Anyone know what the going price for a set of SU’s is currently ?
I’m looking around for some for my 68 OTS and of course would want
them with the manifold, linkage, air cleaner attachment, etc. but
I’m not sure what a reasonable price would be for a set at this
point in time. Does anyone have any leads for me ?
Any help is appreciated !–
Guitarstar 68-OTS 69-GT6+ 72-240Z 91-Miata
Woodinville Wa, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Guitarstar sent Mon 27 Oct 2003:
Typical selling price for the set with linkage and manifold is
in the $1200-1600 range, depending on condition. If it were me,
I’d try to find a set on the low-end, not rebuilt. A friend of
mine bought a set of ‘‘rebuilt’’ ones on E-Bay, and we had to do most
of a rebuild to undo what the seller had done to them, including
replacing one entire body.–
Ray Livingston
Santa Cruz, CA, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Guitarstar sent Mon 27 Oct 2003:
As Ray said, the usual price for a very nice set in need of rebuild
is around $1200. The cost to rebuild yourself to a high quality
will be around $350 in parts (from Burlen and others) and includes
manifold gasket, carb insulators and gaskets, etc. You may need to
spend another $100 for sundry stuff such as teflon bushings, and
missing parts, etc.
The things you will need that tend to be missing from these used
sets are:
Overlfow tubes (3 @ $30 ea)
Fuel rail ($70)
Return spring brackets (3 @ $15 ea)
Return springs (3 @ $5 ea)
Rear slave shaft ($50) (your S2 one won’t work)
If you have the barrel-type air cleaner that your car came with and
wish to continue to use it you will need to get a new plenum
(triangular air box – runs about $50 on ebay) and a set of
trumpets (connects carbs to plenum – runs about $70 on ebay)
By the time you are done, expect to be out $1700 to $1900 depending
on how complete the set you purchase is.
Usually the folks selling these used kits have the missing parts
somewhere. Cajole them to round up as much as possible as this will
save you some effort and expense later.
Richard Liggitt–
'70 E Roadster, '98 XK8 Roadster, '02 Mini Cooper
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Richard Liggitt sent Mon 27 Oct 2003:
Great information guys, a couple of follow ups please.
Do the tubes that connect the carbs to the air cleaner work as
ram tubes to any degree ? I ask this because when I put foam air
cleaner baskets on my 240Z it didn’t perform as well because the
stock air cleaner has sheetmetal air horns built into it. If I was
to just buy some Ramflo basket cleaners rather than searching out
the stock air cleaner assembly, I would want to make sure that I
wasn’t compromising the design intent after going through the time
and trouble to find and install some triple SU’s.
Is there any way to get more poop out of the orginal ZS carbs by
changing needles, jets, or something ? The triple SU’s have about
18.85 sq/in of intake area, whereas the dual ZS have only about
11.0’’ That’s a difference of 7.85 sq/in that can’t be changed,
however, if the ZS are designed to run lean, then it seems that
some new needles may generate better performance at the cost of
some fuel economy, providing that needles are available
somewhere ???
Thanks again for your thoughts.–
Guitarstar 68-OTS 69-GT6+ 72-240Z 91-Miata
Woodinville Wa, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Guitarstar sent Mon 27 Oct 2003:
I doubt the air horns have any significant effect, as they’re only
about 2’’ long. However, in going to after-market filters, I’d be
concerned about how much crap they will allow to be sucked into the
engine. Most after-market filters are sold on the basis of low-
restriction, which generally means bigger ‘‘holes’’, which means more
crap getting through the filters, to be sucked into the engine and
accelerate wear. Plus, they’ll almost certainly result in more
intake noise, which, IMHO, is not particularly desireable.–
The original message included these comments:
Do the tubes that connect the carbs to the air cleaner work as
ram tubes to any degree ? I ask this because when I put foam air
cleaner baskets on my 240Z it didn’t perform as well because the
stock air cleaner has sheetmetal air horns built into it. If I was
to just buy some Ramflo basket cleaners rather than searching out
the stock air cleaner assembly, I would want to make sure that I
wasn’t compromising the design intent after going through the time
and trouble to find and install some triple SU’s.
–
Guitarstar 68-OTS 69-GT6+ 72-240Z 91-Miata
–
Ray Livingston
Santa Cruz, CA, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Guitarstar sent Mon 27 Oct 2003:
The K&N filters are rumored to be top notch air cleaners. However,
they will cost you about $300 when all is told and then you need to
address the puke tank issue as they provide no attachemnt for
drawing a vacuum for your breather.
George Cohen converted his dual Stombergs to the tripple SU’s and
is using the SI air cleaner setup. But I don’t know how he handled
the breather; you might ask him about his experience.
Richard Liggitt–
'70 E Roadster, '98 XK8 Roadster, '02 Mini Cooper
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Richard Liggitt sent Mon 27 Oct 2003:
K&Ns are rumored mostly by K&N to be top notch. IMHO, there's
plenty of reason to be concerned that do not do a great job of
trapping dirt, and there’s virtually no evidence to support their
claims of improved performance. Why risk it?
