Being Cautious.....not started in 39 years

My XK 140 sat for many years, the most damage to my engine was the antifreeze crystalizing and destroying via corrosion the intake manifold, and cylinder head. The water pump was rusted to the point it seized. Check the water passages before starting it too. My engine looked good under the rocker covers, visual inspection revealed the timing chain dampers were broken, This led me to tear the engine down, everything on the car was still standard. The engine is currently being rebuilt.

Hello Horatiocaine,

Thank you for your interest and mentioning your experience with the coolant system. I am still in the process of preparing to try and rotate the crankshaft (by hand). I have been traveling and have not been able to spend the time I want to with this beautiful vehicle. Just today I was down tinkering with some of the small issues. I must say, I have been concerned about the coolant system. I removed a couple of hoses and noticed some white residueā€¦not sure exactly what it is or how much more there may be in the system. Do you know of a way that I can investigate the severity of what you had experienced without removing the head? I have plans to remove the radiator, water pump, and thermostat. Iā€™ll repair and replace what I need to. I am trying to do whatever I can without major dissecting. Perhaps I should remove the intake manifold to see what it is like in that area before I try starting the engine. However, removing the intake manifold looks like a huge project in itself. I guess I would have a bigger project if I encounter the same problem you did. What do you think? At this time Iā€™m not even sure it will turn over by hand. I guess Iā€™ll find that out in a couple of days.

I really appreciate your input. I can use all of the advice I can get.

Again, thank you.

JJ Knight

Remove the intake manifold, the thermostat and see what you get. You may be able to flush the cooling system via the water inlet and exit hoses. From my experience I suspect it is a mess inside there, water, steel and aluminum sitting fir 39 years, canā€™t be good.

Helloā€¦

Iā€™ll do that. I am still waiting to see if the crank can be turned by hand. I am waiting a few more days before I try turning the crankshaftā€¦I think the longer I let the fluids work the better chance I have of being able to get a positive result. Iā€™ll probably try on Saturday. In the meantime, I will be working on the water pump. I took the larger top hose off of the radiator. The port was as clean as a whistle. I hope that is a good sign. I need to order a new water pump gasket (perhaps a water pump), thermostat, and a few hoses. All of the hoses are brittle and just fall apart. That is sad.

Again, thanks for the advice.

JJ Knight

not sure if its been mentioned, but apart from the rings, and waterways, I cant help thinking 39yrs of solidified crud behind the crankshaft plugs is a pretty big risk in terms of a possible catastrophic failure.

others will be more experienced to advise on this

pictures in the archives can inform your thinking

I know it will be unwelcome news, as ultimately it means an expensive engine R&R

however, for reliability & risk reduction, if I was a betting man, I would not give you evens on all 3 suspect areas being good

imo, the best person to give an opinion would be lister @Dick_Maury as he would see more engines & people in this situation than anyone else

Good Morning Tony,

Thanks for your concern and input. I am taking everyoneā€™s experience and advice and trying to evaluate the situation to take the right path. I would love to be able to remove the head and do what needs to be done. However, Iā€™m not a big fan of removing the engine from the car itself. I donā€™t know how challenging it is to try and do what I need to do without extracting the engine. Decisions !!!

Again, thanks for enlightening me about the crank plugs.

JJ Knight

first off, I would be inclined to gently rotate the engine by hand, and inspect the bores with a mini scope, which cost almost nothing these days.

If it doesnt rotate, that answers that!

I have personally started old engines, including Jaguar, that have sat for unknown time

crankshaft plugs would likely end up morphing into some sort of engine rebuild

Hopefully it wonā€™t come to that. If it does, seek advice on the E-Type forum.
I did it once on my '70 E to change the clutch throwout bearing, and I remember having to drop the upper ball joints to relieve tension on the torsion bars to get the cross brace off, and to remove the crank damper to get enough clearance for the sump to pass the front picture frame.

Hello Tony,

Iā€™ve been removing clamps and hoses. I have ordered a kit to replace all of the water hoses. Iā€™m not going to try and rotate the crank until Saturday. I need to think positive about the pistons being free to move. As for the buildup of whatever builds up from standing for such a long period of time, Iā€™m not sure. When removing the hoses there was very little residue present. Not to say that there is not more around and about the engine. I am thinking that it may be wise to run water through the system (flush with some type of helpful solution), although Iā€™m not sure how I would do that without the motor running. Iā€™m not sure if there is a solution out there in the market place that would be helpful. Any knowledge of a product? Just curious. I wanted to remove the water pump also. I understand from a couple of inquiries Iā€™ve read here on the Forum, that it is a real hassle. It states that I need a special tool to remove the pully to remove the water pump. I have looked the situation over and see that it is close quartersā€¦space between the pump and the frame. I happen to have a copy of the ā€œComplete Offical Jaguar 'Eā€ publication. It is comprised of the official driverā€™s handbook, workshop manual, and special tuning manual. Rather comprehensive!!! Published by "Robert Bently, Inc., out of Cambridge Mass. It is very detailed, it is made up of about 413 pagesā€¦just on the 3.8 and 4.2 Jaguars. Very detailed, and intimidating. You had mentioned a scope. I would like to purchase one. Can you give me some guidance as to where I can purchase one?

Thanks for your guidance,

JJ Knight

awg
tony

    May 9

alt haditall:
Decisions !!!

first off, I would be inclined to gently rotate the engine by hand, and inspect the bores with a mini scope, which cost almost nothing these days.

If it doesnt rotate, that answers that!

