[concours] More Series II '69 Findings/Questions/HELP!

In my never ending search of what’s “early” and what’s “late,” I had a
chance to go through a US spec, one owner “late” 69 OTS (1R12633; 4R7189;
7R10097-9; KE11343) yesterday and made the following observations that might
assist some and would appreciate your comments/comparisons.

I believe this to be a “late Series II car” for the following reasons:

  1. The bonnet had the previously discussed “rubber strips” riveted in place
    (just in front of the left tire and along the inner wall of the heater intake
    plenum) This is not an air-conditioned car. I know I’ve brought this up
    before but if '69 OTS owners would send me a yea or nay on if they have these
    strips (or brackets/rivets/rivet holes where they were), ALONG WITH YOUR 4R
    AND 1R NUMBERS, I will attempt to come up with an analysis of when in '69
    these strips first started showing up and post it… Or, identify that they
    are they on even the earliest cars. This remains a hard one to nail down.

  2. It has the additional heat shield aft of the alternator ("…later on
    series II production, a second style…," Pg. 195, Haddock).

  3. There is a brake fluid warning label located in the engine compartment,
    on the firewall, driver’s side, above the heater box. ("…some series II
    cars," pg. 164, Haddock).

  4. It has a “late series II air cleaner” (Haddock pg. 189).

  5. It has an oil dip stick with the red insert at the circular handle.
    (Haddock, pg. 186) QUESTION: Are dipsticks with the circular handle but
    missing the red insert not correct? Did all of these models have the insert?

***Other items that caught my attention and that I have not seen discussed in
restoration books include:

  1. The center windshield post was black vs. chromed. (Interestingly, the
    mirror is the glass mounted breakaway type not always found on “late” series
    II cars.)

  2. The oil filter case was green…appreciate other 69 owner’s comparisons
    on this one. Could I have something so obvious wrong on my car? Before
    and after pics show mine was green but got painted gray in the
    restoration…hmmmm…anybody got a paint code?

  3. The radiator cooling fan motors each had a black plastic “guard” mounted
    on them. The guard is mounted to the aft two top nuts of the motor mount.
    The guard was smooth on the bottom and rough on top. First time I’ve seen
    those…anyone else have them?

  4. The EJag, 4.2 and Jaguar emblems on the boot are held on by rubber
    fittings. HELP: I’ve only been able to find plastic replacements…anyone
    have a line on where “originals” are available?

  5. The knobs on the seat recline levers are a long oblong shape (much like
    early series I turn signal levers; pg. 142, Haddock) Question: Anyone have
    an earlier Series II with a different seat recline lever handle?

  6. It has the more flush mounted front side markers vs the more obtrusive as
    seen on pg. 134, Haddock. The rubber gaskets don’t look original. I
    suspect these are not the original side markers.

** There were other clues and some obvious “incorrect” stuff too but this is
probably enough for now. For those who are not interested in this degree of
detail, I hope you’ve hit the delete key by now.

** Oh, yes, it was definitely a “driver”

Bob Hotaling
Orlando, FL

At 11:59 AM 5/22/99 -0400, Bob wrote:=============================

  1. The oil filter case was green…appreciate other 69 owner’s comparisons
    on this one. Could I have something so obvious wrong on my car? Before
    and after pics show mine was green but got painted gray in the
    restoration…hmmmm…anybody got a paint code?
    =============================
    Bob,

I am still out of the country but am still monitoring the List (if I don’t
it takes days to get caught up). I saw your posting above and wanted to
say that I am having a can of Eastwood’s “Mid Green” Hammerite paint (p/n
10028Z) sent along with some Cad paint and other stuff to Tom Curren’s this
week. Should be there by Wed. You are welcome to look at it and even use
it if you think it is the right color. The color chart from the jag-lovers
site:

http://www.jag-lovers.org/e-type/paint.html#component

simply calls it green hammerite and does not list a modern day equivalent.
There is also a Rust-o-leu Lt. Green hammered finish available at Home Depot.

R. Greg Lovingfoss
'64 FHC - "A"cond. driver
'64 OTS - WIP

In a message dated 5/23/99 10:01:44 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
lovingfoss@lovingfoss.com writes:

<< '64 FHC - "A"cond. driver >>

Thanks Greg! I’ll check it out.

