[concours] Computerized Judging solutions?

Hi everyone,
The Jaguar club I’m with has presented me with a problem that I’m just
starting to work on now. What we’d like to do is come up with a program or
spreadsheet to use for the club car meets. We’d like to use it to register
the participants, tally judges scores, etc…We’d like to move away from all
the handwritten information that we get from these shows. I was curious as
to whether or not anyone uses computers in their club’s events. I can see
where this could be beneficial but I would like to hear from others views on
this.

Thanks,
Chris Burdo
1965 3.8s(MOD)
Canterbury,Connecticut,USA
Jaguar Club of Connecticut_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Hi this is William R. Snover. Yes there is a computer program, contact the VP
Concor and requst the info. Hope this helps

Chris Burdo wrote:> Hi everyone,

The Jaguar club I’m with has presented me with a problem that I’m just
starting to work on now. What we’d like to do is come up with a program or
spreadsheet to use for the club car meets. We’d like to use it to register
the participants, tally judges scores, etc…We’d like to move away from all
the handwritten information that we get from these shows. I was curious as
to whether or not anyone uses computers in their club’s events. I can see
where this could be beneficial but I would like to hear from others views on
this.

Thanks,
Chris Burdo
1965 3.8s(MOD)
Canterbury,Connecticut,USA
Jaguar Club of Connecticut


Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

We tried it one year with a spreadsheet on a laptop, but it took longer to
enter all the numbers than it did to add them up manually, so we abandoned
the idea.

“Mark 1” Mark Stephenson
1952 XK120 Roadster #S673129 (w/XK140 engine and C head)
1958 3.4 Litre Saloon / 1984 XJ6 4.2L / 1985 XJ6 VDP / 1986 XJ6 VDP
Jaguar Club of Central Arizona (USA) – Internet Service Provider, TV & Phone | Sparklight Original Message -----
From: “Chris Burdo” cburdo@hotmail.com
To: concours@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2000 12:56 PM
Subject: [concours] Computerized Judging solutions?

Hi everyone,
The Jaguar club I’m with has presented me with a problem that I’m just
starting to work on now. What we’d like to do is come up with a program or
spreadsheet to use for the club car meets. We’d like to use it to
register
the participants, tally judges scores, etc…We’d like to move away from
all
the handwritten information that we get from these shows. I was curious as
to whether or not anyone uses computers in their club’s events. I can see
where this could be beneficial but I would like to hear from others views
on
this.

Thanks,
Chris Burdo
1965 3.8s(MOD)
Canterbury,Connecticut,USA
Jaguar Club of Connecticut


Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Hello Mark,
This is_exactly why I’m asking before I put all the time into coming up
with a spreadsheet or a program. I’d hate to spend the entire day entering
info longer than it would take for someone to just write it on a slip of
paper. Trying to weigh all the options now…There is a program I heard that
the concours shows use but I’m not sure how that would work out for
non-concours show…but I’ll look into it.I hope all is well with you and
your family, Happy Holidays. (By the way…I’m freezing up here in the dead
of winter…got any warmth you could spare so I could take the Jag for a
spin?..(No snow tires on it.:-)) Thanks again.

We tried it one year with a spreadsheet on a laptop, but it took longer to
enter all the numbers than it did to add them up manually, so we abandoned
the idea.

“Mark 1” Mark Stephenson
1952 XK120 Roadster #S673129 (w/XK140 engine and C head)
1958 3.4 Litre Saloon / 1984 XJ6 4.2L / 1985 XJ6 VDP / 1986 XJ6 VDP
Jaguar Club of Central Arizona (USA) – Internet Service Provider, TV & Phone | Sparklight

Chris Burdo
1965 3.8S(MOD)
Canterbury,Connecticut,USA
Jaguar Club of Connecticut_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Yep, the problem is that most of the cars entered are in such good condition
that on average, about 90% of the lines on the judging sheet have no
deduction. It takes longer to find the correct cell on the spreadsheet than
it does to enter the deduction on a calculator, and you have to enter the
number either way. The judges need the hard copy to know what to check and
note deductions, so you don’t save anything there. Add to that the time
involved in creating the master spreadsheet and you are way in the hole
time-wise.

