[E-Type] covered headlight conversion

In reply to a message from 66alfa_gtv sent Wed 1 Jul 2015:

I suggest you sell your car to someone who’ll appreciate it for
what it is.–
The original message included these comments:

I’m a product designer, so it’s tough for me to look at the
uncovered lights and learn to accept them.


Nick Saltarelli '68 Cdn mkt E-type S1� OTS, '54 XK120SE OTS
Niagara, Ontario, Canada
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In reply to a message from mouton sent Wed 1 Jul 2015:

Hi Guys
I fitted the Walsheim kit a year ago, and used the sealant
around the trim that he suggested.

Wurth saBesto - Glass sealant DAB-off -
product no 0890 100 043 - L

It is a very useful sealant in that it never cures hard,
rather it simply forms a semi hard skin over the product,
but overall retains its flexibility.
So far not a drop of water inside the rims.
I have also used it to seal scuttle pieces together.–
The original message included these comments:

I would suggest not using dum-dum (if what you have over
there is what we have here, a 3M product). I used it to


Mark Brown 71 S3 Etype
Ohope beach, New Zealand
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In reply to a message from LLoyd (a rithmetician) sent Wed 1 Jul 2015:

Yes LLoyd, and I gave it to you from my 3O year old stock!
I used it all over my Chrysler to seal tail light lenses
etc. and have not had a melting problem even in Texas-(and
that’s on a white car also) in the summer time. My old
stuff cold have been of higher quality than currently
available as it was OEM dumdum in the 70’s.–
The original message included these comments:

Wow, I used it to help seal the hole/two hoses for the A/C where it goes into the cabin. Guess it’s cooler there.


Mike Moore 63 S1 OTS #878877
Morgan Hill, California, United States
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In reply to a message from Mike Moore sent Thu 2 Jul 2015:

OK, I have to respond to this:

‘‘I suggest you sell your car to someone who’ll appreciate
it for
what it is.’’

I turned 50 this year. For 46 years, I have wanted an
E-type more than any other car. I have very fond memories
of my Matchbox E-type, which got the ball rolling. Over the
past ten years, work and other things have kept me from
getting one of these cars. Finally, the wife and I decided
it was time. We are far from wealthy, but saved enough
money to get the Jag…barely. As you all are aware, the
prices of these cars have risen greatly and appear to
continue down this path. I really wanted a series I with
covered lights, but could not find one in my price range.
So, we settled on our series 1.25 - a 32k mile car in great
shape with everything I wanted (except those damn lights).
It’s the only detail I’m not happy with, so to say I don’t
appreciate the car is hugely inaccurate.–
66alfa_gtv
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In reply to a message from Mike Moore sent Thu 2 Jul 2015:

Mike,

I didn’t know I had a melting problem either – until I
took things apart in the hot sun. Try it!

Jerry–
The original message included these comments:

I used it all over my Chrysler to seal tail light lenses
etc. and have not had a melting problem even in Texas-(and
that’s on a white car also) in the summer time. My old


Jerry Mouton '64 FHC 889791 ‘MIK Jaguar’
Palo Alto, California, United States
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In reply to a message from 66alfa_gtv sent Thu 2 Jul 2015:

More than half the S1� cars in XKEDATA that feature photos
of the bonnet have been converted to covered headlights. I
think around 20% of the S1� cars too. I’ve seriously
considered doing the conversion as well, thinking better of
it and leaving well enough alone. I’ve owned my car for 33
years. I don’t object to your preference for covered
headlights nor your plans to do a conversion. Go ahead. It’s
your car, after all. But do you really not expect pushback
from those of us who own and prefer the open headlight
variant S1 cars when you post how much you dislike them?

The best conversion kit I’m aware of is offered by Chuck
Hadley of Monocoque Metalworks. You’ll need to source the
chrome and glass from one of the usuals but Hadley’s kit
will give you a bonnet that’s virtually identical to the S1.
Regardless, I have to agree with Chuck Hadley’s assessment
of the S1 vs S1 headlight treatment:

''A couple of years ago, I had 2 dead bonnets sitting outside
of the shop for a couple weeks, waiting to be taken apart to
save the inner valances. One was a '63 and one was a '68.
And after seeing them every day side by side, I determined
that the '68 just had a better shape overall. And with their
body-colored scoop, and minimal trim, ‘68s probably have the
best lines around the headlamps. So, actually, I can see why
they ditched the covered headlights for safety reasons, and
I think they did a pretty good job with the ‘68.’’

Series 1 Covered Headlamp Conversion Flanges | Monocoque Metalworks> I’m a product designer, so it’s tough for me to look at

the uncovered lights and learn to accept them.


The original message included these comments:

shape with everything I wanted (except those damn lights).
It’s the only detail I’m not happy with, so to say I don’t
appreciate the car is hugely inaccurate.