I have personally started old engines, including Jaguar, that have sat for unknown time

crankshaft plugs would likely end up morphing into some sort of engine rebuild

Hello Tony,

Thanks for the inputā€¦this Jaguar Forum has some great members. Iā€™m so happy I joined. Iā€™m going to need a lot of guidance to get through this project. Iā€™m hoping the crank can be rotated by hand. Iā€™m going to attempt it on Saturdayā€¦just letting the fluids do their thing before I try it.

Again, thanks for your input.

Have a fantastic day,

JJ Knight

Rob_Reilly

    May 9

alt haditall:
not a big fan of removing the engine from the car itself

Hopefully it wonā€™t come to that. If it does, seek advice on the E-Type forum.
I did it once on my '70 E to change the clutch throwout bearing, and I remember having to drop the upper ball joints to relieve tension on the torsion bars to get the cross brace off, and to remove the crank damper to get enough clearance for the sump to pass the front picture frame.

Hi Rob,

Thanks for your concern. Iā€™m not a fan at all about removing the motor. Hopefully, I can get through this with removing the motor. It sounds as though you a real challenge with the clutch. I hope you got through it and everything is good.

I really appreciate your helpā€¦everyone so far has been so willing to help. Like Iā€™ve said to other members, Iā€™m so glad I joined this Forum.

Have a great day,

JJ Knight

Rob_Reilly

    May 9

alt haditall:
not a big fan of removing the engine from the car itself

Hopefully it wonā€™t come to that. If it does, seek advice on the E-Type forum.
I did it once on my '70 E to change the clutch throwout bearing, and I remember having to drop the upper ball joints to relieve tension on the torsion bars to get the cross brace off, and to remove the crank damper to get enough clearance for the sump to pass the front picture frame.

check Ebay for a bore scope/endoscope, plugs into phone $20

dont throw away any original clamps marked ā€œCheneyā€

even though your water pump inside will give clues as to the engine condition, dont think I would
be doing that just yetā€¦should come off easy, without the pulley need removing (could be wrong)

(to get the pulley off, I made a tool especially for pulling waterpump pulleys, its just 1/4" plate, with 4 holes drilled to match those in the WP pulley, and 1 in the middle with a nut welded on)

Good Morning Tony,

Up early I see.

Thanks for your response and the information regarding the pulley puller and the tool you have designed to remove it. If the crank does rotate easily I am thinking, generated by a comment that you mentioned previously, to remove the intake manifold to add to the assessment. Iā€™m not really sure what to do if there is an abundance of some type of residue present. Is there a solution I can use to dissolve was may be present? You had mentioned ā€œPlugsā€ in the crankshaft. Iā€™m not really sure what that would consist of. I wouldnā€™t think it would be the same substance that would be in the water system. Iā€™m thinking sludgeā€¦perhaps? Also, Tony, your tool for the pully, are the holds threaded? And, I am thinking that the center hole would be threaded to receive the nut you mentioned. Iā€™m not sure what side of the plate the nut would go oneā€¦Iā€™m thinking the side closest to the pump. Perhaps both sides? One on the outside to stableize the bolt. Speaking of bolts, what size bolts did you use?

Okay, off to the officeā€¦have a great day.

JJ Knight

Iā€™m not sure if I asked. What did you do to rid your engine of the residue you had, and stabilize your engine? Iā€™m not sure if you conveyed that information. Did you need to remove the crankshaft?

Just my curiosity, where on earth do you reside? I happen to be in New Jersey.

JJ Knight.

Great advice! Donā€™t throw away ANYTHING!!!

Hi Phillip,

Thanks for the contact. I am enjoying all of the tips and advice from so many members. Like Iā€™ve said previously, I am so glad I became a member of the Forum.

I must say, I will keep everything but the rust. I ask so I learn better. It seems as though it is very important that I maintain the ā€œCheney Clamps,ā€ may I ask why?

Enjoy the rest of the dayā€¦what part of the world are you residing in. Just curious.

JJ Knight

micjagger
phillip keeter

    May 9

alt awg:
dont throw away any original clamps marked ā€œCheneyā€

Great advice! Donā€™t throw away ANYTHING!!!

Friend of mine just went through this with a '66 Olds Toronada. He decided it would be easier, and cheaper, to simply find a used good running engine and swap it in.

Sorry to say, the killings fields of Colorado, US of A.
Hope youā€™re having fun with the new ā€œbabyā€. Treat her well and she will treat you in kind.
Phillip

James, from what Iā€™ve read here the ā€œCheney clampsā€ are as hard to find as rocking horse poop. Some of these folks will pay top maybe more to have original clamps installed for concours events to achieve a higher grade.

Gordon

from Ozstralia maaate! :grinning: (see the little flagsā€¦put in your country on profile, displays yr national flag)

the crankshaft sludge is a build up of oil sludge & grit that can become solidified, and occurs on all these motors, the crankshaft has about 6 large threaded plugs, which need a machine shop to remove, clean out the inside crankshaft, fit new plugs.

if these are blocked up with sludge, it can take out a bearing

advise you to check about this by searching in the top corner where the magnifying glass is !

at the end of the day, if something goes wrong, you will need an engine rebuild.

If you take it apart now, you will probably still be needing a rebuild,
so looking at it that way, you dont have much risk on the downside by having a try.

ā€¦its just that ā€œbest practiceā€ thingā€¦

the WP plate has 4 unthreaded holes matching the threaded ones in the pulley
the middle hole has a nut welded on, I just screw the bolt in, or use some washers, and it will press the pulley off the shaft from the outside.

I make one for any vehicle that has threaded holes, method in the FSM likely distort the pulley

I would also flood the valve train with oil, (valves can be stuck), and pre-oil the oil galleries with a pump, drain off all the excess b4 rotating engine

imo the E-type list will be good for you (if you have an E-type?)
You should introduce yourself on that list, if you havent already