Bearing for high ratio manual steering Mk2 searched

Hello specialists,

I have a high ratio steering box on my bench wich needs some care. I would like to renew the two ball bearings of the wormshaft, but no chance to get the races. The outer diameter is larger than it is by the normal ratio steeerings. It is some 46.8mm Shaft diameter is 19,05mm (3/4"). Does anybody know a source to find these bits ?
A conversion to tapered roller bearings would be fine,too, but it seems nowehere on this world a fitting bearing is available, but 47,00mm outer diameter (maybe 46.998, but this doesn*t help either).
I hate the thought widening the aluminium case, because what is gone is gone.

Would be fine to hear something.

Have a nice weekend !
Lindi

Greetings,

For the love of God, go to a bearing house, they will take care of you.

Jaguar, didn’t just design a steering column based on a bearing that had to be custom made for them, they’re stupid, but not that stupid, but also cheap, cheap won, and they used a bearing already produced.

In over 50 years, I’ve heard most ALL the stories of “special” bearings for a Ferrari, or some other mechanical complexity, and a good bearing supplier usually can order it if it’s not in his stock.

Nothing like listening to an owner pontificate on the special bearings he ordered from Italy, waited months for and paid a ridiculous price only to unwrap an SKN bearing made in Czechoslovakia. The same bearing here, about $6.00 and on the shelf.

Hi Lovell,

thanks for your news, but - sadly - been there, got nothing. It must be an “old” measurement. Such things sometimes occur. Have been told to widen the housing for “just these 2/10 mm”, but that is what I tried to avoid…

Best regards
Lindi

I have a bearing cross reference book that may come up with it if you can find ANY number, maybe the Jaguar part number??

"Hi Steve,

would be great if you could find out something.

No of the bearing race is Jaguar 6410 “ball race adjustable at each end of inner clumn worm (5-23-10)”.

Balls are 3/8". Tere are 9 balls in the race.

Is the same for Jaguar Mk1 and Mk2 high ratio.

Best regards
Lindi

What is the year, model of car.

Is the steering box a Burman?

Guessing those measurements were taken with a vernier?

The 6410 number, from the Jaguar parts catalog?

There is no number on the side edges of the bearing?

Is this bearing running in any type of lubricant?

I’m guessing since you can if you can see the balls, no side shields?

Tomorrow, I’ll check a few sources.

If the 6410 is a Jaguar catalog number I’ll see if it cross references with anything in NAPA’s interchange books.

Lindi,

You’re looking for the bearings comprised of 6, 7, and 8 in this exploded view, right?

Good luck! Although most regular bearings are standard sizes and, as @Lovell says, readily available, these thrust ring type bearings have very much gone out of style and can be quite difficult to source.

Add to that the fact that you live in a DIN/metric world, as I do, and that makes it even more difficult. I found a good bearing shop near Zürich which is pretty good, but every now and then I walk in with a bearing like this and they just shake their heads.

Hi Lovell,

the car must have been a Mk2 3.8, maybe 1961 (not shure, as I bought the
steering from the grandson of the former collector).

No 6410 is from the parts catalog.

No number at all, nowhere!

The whole steering box is filled with oil, so the bearing is running in
oil (if one cares about the oil to be there…).

The bearing is a loose bearing.
There is a washer (so called in the Jaguar parts manual) at the one side
mounted at the worm gear, 9 balls (3/8" diameter) and the bespoke race.
Balls put into the race with the help of grease, then without any tremor
the washer and the wormshaft inserted into the housing and the parts
brought together. After the third trial things fit - normally…

Thanks a lot for your help!

Best regards
Lindi

Hi Andrew,

I cannot see the drawings you have added, but as I remember the numbers
by heart, I think you are right.

Indeed it is tricky. Meanwhile I had the washers mashined, so that I can
use them again, and with the help of god, I get my new old lathe
running, so that I can try to polish the races. The silly thing is: this
steering wasn’t used much. The oil seal had come out a bit, because the
top plate was missing - no one knows why - and so water poured in and
caused some bits to start rusting.
Even the main nut was rusty inside. Fortunatetly I got a unused new one,
as they are the same (just other way round) at the Land Rover Series.
Now only my problem with the races, and the lathe also with bearing
problems…

Best regards
Lindi

Fortunately this bearing isn’t subjected to a great amount of motion, neither in angle nor in speed - all it does is take up the thrust on the wormshaft, so you could probably even make them with a form tool, polish, then harden.

