[E-Type] air conditioning

I have a 1969, 2+2, with air conditioning. It blows air, but it’s not cold.
I have been told that it may “need a charge”. I was also told it is
expensive to charge, and the material is damaging to the ozone. Does anyone
have any input on 1) how to get the a/c to blow cold air, 2) the cost of
recharging, and 3) the impact on the atmosphere?________________________________________________________________________
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In a message dated 4/30/00 8:52:28 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
holtian143@hotmail.com writes:

<< I have a 1969, 2+2, with air conditioning. It blows air, but it’s not
cold.
I have been told that it may “need a charge”. I was also told it is
expensive to charge, and the material is damaging to the ozone. Does anyone
have any input on 1) how to get the a/c to blow cold air, 2) the cost of
recharging, and 3) the impact on the atmosphere? >>
You didn’t even a name, but you certainly invited a subject of high debate.
Yes, it “May need a charge”, but I would not put money on that being all it
needed. If it just needs a charge, there’s a reason. The hands down
simplist problem if luck was really with you would be a freon leak. Now is
not the time for a “patch” job. Take the car to a REAL classic jag Mechanic
(not an A/C place) and have them go over the A/C system. The subject of
freon is and always has been controversial. Your car, like all cars 'till the
mid to late '80’s used R12 refridgerant. “Studies” said R12 was damaging our
upper atmosphere (ozone layer), so Dupont developed the new R134 Refridgerant
to replace R12 (with me so far?). Now our wonderful government could put the
squeeze on millions of folks by limiting the sale of R12 PLUS put a thousand
percent tax on it. A pound of R12 wholesales now for approx 22 dollars a
pound (used to be a buck) and R12 retails for at least double that. Duponts
R134 costs a fraction of this and is easier to obtain (it’s also all you will
see in the future). You cannot go sticking R134 in your sustem though. The
molecular structure is smaller and it’ll leak out. Instead, have the
mechanic replace all the seals and O-rings and after fixing the initial
problem (while at it, have the shop remove the old york-type compressor and
install a highly efficient and inexpensive Sanden rotary unit), & pump the
system up with R134. Your entire cost will be the same as trying to keep R12
in the system and you’ll benefit from much better reliability.
OH! THe controversey is that Dupont lost their exclusive patent on R12 years
ago, wasn’t making enough money on R12 anymore, created the highly subjective
issue of R12 being damaging and thus created the “Greener” R134 along with a
patent, of course. What the heck was our government’s concern to seek the
truth if they now had another great method of collecting Billions of more
dollars in taxation Revenue.
IMHO,
Keith Headley

Try;

http://www.xke-lovers.com/acinfo/airmenu.htm
LLoyd

randy olson wrote:>

I have a 1969, 2+2, with air conditioning. It blows air, but it’s not cold.
I have been told that it may “need a charge”. I was also told it is
expensive to charge, and the material is damaging to the ozone. Does anyone
have any input on 1) how to get the a/c to blow cold air, 2) the cost of
recharging, and 3) the impact on the atmosphere?

I have a 1969, 2+2, with air conditioning. It blows air, but it’s not cold.
I have been told that it may “need a charge”. I was also told it is
expensive to charge, and the material is damaging to the ozone. Does anyone
have any input on 1) how to get the a/c to blow cold air, 2) the cost of
recharging, and 3) the impact on the atmosphere?


Around here, in Minnesota, the recharge is about $80-$100. The ozone
issue is moot because the shop pulls the old R12 into a holding tank
and it’s disposed of instead of vented to atmosphere.On Sun, 30 Apr 2000 08:51:10 EDT, you wrote:

In a message dated 4/30/00 10:44:14 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
soothsayer@redshift.com writes:

<< Try;

http://www.xke-lovers.com/acinfo/airmenu.htm
LLoyd

Darn LLoyd, wished I’d known of this site before I spent 20 minutes writing
my long desertation. I still highly regard the Sanden compressors though.
You feel no Engine power difference or decrease whatsoever. At the moment,
I’m trying to create an effective way to hang an additional A/C supply vent
on the LEFT side of the steering column. :slight_smile:
Keith Headley
'71 SII OTS A/C but almost useless in Florida
'80 TR8 Drop Head Coupe (R134 changeout)
'80 TR7 Drop Head Coupe (who needs A/C anyway)
'54 Beechcraft Bonanza (at 10,000 ft and 200MPH, A/C is moot point)

In a message dated 4/30/00 9:03:48 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
holtian143@hotmail.com writes:

I have a 1969, 2+2, with air conditioning. It blows air, but it’s not
cold.
I have been told that it may “need a charge”. I was also told it is
expensive to charge, and the material is damaging to the ozone. Does
anyone

have any input on 1) how to get the a/c to blow cold air, 2) the cost of
recharging, and 3) the impact on the atmosphere?

