Decreasing Displacement

Yep…it has “onboard” oxygen which assists combustion…
I just had a look at the Rolls Royce Trent high bypass turbo fan engine specs. That beast delivers 44 TONNES of thrust at take off power and weighs 7.5 tonnes. Allow another 1 tonne for some framing and a bit of fuel and the whole she-bang will perform a 1/4 mile in about 4 seconds!!!
And…it would do hundreds or thousands of “runs” without having to be pulled to bits…
Ya really gotta compare apples with apples…
Engineers could design a wheeled device to propel a human from standstill at the maximum force that a human body could withstand before critical bits were damaged…but it wouldn’t involve an old fashioned internal combustion engine.

let see, i think i mentioned that TF Engine can actually fit in a normal car,its just (simple V8 ) not some monster Jet engine the size of a house!

and the King was Don Garlits of Florida(i raced him in 1963, only lost by half of the track).

NitroM. make its own Qxygen during combustion that is quite slow burning! lot of piston push that keeps expanding, lasts long time even after exhaust valve opens.

it uses the blower to pump the fuel into the cylinders, mixed with very little air that initiates combustion!

cost back when DG was 1st using Nitro cost was around $30. bucks a drum(55 gal.),1955/56.

in 1965 my cost was $80 bucks about !, today its is not easily available because it can make very BIG bombs(lots of paper work etc).
China makes most of the worlds NitroM, and last i heard was around $3000/5000 per drum!

quick history of the MAN DG, he 1st used old Junkyard Chrysler hemi $50 bucks apiece, bought im by the bunchs.

now back around 1955 some super smart GB/UK math theory guy said his calculations NO vehicle propelled by 2 wheel drive will EVER go faster than 150MPH…LOL, in 1/4 mile. so much for math and all its BS.

exactly 1 month later DG went 155MPH. he never looked back broke many early records by the dozen!

his 1st Nitro engine had no blower , just 8 /2 barrel Stromberg carburators, trying to make engine tune right , found it needed more fuel , after many trys he just removed completly all the Main and extra JETS ,ran the engine without any carburator Jets at all,to finally make the 155 mph.

but he almost got beat in California, they where starting to use old GMC Diesel blowers, came back next year and blew them all into the weeds, with a blower!

my 1st time to see him was 1958, Sanford Maine airport, unbelievable went 180 MPH 1/4 mile , smoking the slicks right off the car untill he let off the pedal!

WIGS pretty much nailed ,what he said!

OK lets get real , all this drag race stuff like TP NitroM , was done by great imagination USA American HOT RODDERS, nothing from UK ,Germany, Japan, ETC>

but believe it or not a Russian / Hungarian guy (Marvin Ritchfen) in Boston Massachusetts , made DG tyres ,

and made the 1st experimental drag Slicks to push DG to top 200 MPH 1/4 mile! before that slicks would just spin out of control well past 1/4 mile,untill you let up

Don stopped driving serious racing when he made a sub 6sec run and they had to help him out of car, he said when he popped the shoot the G impact almost took his eyeballs out, lost some vision for a while!

ron

Look up John Stapp who, on a sled, broke the Land speed record of 1954 and decelerated with over 46g; stepped out and declared there was probably more possible!
That is 632mph to 0 in 1.4 seconds. Dark eyes and impaired vision due to bleeding were considered… normal in testing. Such as broken ribs and wrists.
Did society get ‘weaker’ or did we simply run out of needs and energy to do such experiments or races?

The TF engine has a more compact size and less ‘cubics’ than a jet engine, but there are also very quick jet cars, right?
I actually doubt that a rocket would have much of a advantage on acceleration. But a rocket driven turbo pump connected to the wheels probably would!

David that is not remotly REAListic. course every one has a rocket sled in there backyard garage?

we may as well jump into ,Quantum time space continuum, time travel etc?

be at the end of 1/4 mile in .00001 sec, maybe before the light comes on youd be there!

i may as well try, what i think early drag hot rod guys did(i am one starting in 1949),.

old American car guys did things , while never knowing IT CAN BE DONE, so they up and DID it anyway!

Don’t tell me a top fuel dragster is anything but rocket science!
If racing keeps evolving there’s no end to it. But that will be another engine class at minimum.

By the way: do they simply stick with V8s out of tradition or would a 12 with gigantic crankshaft or say a deltic train engine have significant disadvantages (cost, weight, fragility…) making the V8 ideal?

they did things with little to nothing to do with Math,and no rocket science(that they were aware of). they just used there spirit given LOGIC!

