[E-Type] OE Radial Tires for the series 1 XKE, More information

I bought Vreds on price. I just couldn’t see how a Michelin or Pirelli or Indian produced Dunlop was worth two Vreds.
If I was in the habit of buying tyres for their extreme performance abilities, I might have had a different view. But I dont. I just drive lots of miles, usually around 60 mph, usually along gently twisting roads, usually in dry weather. Vreds do what I need of a tyre - to fit the wheel, to grip the road, and not to make a song and dance about it.

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Got to say.I am looking at buying a new set of tyres for my 1966 E type now. My current Michelin XVS have been 100% but are now too old albeit barely worn. Was going to buy another set of Michelin XVS but have to say Gerry’s first hand experience has made me think I should look at Vredesteins as well. Hate to say, won’t even consider Cinturatos, too many BAD experiences with them many years ago personally and amongst other XK and E type friends. I know the claims that current Cinturato are a totally different tyre apart from name and tread pattern, but then also claimed to be period (I hope not), but old buggers like me have long memories that don’t forgive easily.
Still struggle with the marketing hype. Just read the Wikipedia Pirelli Cinturato entry. What rubbish - more a non-paid advertisement. Jaguar NEVER offered radials of any brand as original equipment on XK’s nor 3.8 E types, let alone the period second best brand Pirellis. And Jaguar only first offered radial ply tyres on E types from 1965 onwards, and then they were Dunlop SP41, and never Pirelli.
Still find it dissapointing that the ‘acclaimed’ first factory 3.8 FHC restoration claiming original specification has blatantly WRONG Pirelli Cinturato fitted, should have used their corporate influence to continue availability of DUNLOP RS5
Roger

Hi Roger…that first factory original is all hype…its no where as it came out of the factory…originaly it was left Lhd and a different colour inside and out…electronic ignition, zinc plated wishbones…the list goes on…Steve

Dougal,

Try us: Offer all at the same low price and we’ll see ; -)

I would probably give Cinturatos a try, but I’d get Vredesteins over XVS though it would be close. The price (and limited XVS availability at the time) got me to try Vredesteins, but performance made me a believer.

Thanks for the article, that’s the kind of information we are all clamoring for. Too bad it was a different size than we use: 185/70R15, and a different tire. The Pirelli CN36 did not come in 185R15 back in 1974. I see Vredesteins beat out the Michelins; XWX, interesting. I always believed that the XVS was superior back in the day, but I figured Michelin would have improved XWX more because of their high-speed cachet. BTW, as I said, I have had to replace a Michelin due to construction failure recently. That’s nothing condemning Michelin but it says they put on their pants one leg at a time like everyone else.

Longevity is not a major issue for our E-Types. I believe I have one of the most miles driven per year, and when the Vredesteins age out they have most of their tread left.

Jerry

Not bashing them? You’ve changed the definition of “bashing” now?

I won’t be buying any tires ever from such an arrogant vendor with such poor taste in Elite colors.

Dougal, don’t know what “waffle” means, but if it means a purveyer who seems oblivious to how he is chafing potential customers, I agree!

As to your further response, I have a few observations. First, when you say things like “i am just disputing things that are stated as fact that i don’t agree with, and would not like other people who read this forum to be mislead,” you are mischaracterizing the entirety of this thread, and the nature of your responses. If someone said, “the Series 1 e-types have drum brakes,” certainly it would be appropriate to correct the poster to avoid anyone being misled, but nothing in this thread comes close to that. It’s a lot of posters relaying their experience with various tires, to which you respond dismissively and largely with puffery and unsubstantiated assertions. Do you not understand how suggesting that posts on this thread can “mislead” others is basically rude?

Second, I have read that article before and my initial reaction was – interesting, if i had an early 911. With the weight on the back end of the Porsche, it has handling characteristics unlike 99% of the cars out there. Porsche went to a wider, lower profile rear tire with the SC and the later carrera for a reason…with a tall soft sidewall, the handling in those cars is downright scary – beetle like. The 911 demands stiff sidewall tires on the rear, and if you don’t have it, your handling will be a mess. So, it is not surprising that a tire designed specifically for a 911 would excel in this test. A tire that may not shine when put to the test on a 911, may very well be excellent on an e-type. Horses for courses…or something like that.

Third, the overall impression reading that article is that the Vredestein vindicates itself quite well. The only spot where there was a material advantage for the Pirelli was on braking, but that just indicates it has a lower UTQG rating…the stickier the rubber, the faster it stops. But i can tell you that with all of my cars, the UTQG rating is not the determinative factor in any purchase as a low UTQG rating comes with tradeoffs.