The only way I see it saving time would be if judges all had little
hand-helds that stepped them through the scoring sections then linked to the
main PC to dump their part of the scoring into the mix, automatically
entering the deductions onto the various scoresheets.

I don’t see that happening in the near future, but in ten years, who knows?

Mark

P.S. I’ll stand out in front of my house and squeeze my fireplace bellows a
few times toward the east-northeast. I don’t think it will help much though.
Without snow tires, you would be taking the Jag for a “spin.”----- Original Message -----
From: “Chris Burdo” cburdo@hotmail.com
To: concours@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2000 1:39 PM
Subject: Re: [concours] Computerized Judging solutions?

Hello Mark,
This is_exactly why I’m asking before I put all the time into coming
up
with a spreadsheet or a program. I’d hate to spend the entire day entering
info longer than it would take for someone to just write it on a slip of
paper. Trying to weigh all the options now…There is a program I heard
that
the concours shows use but I’m not sure how that would work out for
non-concours show…but I’ll look into it.I hope all is well with you and
your family, Happy Holidays. (By the way…I’m freezing up here in the
dead
of winter…got any warmth you could spare so I could take the Jag for a
spin?..(No snow tires on it.:-)) Thanks again.

one of the problem with entering data with a notebook is the lack of
numerical keyboard. Even if you lock the built in numerical zone on the
regular keyboard, it’s not aligned in a natural way and takes longer.

Spreadsheet are not the faster way to enter data, the easiest way would be
in a simple Access form ( or another database ) where the fields are lined
up just like the judging sheet and navigated with the enter key. simple and
effective . no mouse unless needed, no hunting for cells, etc…

You can then print and mostly export to any format, for the web or to
incoporate into a national database for the web site…

very easy to setup, could also be done in a simple Visual Basic program
using the Access dataformat, freely distributed, no need for MS Access on
each notebook.

Pascal----- Original Message -----
From: “Mark Stephenson” marks@trnpa.com
To: concours@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2000 12:24 PM
Subject: Re: [concours] Computerized Judging solutions?

Yep, the problem is that most of the cars entered are in such good
condition
that on average, about 90% of the lines on the judging sheet have no
deduction. It takes longer to find the correct cell on the spreadsheet
than
it does to enter the deduction on a calculator, and you have to enter the
number either way. The judges need the hard copy to know what to check and
note deductions, so you don’t save anything there. Add to that the time
involved in creating the master spreadsheet and you are way in the hole
time-wise.

The only way I see it saving time would be if judges all had little
hand-helds that stepped them through the scoring sections then linked to
the
main PC to dump their part of the scoring into the mix, automatically
entering the deductions onto the various scoresheets.

I don’t see that happening in the near future, but in ten years, who
knows?

Mark

P.S. I’ll stand out in front of my house and squeeze my fireplace bellows
a
few times toward the east-northeast. I don’t think it will help much
though.
Without snow tires, you would be taking the Jag for a “spin.”

----- Original Message -----
From: “Chris Burdo” cburdo@hotmail.com
To: concours@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2000 1:39 PM
Subject: Re: [concours] Computerized Judging solutions?

Hello Mark,
This is_exactly why I’m asking before I put all the time into
coming
up
with a spreadsheet or a program. I’d hate to spend the entire day
entering
info longer than it would take for someone to just write it on a slip of
paper. Trying to weigh all the options now…There is a program I heard
that
the concours shows use but I’m not sure how that would work out for
non-concours show…but I’ll look into it.I hope all is well with you
and
your family, Happy Holidays. (By the way…I’m freezing up here in the
dead
of winter…got any warmth you could spare so I could take the Jag for a
spin?..(No snow tires on it.:-)) Thanks again.

I’d agree, but when only about 10% of the fields have data, it takes much
longer to tab through the fields and enter amounts than it does to punch the
numbers into a calculator, so I still don’t think it’s going to save any
time.

I chalk this one up in the same category as checkbook programs on the early
PCs. They were functional, but by the time you entered everything twice,
first in the register, then in the program, it was easier to just keep your
balances in the checkbook register.

Mark----- Original Message -----
From: “Pascal Gademer” pascal@pam-trading.com
To: concours@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2000 12:29 PM
Subject: Re: [concours] Computerized Judging solutions?

one of the problem with entering data with a notebook is the lack of
numerical keyboard. Even if you lock the built in numerical zone on the
regular keyboard, it’s not aligned in a natural way and takes longer.