NO they had little money, DG bought used Junkyard Chrysler Hemi V8s for $50 bucks each , sent the word out local yards he was lookin for them,nobody wanted them Gas hogs!

it is unbelievable what those old engines led to today, that basic engine was designed in WW2 as a tank engine, .

and that silly Napier Deltic was stolen from Germany after WW2. using much tech from the German JUMO 205 engine.

i dont know how they did it , the last of the Jumo 205/07, engine made 1 HP per pound of weight ,(like 1200HP at 1200 lbs weight). Diesel.
there today some small usable opposed piston engine being made, mostly light aircraft!

Not silly: Napier actually solved s basic issue and made the Deltic a very good design.

wigs you really think the brits are gonna tell us.

i’m speaking of the TECH related to the Jumo diesel engine!

it was after the war that they used captured technologies, same with Russians, and of course USA and Rocket/Nuclear technologies.

but thats the name of the game!

Do ya wanna go FAST or doncha?

https://www.vintagekarts.com/Rockets/Rockets.htm

i do remember those things, Crazy stuff! company didnt last long,BANNED>

i seen one at a race track the noise was dangerous (ears hurt), along with sometimes blowing and spreading SHRAPNEL in every direction!

ron

Cascadr, along in this thread, i mentioned engine weight VS HP, the last series of JUMO 205/07 made 1200 hp, and weighed in around 1200lbs. run continuos at rated HP.

so all we have to do is make an engine that makes hp equal to its weight in lbs.

ron

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Or…

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My old DynaJet powered control line speed plane that I last flew in probably 1961. The engine weighted 17 Oz and produced 4.25 lbs. of thrust. A few years ago, after sitting for 40+ years, I pulled the head, polished the reed valve, hooked up my started(Model T coil)and it fired on the 3rd or 4th pump!
Bob

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Wow!!! A baby V1Doodlebug!! Pulse jet powered. I tried to build one once but the spring steel reed valve was problematic.
How did you stop it???

Control line? Did you get dizzy spinning around?

That plane still had the old two line system which was at least 10 MPH slower then the then newer monoline system making the plane uncompetitive at the 145MPH that it consistently flew. Today the record for this class of model planes is something over 200 MPH on 70’ lines and yes you can get dizzy, especially at first even flying a 60MPH stunt model airplane!
Bob

Thisis what 200 MPH involves flying a model jet. You don’t let these engines run without flying for more then a few as they rapidly become red and then I suppose white hot! to stop them you just pinch the fuel line.

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wow , has this thread drifted off OP .

must be me ,i look at an engine as something that close to being useful, like doing some work or transporting something!
sometime back the military would dyno test engines, one that was interesting ,fire up and put a load on it, bring it up to rated RPM and HP , and run it for 24hrs steady.

altho engines to serve as intertainment /toys are fun , but would not find much use in the real world or a war situation!

again the new DRONES are being tested all the time and advancements are happening every day!

back around 2003 me and wife were traveling MH in Nevada and on state rd 50, she is using binnoculars just checkin out the hills and valleys, absolutly nothing on the hiway, NO traffic, she said there must some TV around here ,on that hillside there is a dish antenna ,opps there are more of them,what you say.

i pull over of road side, and took a look , out of nowhere , came a HUMMER two Military guys get out with M16s, whoa, wanted to see my papers , after talkin with base, said get going and dont stop for next 20 miles,WHEW>

that evening back at camp ground i ask desk about it ,AREA51, he said they always testing something!

1 year later 2004 TV news , pix of new DRONE. but around 2007 OSHKOSH air show Wisconsin, they had a drone,1st time i seen a real one, lots interest, Now kool, the attendent said if you guys are around 3.00 PM , it will take off , after it was in flight, he said the Pilot is sitting in Nevada flying it GPS etc.
by the way mil.drones are BIG ,lot bigger than you may think!

and he talked about drones so small the you can hardly see them and almost silent and they can fly inside buildings to see whats happening, without being detected!!

but i dont think they are toys!!

anyway more useless information!
ron

I have been just consumed trying take in all the info from this thread: a stupid question I’m glad I asked. Lol

Looking at the engine as power to weight isn’t actually something I had done yet: I was more thinking of it in terms of purely a series of cylinders, and only thinking about displacement vs volumetric efficiency.

I see the 1:1 power to weight ratio and thing Koenigzegg right away though.

That Napier Engine is amazing, perhaps I’m too young to have know about them but very interesting to read about!

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