Hey, David and I were at Tom’s looking at another car and happened to see
your’s on the lift…are you interested in a front “A” frame that has not
been spiced and welded? I think I still have one left.

bob

At 10:11 AM 5/23/99 -0400, Bob wrote:============================

Hey, David and I were at Tom’s looking at another car and happened to see
your’s on the lift…are you interested in a front “A” frame that has not
been spiced and welded? I think I still have one left.

bob
============================
Hello Bob,

You are referring to my “A” condition driver. Recognizing that while the
differences between a “C”, “B” and “A” condition car are progressive, I
fully realize that the differences between an “A” condition driver and an
“A+” and “Concourse” condition car are EXPONENTIAL, measured in light
years by comparison (this came from a parting-of-the-clouds type revelation
that the remaining 10% of a 90% restoration is greater than the sum of all
of the previous 90%! And also from having seen the magnificent work you
and Dave have done on your own '69 OTS “concourse” condition beauty).

The answer then is YES, can’t have an “A” condition driver without and “A”
condition “A” frame. Please let me know the details off-line.

Thanks,

R. Greg Lovingfoss
'64 FHC - "A"cond. driver
'64 OTS - WIP

Hi, All -

At last year’s club concours, I was faced with some spark plug ends on an
XK-120 that I had not seen before (the ‘end’ being the phenolic connection
between the end of the spark plug wire and the top of the spark plug
itself). These are straight-through connections (not to be confused with
the right-angle ones as fitted to the production XKE which say “Champion”
on the top surface).

The units with which I am NOT familiar are identified in the Spare Parts
Catalog for Jaguar XK120, Publication J8, Published February, 1958, Plate
B, Item B.109, Part Number C.1575, fitted from engine W.1001 to W.6696, and
Part Number C.4982, fitted to engine W.6697 and beyond. One of these, and
I’m not sure which, appears to be a simple bent-metal spring clamp. The
other is an item of question - It was claimed last year that a spark plug
end with the word “Champion” printed on a flat horizontal ring (when viewed
in the installed position) was a legitimate XK-120 spark plug end.

I AM familiar with the item identified in the Spare Parts Catalog for
Jaguar XK.140 (yes, a period, not a hyphen or dash), Publication J.15,
Published July, 1955, Plate F, Item F.83, Part Number C.5479, and are black
phenolic with milling around the outside, concentric with the major axis,
with no identification as to manufacturer or otherwise on the unit.

My club concours is in two weeks, and, as a responsible judge, I would like
to be able to be best equipped to make an accurate and better-informed
decision, should the question arise this year (as it inevitably will!).

Any experience or guidance would be appreciated!

Thanx! in advance!

Larry Schear
Twin Cam, Inc.

In a message dated 99-05-22 12:09:01 EDT, Bob wrote:

Q 1. The bonnet had the previously discussed “rubber strips” riveted in
place
(just in front of the left tire and along the inner wall of the heater
intake
plenum) This is not an air-conditioned car. I know I’ve brought this up
before but if '69 OTS owners would send me a yea or nay on if they have
these
strips (or brackets/rivets/rivet holes where they were), ALONG WITH YOUR 4R
AND 1R NUMBERS, I will attempt to come up with an analysis of when in '69
these strips first started showing up and post it… Or, identify that
they
are they on even the earliest cars. This remains a hard one to nail down.

A: My 2+2 has the rubber strips as you describe. Build date is January 27,
1969, VIN 1R40996

Q 5. It has an oil dip stick with the red insert at the circular handle.
(Haddock, pg. 186) QUESTION: Are dipsticks with the circular handle but
missing the red insert not correct? Did all of these models have the insert?

A: I have the circular handle with no red insert. One of the 4 previous
owners could have lost the insert or replaced the dipstick so I don’t know
what is actually correct.

Q 3. The radiator cooling fan motors each had a black plastic “guard”
mounted
on them. The guard is mounted to the aft two top nuts of the motor mount.
The guard was smooth on the bottom and rough on top. First time I’ve seen
those…anyone else have them?

A: I have nothing like this on mine.

Q 5. The knobs on the seat recline levers are a long oblong shape (much like
early series I turn signal levers; pg. 142, Haddock) Question: Anyone have
an earlier Series II with a different seat recline lever handle?

A: I don’t have any “knobs” Just the flat lever, rounded on the end.

Q 6. It has the more flush mounted front side markers vs the more obtrusive
as
seen on pg. 134, Haddock. The rubber gaskets don’t look original. I
suspect these are not the original side markers.

A: My understanding, from Tom at British Auto USA, is that the more
obtrusive markers are correct and that the flatter ones are from the XJ6.
and are identical except for height. I checked my lenses are they indicate
they were manufactured in 1969.