Spreadsheet are not the faster way to enter data, the easiest way would be
in a simple Access form ( or another database ) where the fields are lined
up just like the judging sheet and navigated with the enter key. simple
and
effective . no mouse unless needed, no hunting for cells, etc…

You can then print and mostly export to any format, for the web or to
incoporate into a national database for the web site…

very easy to setup, could also be done in a simple Visual Basic program
using the Access dataformat, freely distributed, no need for MS Access on
each notebook.

Pascal

----- Original Message -----
From: “Mark Stephenson” <@Mark_Stephenson>
To: concours@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2000 12:24 PM
Subject: Re: [concours] Computerized Judging solutions?

Yep, the problem is that most of the cars entered are in such good
condition
that on average, about 90% of the lines on the judging sheet have no
deduction. It takes longer to find the correct cell on the spreadsheet
than
it does to enter the deduction on a calculator, and you have to enter
the
number either way. The judges need the hard copy to know what to check
and
note deductions, so you don’t save anything there. Add to that the time
involved in creating the master spreadsheet and you are way in the hole
time-wise.

The only way I see it saving time would be if judges all had little
hand-helds that stepped them through the scoring sections then linked to
the
main PC to dump their part of the scoring into the mix, automatically
entering the deductions onto the various scoresheets.

I don’t see that happening in the near future, but in ten years, who
knows?

Mark

P.S. I’ll stand out in front of my house and squeeze my fireplace
bellows
a
few times toward the east-northeast. I don’t think it will help much
though.
Without snow tires, you would be taking the Jag for a “spin.”

----- Original Message -----
From: “Chris Burdo” cburdo@hotmail.com
To: concours@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2000 1:39 PM
Subject: Re: [concours] Computerized Judging solutions?

Hello Mark,
This is_exactly why I’m asking before I put all the time into
coming
up
with a spreadsheet or a program. I’d hate to spend the entire day
entering
info longer than it would take for someone to just write it on a slip
of
paper. Trying to weigh all the options now…There is a program I heard
that
the concours shows use but I’m not sure how that would work out for
non-concours show…but I’ll look into it.I hope all is well with you
and
your family, Happy Holidays. (By the way…I’m freezing up here in the
dead
of winter…got any warmth you could spare so I could take the Jag for
a
spin?..(No snow tires on it.:-)) Thanks again.

Computerizing score recording sure seems like a way to complicate a rather
simple exercise. After all how many entries are there in a typical
concours, thirty-forty?" It is just as easy to write down and later add up
scores on the standard scoring sheet as it is to enter them into a computer.
Plus adding a computer to the process now adds an added opportunity for
error in recording the numbers since the scores from the paper sheets would
need to be reentered on a keyboard. Third point: pencils and paper seldom
malfunction and never need rebooted.

Sometimes the low-tech solution is the optimal solution.

Regards, John Walker

On Mon, 25 Dec 2000 01:57:47 +0100 (CET),
owner-concours-digest@jag-lovers.org (Concours Digest) said:

This is_exactly why I'm asking before I put all the time into coming up 

with a spreadsheet or a program. I’d hate to spend the entire day entering
info longer than it would take for someone to just write it on a slip of
paper. Trying to weigh all the options now…There is a program I heard that
the concours shows use but I’m not sure how that would work out for
non-concours show…but I’ll look into it.I hope all is well with you and
your family, Happy Holidays. (By the way…I’m freezing up here in the dead
of winter…got any warmth you could spare so I could take the Jag for a
spin?..(No snow tires on it.:-)) Thanks again.

Here in South Africa, our concours judging is done on computer. Our club’s
committee member in charge of computers wrote a program in dBase or
something. Initial score sheets are entered on paper, and these sheets are
then entered, with comments, into a small network of PCs by 2 or 3 people on
the day. The computer will then print complete score sheets, rack up all the
correct totals etc, and work out the winners in the various categories. Full
results are generally available about an hour or so after judging finishes.

There are some results from 1999 and previous years in the format that
they’re printed in at the club’s web site, http://www.jagclub.co.za .

Graeme–

Graeme Adamson, @Graeme_Adamson

Natural laws have no pity. - L. Long