Fourth, your assertion that Michelins don’t have failures is just ludicrous. I have used them off and on for 4 decades (I have them on my DD now)…I have had failures. More importantly, I have had times where I took them off with over 50% tread remaining because their grip was terrible in the rain…scary even.

What is wrong with Lotus Yellow on a Lotus Elite? http://tinyurl.com/y9yuv8lr

Is criticising members colour choices now part of J-L etiquette?

David

As I read @BRG’s post he is making a point about the difference between subjective and objective, rather than criticizing @Longstone’s colour choice.

At least I hope that is what he meant.

What I get from this topic is something stated here before - a 185R 15 is the best size for the way most e-types are used. If you have a 3:54 rear and crappy roads the diameter is not only “original”, it is also practical.
One thing we can’t prove is something I have a sense of - the most consistent quality is usually obtained in a 1st world country. While a manufacturer can control its plant in the wilds of Indonesia, the whole chain of supply doesn’t have decades of Darwin like sifting of quality. I doubt tires are any different than the aftermarket parts we redrill, file or even throw away for our Jaguars. Not to say 2nd or 3rd world tires can’t be excellent, modern manufacture involves so many links I’m more confident of established suppliers for safety items.
I wish I’d gone for the Verds, I have 205 Dunlops which are OK on diameter but are pretty fat.

Eggsactly. Very strange that a vendor would insult people’s choices in an attempt to sell them more expensive tires.

Reads different to me BRG. I thought the over riding rule here was not to criticise vendors and to be polite to others? Taking a pop at someone’s pride and joy over colour choice is below the belt. Warrants a “yellow” card against you IMHO and it is duly noted in my book.

David

Well he took a pop at my (and everyone else’s) Vreds (re-read the thread if you missed it), so talk to him about that first.

Can we talk about something other than tires; something noncontroversial like K&N filters or brake fluid or motor oil. :smile:

Wow, David, I don’t know any interpretation of the rule that would allow vendors to come on this forum, denigrate posters and not allow posters to challenge the vendor. If there was such an interpretation, I would suggest banning all vendors from posting. Otherwise, it’s like sending a boxer into a match with their hands tied behind their back. Dougal was begging to be put in his place with the slights he was handing out in this thread. And, making a snarky comment about the color of Dougal’s elite can hardly equate to vendor bashing, IMO.

If Philip’s comments deserve a Yellow Card (and I can see that could be argued by strict interpretation of the “rules”), then by the same measure Dougall has warranted a Red Card for some time in my opinion. I think the Admins are trying to avoid being heavy handed, and letting the members settle such matters as adults. I trust that their confidence in our ability to do so is not misplaced…

-David

I have met Dougal several times and he is without doubt a gentle, enthusiastic classic car owner/racer who has a passion for sharing his knowledge of tyres. He has little interest in advertising his wares - a visit to his premises would convince you of that - and he makes his reputation and sales through attending and participating in race events. They have a trailer full of tyres which are for sale to racers over the weekend. Last time I was at his place two Bugatti Type 35’s drove in for some tyres as they were on the way to a race, by road! Selling a few sets of Pirelli’s for E-Type’s is fairly low down his order of priorities.

He has a head full of tyre knowledge and experience and I assume he can’t understand why no one appears to be listening. He does not see it as ‘selling’ anything. It is easy to confuse passion with self interest but I really don’t think Dougal is participating in J-L for the latter. At least that is my experience of meeting Dougal without wanting in any way to defend him if he has stepped out of line.

Regards

David

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As David, and from all I have read here and there, I don’t think Dougal is making the case of Cinturato’s and XVS’s for money.
More probably, he’s an enthusiast, a perfectionist and a lover of nice products that fit best with our classic cars. And he truly believes in (and has experience and arguments for) the superiority of these tyres.
With such a mood, he is not keen to lead customers towards products that will lag behind in his opinion, as he would better pay himself a (big) premium to have the best.
Here comes the issue for us, especially when we don’t drive our classics that often (meaning we don’t really wear the tyres) and/or don’t push the tyres to their limits, and when a whole set of tyres makes a substantial cost difference. If, in addition, the XVS superiority in certain conditions is challenged compared to a Vred, it becomes even more questionable…
Up to each of us to make his mind.

David, Dougal does come across as an enthusiastic guy, and I’m sure he has a lot to share, but I wish he would share his knowledge rather than force opinions.

Content redacted.

Shane, please refrain from public vendor bashing here on JL.