As to the lathe… tell me about it. My Myford is sitting down in the cellar since I got it 2 years ago. I decided that I would strip it down and give it some TLC before putting it into operation, but somehow I’m not getting to it. Every time I have to turn something I use the cheap Sieg clone in the workshop, and think “The Myford is larger, has full set of QC toolholders and such, is calibrated in inches and should turn out better work… I really should put the Myford into operation.”

Hi Andrew,

as you say, I think a problem at the steering box bearing is not the
hardest one. The rust marks on the races are minimal. A friend of mine,
working as a body plumber, told me to use them as they are, but to
prevent them and me from further damage I liked to get them improved,
one will see.

My lathe is a Lorch, maybe from the 1930s. It is 130cm wide, leather
belt driven, a real gem. The only problem ist the adjustement of the
spindle bearing doesn’t release and is actually much too tight. Maybe
the cold temperatures contribute to the hardness of turning the spindle,
but I would like to get the bearings losse and adjust them in the right
way before starting to work with it. I want to avoid the the spindle
gets stuck in the bearings and my old girl would suffer serious damage.
At first I will try some petroleum and hot air. Perhaps I can persuade
the big screws to turn a bit.

I don’t have any other opportunity to work on a lathe elsewhere, so it
would be great to use it. A man is not a man without the most necessary
tools…

Best regards
Lindi

I have a Lorch as well, but it is the watchmaker size: about 130mm wide!

Have you had a look at http://www.lathes.co.uk/lorch/index.html

The threads on that kind of spindle (Most mfrs used a similar arrangement in that period) are pretty fine so they can be a bear to get moving if they have been sitting since the 1950s - doubly so if they have been overtightened. Try acetone and atf, or even just straight acetone to soften whatever oil, cutting fluid etc is in there. The nice thing about a watchmakers lathe is you can just put the whole lathe in Aceton, or kero or whatever.

If you have the bearing out, what is the width, when assembled?

uups, now I am bit worried.

I answered via email and found my answer here in this forum. Is one of my profile-settings wrong ? Don’t want to bopre half the world with discussions far away from the topic, sorry.

@Lovell: dont’t quite understand your question. How do I have to measure to gain the information you#re asking for ?

When I first emigrated here I lived in a small apt and really missed having a shop and stuff to work on. Antique (broken) Clocks and pocket watches were readily available at the Flohmärkt, so I started into horology. You can pretty much fit an entire clockmaking shop on a surface as small as a desk.

I’ve used my Emco Unimat to cleanup small screwheads and various things for the car, but the 6mm watchmaker’s lathe is a bit too small (and no topslide - all hand turning!) for anything other than horological work.

I haven’t quite figured out how to send a new PM to Jaglovers from email. Does anyone know how to do this?

If someone initiates the PM and you have your preferences set up to send you an email when someone PMs you, then you just reply to that email and it continues on as a PM, but I don’t know how to start one from scratch.

Lindi,

Currently waiting until next week, to pop in at bearing shop. Person I wanted to see on vacation. Hit the’net but without a number, the usual ones with no expertise are answering phones.

These people on phone only work from a number, apparently clueless on size, not to worry, have rebuilt many a spindle rated for 35,000 rpm without a number but at least with a vernier, had the ID, OD and stack size. Stack size, refers to width of unit assembled.

Not really worried on it being too small a stack width, just too tall, then it wouldn’t fit in the design envelop. Too thin, bearing arbor spacers would be used to establish proper preload, not a big deal, those come in a variety of thickness and inexpensive.

Oh yes, I understand !!

Now I took the measures of the bearings:

OD is 1 27/32" (a bit exotic)
ID ist 1 1/4"
Balls are 9 piece 3/8"
Height of the bearing is 9/16"

best regards
Lindi