Randy,

Wasn’t there an interesting thread on this subject a few months ago,
including quite a diatribe on atmospheric impact from Terry “Dundee”? It
might be worth looking up in the archive. (BTW, does everyone else miss
Terry’s contributions to this List as much as I do? I wonder how he is doing
in Texas?)

I recently had the a/c in my XJ6 rebuilt with CFC-free refrigerant when I
needed a new compressor anyway. For about $1200, much of which was for the
compressor, I now have a really well-functioning unit without the potential
for high cost when recharging is required, and the environment is safe, FWIW.
(I know of at least one restorer of note who has stockpiled freon in order
to service his customers into the future without necessitating rebuilds,
because he believes freon will eventually be impossible to get.)

Regards,
Warren

Not to mention that the new refrigerants are green house gases and are
toxic.
BTW: A common source of leaks is the seal on the compressor shaft.
Oil which travels with the refrigerant lubricates the seal. When the a/c
isn’t used for a long time the seal can dry up allowing the refrigierant
to leak out. That is why we are told to run the a/c every couple of
weeks even in the winter. The computer on new vehicles does this
automaticly

Ian

N23998@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 4/30/00 8:52:28 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
holtian143@hotmail.com writes:

<< I have a 1969, 2+2, with air conditioning. It blows air, but it’s not
cold.
I have been told that it may “need a charge”. I was also told it is
expensive to charge, and the material is damaging to the ozone. Does anyone
have any input on 1) how to get the a/c to blow cold air, 2) the cost of
recharging, and 3) the impact on the atmosphere? >>

If it is the original A/C you have R-12. It can be recharged at about
$40.00 a pound. You can usually tell if it is low by watching the site
glass which is usually on or near the dryer which is a small black
cannister. Your best check is to have someone put a set of guages on
the system. Also you could have a clogged dryer, clogged expansion
valve or a leak. R-12 by law must be rcovered and can be recycled. It
has the best cooling properties but is no longer being made in this
country. Some people have gone to Mexico and bough it there only to
discover that it was contaminated.
R-12 can be rplaced by R-134. To do so the system has to be purged and
in most cases the rubber seals in the lins replaced with a different
material. A good A/C shop (at least in my area) will do the job for
$350-$400.

You didn’t even a name, but you certainly invited a subject of high debate.
Yes, it “May need a charge”, but I would not put money on that being all it
needed. If it just needs a charge, there’s a reason. The hands down
simplist problem if luck was really with you would be a freon leak. Now is
not the time for a “patch” job. Take the car to a REAL classic jag Mechanic
(not an A/C place) and have them go over the A/C system.

I do not understan why you would not use a good A/C shop. In most cases
they are the experts on A/C.

The subject of

freon is and always has been controversial.
OH! THe controversey is that Dupont lost their exclusive patent on R12 years
ago, wasn’t making enough money on R12 anymore, created the highly subjective
issue of R12 being damaging and thus created the “Greener” R134 along with a
patent, of course. What the heck was our government’s concern to seek the
truth if they now had another great method of collecting Billions of more
dollars in taxation Revenue.
IMHO,
Keith Headley

R-12 is a CFC and has been shown by scientific studies to be damaging to
the ozone layer. That is a fact.
The EPA got congress to enact legislation banning R-12.
The Dupont rumor you cite is just that.

David Underwood
Member: Yousemite Committee
Sierra Club.
Yosemite Task force Chair
Angeles Chapter, Sierra Club.–


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Notice: Spelling mistrakes left in for people who
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In a message dated 4/30/00 4:17:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
davidlkayp@earthlink.net writes:

<< I do not understan why you would not use a good A/C shop. In most cases
they are the experts on A/C.

The subject of

freon is and always has been controversial.
OH! THe controversey is that Dupont lost their exclusive patent on R12
years
ago, wasn’t making enough money on R12 anymore, created the highly
subjective
issue of R12 being damaging and thus created the “Greener” R134 along with
a
patent, of course. What the heck was our government’s concern to seek the
truth if they now had another great method of collecting Billions of more
dollars in taxation Revenue.
IMHO,
Keith Headley

R-12 is a CFC and has been shown by scientific studies to be damaging to
the ozone layer. That is a fact.
The EPA got congress to enact legislation banning R-12.
The Dupont rumor you cite is just that.