Nick Saltarelli '68 Cdn mkt E-type S1� OTS, '54 XK120SE OTS
Niagara, Ontario, Canada
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In reply to a message from N�ck sent Thu 2 Jul 2015:

Dear Nick,
I have nothing against Monocoque Metalworks, but what they sell is
a couple of sheet metal flanges and it’s up to you to weld them
into your own bonnet, lead load and then respray. It’d be
certainly misleading to call it ‘‘a kit’’. If the welding etc were
within the skills base of the purchaser, then they would be 90% of
the way to doing all of that themselves anyway and no ‘‘kit’’
purchase would be necessary. The whole point of a kit is that it
reaches to 90% who don’t want to weld, filler and paint from
scratch and it’ll be relatively straightforward to fit using only
commonly available tools. I’d say that they are appealing to a
different target audience.

kind regards
Marek–
v12 E-type running MS3/3X sequential lpg and petrol
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In reply to a message from MarekH sent Thu 2 Jul 2015:

I agree, Marek. I am differentiating a true S1 retrofit from
a modification. One can’t achieve the former without some
serious body and paint work. The kit on offer by Hadley
includes the correct contour flanges, headlight diaphragms
and sugar scoops.

Regardless, a mod offers two advantages over the conversion
beyond the effort and expense. S1s are more valuable than
S1�s and S1�s, but I’m not convinced a converted S1�/� is
worth more than an original. Arguably less depending on
condition and collectability. A mod is a reversible option,
so arguably value-added. The other advantage is an improved
aesthetic, as already noted above. If you’re going to have a
non-original car it might just as well look better than the
S1 treatment.

Do you intend to extend your offering to owners of the
earlier open headlight cars?–
Nick Saltarelli '68 Cdn mkt E-type S1� OTS, '54 XK120SE OTS
Niagara, Ontario, Canada
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The Jaguar bulletins say they changed it “for better access to the
headlamps”. Hard to argue with that :slight_smile: The story goes that it was
done for '68 federal requirements but was done 6 months or so before
the federalized cars appeared in the middle of the '67 model year so
there was something else at play here, anybody know for sure? “My”
speculation is Lyons saw an opportunity and took it. There were
documented claims of poor lighting, they eliminated the glass and
chrome trim, which from comments here are a headache to install. They
saved money on parts, time on the assembly line and improved lighting
by one modification which was going to be mandatory for '68 anyway. I
think this was too good of an idea for Sir William to pass.
pauls

More than half the S1ź cars in XKEDATA that feature photos
of the bonnet have been converted to covered headlights. I
think around 20% of the S1˝ cars too. I’ve seriously
considered doing the conversion as well, thinking better of
it and leaving well enough alone. I’ve owned my car for 33
years. I don’t object to your preference for covered
headlights nor your plans to do a conversion. Go ahead. It’s
your car, after all. But do you really not expect pushback
from those of us who own and prefer the open headlight
variant S1 cars when you post how much you dislike them?

The best conversion kit I’m aware of is offered by Chuck
Hadley of Monocoque Metalworks. You’ll need to source the
chrome and glass from one of the usuals but Hadley’s kit
will give you a bonnet that’s virtually identical to the S1.
Regardless, I have to agree with Chuck Hadley’s assessment
of the S1 vs S1 headlight treatment:

''A couple of years ago, I had 2 dead bonnets sitting outside
of the shop for a couple weeks, waiting to be taken apart to
save the inner valances. One was a '63 and one was a '68.
And after seeing them every day side by side, I determined
that the '68 just had a better shape overall. And with their
body-colored scoop, and minimal trim, ‘68s probably have the
best lines around the headlamps. So, actually, I can see why
they ditched the covered headlights for safety reasons, and
I think they did a pretty good job with the ‘68.’’

<<<<<<<<<<<<From: “Níck” stellar-plain@sympatico.ca
Subject: Re: [E-Type] covered headlight conversion


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In reply to a message from N�ck sent Thu 2 Jul 2015:

Dear Nick,

I’d need to have a s1 car bonnet to play with, so it’d be difficult
to get anywhere without one as I only have a s3 car. The curvature
of the single piece rims is very tight at the 6 o’clock position
and if this is any tighter a turn at the apex then that’d be a
problem. Neither Jaguar nor the Wahl kit attempted to bend metal
around that part of the curve using such a thin casting. The
problem is that the outside of the curve is stretched a lot and the
inside is compressed a lot and that is hard to do right over a
curved surface in one take.

kind regards
Marek–
The original message included these comments:

Do you intend to extend your offering to owners of the
earlier open headlight cars?


v12 E-type running MS3/3X sequential lpg and petrol
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In reply to a message from MarekH sent Thu 2 Jul 2015:

Which leaves the OP with the option of the other S1� mods that
don’t quite deliver the goods and the MM S1 retrofit. The OP’s
car is a low mileage original. My preference would be to leave
the car as is - better yet get a second bonnet as already
suggested and keep the original intact for a time when it will
add value. A Series 1� coupe is not only one of the rarest
production E-types, from a practical standpoint it’s also one
of the very best. Shame to mess that up.–
The original message included these comments:

