hard material, as close to the Seal Retaining Channel as possible, cut out (see the following picture).
Somewhat like owning a dog and having to bark for it, when you have to mutilate a pristine seal to get the door, or closing feature to close properly.
It comes back to that old acorn, why don’t the after market parts makers stay in their comfort zone by simply copying the original and not get out of their depth by trying to reinvent the wheel.
Regards,
Bill .
Thanks Les
I hope you have better success than I did with SNGB supplied seals. I had exactly the door slamming issues Bill describes.
Bob
Hi Bill,
Thanks for taking the trouble to reply in depth. My experience exactly mirrors what you describe with SNGB dual density seals. I have also tried other seals including similar profile but fully foam without success (as measured by not having to slam the doors). The ones I tried last year from SNGB had slightly less hard rubber than those supplied in 2016 but I suspect both were sourced from COH Baines in the UK and should be made as shown here with far less hard rubber, although even this is possibly too much (https://coh-baines.co.uk/product/srs-071-dual-hardness-epdm-sponge-door-seal/). I have been told that worn dies used in the coextrusion process would account for the lack of control of the hard rubber component.
As you say why can’t someone supply the correct part but I think the reason is simple economics. Far fewer 2+2s are restored than OTS or FHC and the cost of tooling up to make this seal which I believe was only used on 2+2 hasn’t so far been justifiable to the “usuals”.
Re the quarterlight seal, I am not sure if the channel is the same dimension as used on the B pillar. According to my notes the B pillar channel takes a 10mm seal foot with a throat of 7mm, but I only have a sketch of the quarterlight seals as found on my car a couple of years ago, noting a fully foam seal with a foot of 8mm which would probably not be adequate to hold in the B post channel. They fitted well enough from memory and had the correct profile for BD20500 but I can’t imagine they are original, as all seals had been previously renewed. Might be worth getting a couple and trying them although I think it might be necessary to use two and join them to get the length -will have to measure.
Regards,
Bob
“…he exact same profile as the seal with part number BD20500, which is the seal for the Rear Quarter Glass…”
No idea about the profiles but SNG uses different part numbers for each…B post = BD28431/1…window = BD20500/4
A really good project for a future technical library would be to put together a series if diagrams for each car model showing the proper seal profile and it’s placement/orientation on the car.
Hello Les,
That’s my point. Same seal, different, correct part number.
Regards,
Bill
Hello Bob,
Problem with Seals is not limited to 2+2 cars. The following picture is of the A pillar cross section for a, S3 OTS, which is the same as for the 2+2.
The Seal shown at the top of the picture limits the closure of the door, to where the trailing edge of the door is proud of the Quarter Panel at the B Pillar, to 60mm. From there its a very firm push (with striker plate removed) to get the door fully aligned with the quarter panel.
The Seal shown at the bottom of the picture allows the door to close fully without undue effort. Proper function of the Seal shown at the bottom of the picture, (to Seal against the door frame) was confirmed by using marking blue (bearing blue) thinly applied to the Seal.
Once again, door slammer with the Top Seal, perfect closing under the weight of the door with the Bottom Seal.
Not only is the profile smaller, but the Bottom Seal is far softer than the Top Seal, The Bottom Seal matches the profile and size of the original seal more closely than the Top Seal.
Again its a No Brainer. Simply copy the original.
Regards,
Bill
Hi Bill,
I would like to replace my hard A pillar seals with something softer to help with door closing at the B pillar, who was the supplier of the softer seal in your picture?
Regards
Bob
Hello Bob,
The softer, smaller section Seal shown at the bottom of the picture in my previous Post is from a kit I’ve had for a few years. It was in desperation that I looked through all the seals I had and came across the one that you seek. I will check the main box from whence I retrieved it, but I have a faint recollection that it was supplied by Terry’s Jaguar Parts in Kalamazoo, MI.
Regards,
Bill
Hello Bob,
The softer, smaller section Seal shown in the picture was supplied in a kit from Terry’s Jaguar Parts, Kalamazoo, MI.
Regards,
Bill
Thanks Bill
Regards
Bob