Hope this helps, Regards
John Walker 69 2+2

Larry,
I am not familiar with the “bent metal” plug wire end which you believe
to possibly be one of the two listed in the 120 Parts book. I had been
told that the difference between the “standard” and “racing” wire end
was the fact that the racing terminal had a set screw in the side to
clamp onto a short length of stripped plug wire in contrast to the
standard type with its internal wood-type screw which threaded into the
wire core of the square-cut plug wire end.

That being said, my 52 SE OTS (Eng # W5598-8S) came with the slender
black phenolic/bakelite ends which threaded into the plug wire (as you
described for the XK140). I further have come to believe that the wire
ends with the wide flange containing the Champion label are not
authentic for XKs. I had never seen that style until the mid 1980’s when
they were offered for sale by a British supplier. A friend bought some
for me during a trip to England, shortly thereafter, I got criticized
for using them on my restored 120 FHC. I have never seen the wide
Champion labeled ends on what were considered to be original cars.

Someone may be able to shed some additional light on this topic and tell
us how it is really supposed to be. Incidentally, Moss Motors currently
sells the aforementioned slender black wire (racing?) ends with the side
wire set screw. The set screws cannot be seen if they are positioned to
face the rear of the engine.

Regards,
Dick Cavicke
Chief Judge San Diego Jaguar Club

Bob:

I agree with everthing that John says below except that I do have the black
plastic shields above the cooling fan motors. The remnants (stubs) of
these were present on my early 69 FHC (1R25820 manf. 18 Feb 1969) and
several years ago I bought a rotted out even earlier but orginal 69 OTS
(1R8413) which I later sold. It had a complete plastic shield which I
traced and made new ones from an old Weller soldering gun case. One is the
reverse of the other so one can be turned over and traced to give the other
one. The material is black and rough or dotted on one side and smooth on
the other just like the soldering gun case and about the same thickness. I
still have the orginal one and would be glad to send you or anyone else a
tracing of the shield if you want to make them yourself.

By the way, 1R8413 had the chrome cam cover nuts on the forward and upper
most can cover hold down instead of the Phillips head bolts present on
1R25820 and later 69s.

I also do have the red insert in the oil dipstick. These are still
available as I believe I replaced mine at one time.

Bob Reid

At 09:10 PM 5/23/99 EDT, you wrote:

In a message dated 99-05-22 12:09:01 EDT, Bob wrote:

Q 1. The bonnet had the previously discussed “rubber strips” riveted in
place
(just in front of the left tire and along the inner wall of the heater
intake
plenum) This is not an air-conditioned car. I know I’ve brought this up
before but if '69 OTS owners would send me a yea or nay on if they have
these
strips (or brackets/rivets/rivet holes where they were), ALONG WITH YOUR 4R
AND 1R NUMBERS, I will attempt to come up with an analysis of when in '69
these strips first started showing up and post it… Or, identify that
they
are they on even the earliest cars. This remains a hard one to nail
down.

A: My 2+2 has the rubber strips as you describe. Build date is January 27,
1969, VIN 1R40996

Q 5. It has an oil dip stick with the red insert at the circular handle.
(Haddock, pg. 186) QUESTION: Are dipsticks with the circular handle but
missing the red insert not correct? Did all of these models have the
insert?

A: I have the circular handle with no red insert. One of the 4 previous
owners could have lost the insert or replaced the dipstick so I don’t know
what is actually correct.

Q 3. The radiator cooling fan motors each had a black plastic “guard”
mounted
on them. The guard is mounted to the aft two top nuts of the motor mount.
The guard was smooth on the bottom and rough on top. First time I’ve seen
those…anyone else have them?

A: I have nothing like this on mine.

Q 5. The knobs on the seat recline levers are a long oblong shape (much
like
early series I turn signal levers; pg. 142, Haddock) Question: Anyone
have> an earlier Series II with a different seat recline lever handle?

A: I don’t have any “knobs” Just the flat lever, rounded on the end.

Q 6. It has the more flush mounted front side markers vs the more obtrusive
as
seen on pg. 134, Haddock. The rubber gaskets don’t look original. I
suspect these are not the original side markers.

A: My understanding, from Tom at British Auto USA, is that the more
obtrusive markers are correct and that the flatter ones are from the XJ6.
and are identical except for height. I checked my lenses are they indicate
they were manufactured in 1969.

Hope this helps, Regards
John Walker 69 2+2