I’d need to have a s1 car bonnet to play with, so it’d be difficult
to get anywhere without one as I only have a s3 car. The curvature
of the single piece rims is very tight at the 6 o’clock position
and if this is any tighter a turn at the apex then that’d be a
problem. Neither Jaguar nor the Wahl kit attempted to bend metal
around that part of the curve using such a thin casting. The
problem is that the outside of the curve is stretched a lot and the
inside is compressed a lot and that is hard to do right over a
curved surface in one take.
kind regards
Marek


Nick Saltarelli '68 Cdn mkt E-type S1� OTS, '54 XK120SE OTS
Niagara, Ontario, Canada
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In reply to a message from Paul Spurlock sent Thu 2 Jul 2015:

I too wanted a covered headlight Series 1 FHC when I started
looking for my dream car 15+ years ago but when I came
across my one owner, mostly original unrestored , totally
rust free 68, I said… close enough. Now in retrospect I am
so glad it is the one I have. Since I am in Houston I really
like the Series 2 cooling set up and the looks of a Series

  1. It is the best combination for me. Might be silly but
    more than covered headlights the thing I miss more is not
    having a starter button. I think that is so cool. Anyone
    have a kit to put a starter button on a 1.5 ? (just kidding)

David
68 E-Type FHC–
D Barnes
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In reply to a message from N�ck sent Thu 2 Jul 2015:

In all likelyhood, I will never do the conversion unless an
kit comes along that does not require major work to the
headlight area. It is a low mileage example of a scarce
model, which I thoroughly respect.
We plan on keeping this car until I cannot drive anymore.
Hopefully, that’s thirty or more years from now! It’s
quickly become my favorite car to drive in our collection
('66 Alfa Romeo GTV, '65 Porsche 356, and a '69 Dodge Super
Bee).–
66alfa_gtv
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In reply to a message from 66alfa_gtv sent Sat 4 Jul 2015:

I’ve come to the same conclusion, Steve. Let’s hope Marek adds
a new kit to his line. An early bonnet with covers and thin
chrome trim would be rather attractive.

http://tinyurl.com/o425mle--
The original message included these comments:

In all likelyhood, I will never do the conversion unless an
kit comes along that does not require major work to the
headlight area. It is a low mileage example of a scarce
model, which I thoroughly respect.
We plan on keeping this car until I cannot drive anymore.
Hopefully, that’s thirty or more years from now! It’s
quickly become my favorite car to drive in our collection
('66 Alfa Romeo GTV, '65 Porsche 356, and a '69 Dodge Super
Bee).


Nick Saltarelli '68 Cdn mkt E-type S1� OTS, '54 XK120SE OTS
Niagara, Ontario, Canada
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Well, I’m convinced enough that Marek’s kit is worth the risk in ease,
and gambling to do my 71-6 and 72-12.
MaxOn 7/4/15, 66alfa_gtv stevec@cleanroomcreative.com wrote:

In reply to a message from Níck sent Thu 2 Jul 2015:

In all likelyhood, I will never do the conversion unless an
kit comes along that does not require major work to the
headlight area. It is a low mileage example of a scarce
model, which I thoroughly respect.
We plan on keeping this car until I cannot drive anymore.
Hopefully, that’s thirty or more years from now! It’s
quickly become my favorite car to drive in our collection
('66 Alfa Romeo GTV, '65 Porsche 356, and a '69 Dodge Super
Bee).

66alfa_gtv
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In reply to a message from Max sent Sat 4 Jul 2015:

I’m in, too. Bought a kit last week.–
bob t, Cincinnati, OH
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Just received my two kits and popped one open. Marek did a great job
based on my visual of the parts. I’d suggest a repository of
experiences in this conversion. Some may find a question or two may be
answered by inputs from those of us making the conversion.
great work marek!
MaxOn 7/4/15, tbob trimpe.bob@gmail.com wrote:

In reply to a message from Max sent Sat 4 Jul 2015:

I’m in, too. Bought a kit last week.


bob t, Cincinnati, OH
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In reply to a message from Max sent Thu 23 Jul 2015:

…but still no kit for a 1.5 !!
Steve–
'68 2+2, '87 Benz SL, '60 Mini, '68 MGC
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In reply to a message from PKN sent Thu 23 Jul 2015:

Marek needs access to an open headlight variant Series 1
bonnet in order to design a kit, I believe.–
The original message included these comments:

…but still no kit for a 1.5 !!


Nick Saltarelli '68 Cdn mkt E-type S1� OTS, '54 XK120SE OTS
Niagara, Ontario, Canada
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In reply to a message from Max sent Thu 23 Jul 2015:

I echo Max’s observations. I am a few months away from
installing my kit, but I will follow this thread and
contribute when possible.

Bob t–
The original message included these comments:

Just received my two kits and popped one open. Marek did a great job
great work marek!


bob t, Cincinnati, OH
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