David, I left out the entire “Diatribe” (neat word!) :). Much of it just
takes space, but I did want to reply to your questioning of my comments. You
are correct regarding a “good” A/C shop. This is a bit biased perhaps, but
I’ve found many more honest Jaguar shops than A/C shops, so I just tried to
“Keep it simple”. Plus a mechanic who knows our cars , IMHO, will be more
familiar with the antiquated and unsual system not to mention how to properly
remove the receiver, dryer, and evaporator without doing unjust damage.
Regarding Dupont, being an Environmental Consultant myself, I staid on top of
the concerns, facts, and stories during the fallout several years ago and you
can’t deny Dupont and the feds took FULL advantage of the situation. R12 is
damaging to a degree, but indeed there are far more damaging substances that
don’t get the attention R12 got. I still believe Dupont did all they could
to not only create a replacement (which is terrific), but I still believe
they took an active part in the quick banning of R12. I also don’t intend to
get into an online debate over this subjective (as well as factual) issue.
Thanks for listening.
Keith Headley

Just today I refilled my car with one of the last two cans of r12 that
I have been hording for fifteen years. This was my Ford.
I converted my “E” to r-134a, put in a new compressor, replaced 2
hoses, and spent about $120. on the whole thing. Methinks you were
swindled on the compressor.
LLoyd

Han85xj6@aol.com wrote:>

I recently had the a/c in my XJ6 rebuilt with CFC-free refrigerant when I
needed a new compressor anyway. For about $1200, much of which was for the
compressor, I now have a really well-functioning unit without the potential
for high cost when recharging is required, and the environment is safe, FWIW.
(I know of at least one restorer of note who has stockpiled freon in order
to service his customers into the future without necessitating rebuilds,
because he believes freon will eventually be impossible to get.)

Regards,
Warren

Yes, run it about ten minutes at least once a month…
LLoyd

ian wrote:> …

isn’t used for a long time the seal can dry up allowing the refrigierant
to leak out. That is why we are told to run the a/c every couple of
weeks even in the winter. The computer on new vehicles does this
automaticly

Ian

In a message dated 4/30/00 9:02:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
soothsayer@redshift.com writes:

I converted my “E” to r-134a, put in a new compressor, replaced 2
hoses, and spent about $120. on the whole thing. Methinks you were
swindled on the compressor.

Lloyd,

Methinks you may be right! But here are my costs (you sent me back to my
invoice, which was almost exactly 4 years ago - - longer than I thought):

$ 289.00 a/c compressor
87.00 suction hose ass’y
77.00 high pressure hose ass’y
97.50 receiver dryer
98.00 freon & oil
185.00 flush a/c system, remove R-12, etc.
180.00 labor____________
1,013.50 total

This work was done by a source recommended by a Jaguar Specialist whom I no
longer use because he is too expensive, and I had no success finding an a/c
specialist who would tackle a Jaguar system. Sooooo . . . at least I have
had a very satisfactory system since the work was done.

On to the next expense!
Warren

After rebuillding the front end of PrtyKty, I took her in to the Jag
dealer to have them adjust the torsion bars. Thought it would take just
a couple hours, since I just had everything apart. You can imagine my
shock to get a bill of around $550.00!
LLoyd

Han85xj6@aol.com wrote:>

Lloyd,

Methinks you may be right! But here are my costs (you sent me back to my
invoice, which was almost exactly 4 years ago - - longer than I thought):

$ 289.00 a/c compressor
87.00 suction hose ass’y…

At 05:51 PM 4/30/2000 -0700, you wrote:

Just today I refilled my car with one of the last two cans of r12 that
I have been hording for fifteen years. This was my Ford.
I converted my “E” to r-134a, put in a new compressor, replaced 2
hoses, and spent about $120. on the whole thing. Methinks you were
swindled on the compressor.
LLoyd

Perhaps you have the part numbers for the compressor ?

Thanks MT

Sorry, don’t. Found it in one of our suppliers fliers, it was on
sale. So just bought it instead of checking out the old one.
LLoud

Major Tom wrote:> …

Perhaps you have the part numbers for the compressor ?

Thanks MT