The breather is trivial to hook up. I did it with two short
pieces of hose, and cutting a few inches off the SII breather
pipe. It them routes very nicely under the front carb.–
The original message included these comments:
The K&N filters are rumored to be top notch air cleaners. However,
they will cost you about $300 when all is told and then you need to
address the puke tank issue as they provide no attachemnt for
drawing a vacuum for your breather.
George Cohen converted his dual Stombergs to the tripple SU’s and
is using the SI air cleaner setup. But I don’t know how he handled
Richard Liggitt
–
Ray Livingston
Santa Cruz, CA, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
Ray’s right. Lower restriction = less filtering. Your trading off motor
life for performance.
Mike Frank
At 02:02 PM 10/27/2003, you wrote:
Most after-market filters are sold on the basis of low-
restriction, which generally means bigger ‘‘holes’’, which means more
crap getting through the filters, to be sucked into the engine and
accelerate wear. P
In reply to a message from Richard Liggitt sent Mon 27 Oct 2003:
K&Ns are rumored mostly by K&N to be top notch. IMHO, there's
plenty of reason to be concerned that do not do a great job of
trapping dirt, and there’s virtually no evidence to support their
claims of improved performance. Why risk it?
Ray,
I think this urban legend can be put to rest if someone can donate a
discarded unit for me to check out. I suspect a simple microscopic
inspection will reveal the relative pore size of KN versus a typical
filter. Definitely a case of where “size does matter” ; o
max
In reply to a message from Mike Frank sent Mon 27 Oct 2003:
Something to consider when searching for triple SUs. Nobody has
them. For some unknown but not-too-hard-to-figure-out reason,
there has been an amazing run on new and excellent condition triple
SU setups. I’ve been trying to score a set for 4 months with no
luck so far. My mechanic has also been trying to find a good used
set - we have however rejected two used sets after careful
inspection. Burlen was backordered waiting for 4.2 manifolds to
complete their sets. They just now are beginning to ship complete
sets again. And DOGGIE, they are very pricey. After great
frustration I finally agreed to buy the entire setup new and I’ll
be eating mac and cheese for months. Maybe a year ago you could
land a used triple SU setup for $1,200 but today a good set will
cost closer to $2k. Supply and demand.
Randy–
Randall Harris
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Richard Liggitt sent Mon 27 Oct 2003:
Great information guys, a couple of follow ups please.
Do the tubes that connect the carbs to the air cleaner work as
ram tubes to any degree ? I ask this because when I put foam air
cleaner baskets on my 240Z it didn’t perform as well because the
stock air cleaner has sheetmetal air horns built into it.
Trust me, the e-type with triple SU’s has so much more performance than the
Z that you wouldn’t notice any difference with ram tubes anyway.
And if you look at the ram tubes on the Z, they are not real effective
anyway, more of a round tube with a bell shaped end than true machined ram
tubes.
George Cohen converted his dual Stombergs to the tripple SU’s and
is using the SI air cleaner setup. But I don’t know how he handled
the breather; you might ask him about his experience.
I used the stock cannister air cleaner setup. I also changed the breather
to the earlier S1 type and hooked it to the proper fitting on the back of
the air cleaner trumpet. The only thing I don’t have hooked up is the vent
tube for the gas tank.
In reply to a message from max azevedo sent Mon 27 Oct 2003:
''I suspect a simple microscopic inspection will reveal the relative
pore size of KN versus a typical filter. Definitely a case of
where ‘‘size does matter’’
Think a more empirical test would be needed, since ‘size isn’t
everything’. Ultimately, the amount of particulate matter removed
is more important than the size of the pores. Intuitively you’d say
that the smaller the pore size the better the filtration (at the
cost of flow impediment), but I think the nature of the filter can
affect things as much or maybe more than pore size per se.
I know on oiled foam on dirt bikes (and oil-trap vehicles designed
for desert conditions 100 years ago), the real filtration is done
by the sticky layer on the surface of the filter matrix, catching
the particles as the air stream changes direction in the matrix
through what can be hole sizes that that on paper ought not to trap
much at all. The dirt can’t change direction as quickly as air and
is flung to the periphery where it is captured by the sticky medium
until washed off. Some build up of dirt can help filtration but
eventually excess build up can hinder too of course. The sticky
matrix principle is exactly what the body uses to filter our own
breath in the nose and at the back of the throat and airway
passages, and that works for particles down to about 1-4 microns
preventing them reaching the alveoli at the base of the lung.
Strangley enough, the CFC-free propellants enforced by the Montreal
Protocol for our AC and refrigerators etc, also help get asthma
drugs much deeper into the lung and reduce deposition at the back
of the throat. Just a bit of trivia from my work for 3M respiratory!
Maybe a better test would be to suck or blow air through a filter
and have a trap like a filter paper downstream, which could be
weighed before and after a fixed mass of (say) talcum powder was
scattered upstream? Not a test I’m going to do, but I wouldn’t
trust a simple microscopic exam as the definitive test either.–
Peter Crespin 94 X300 Daimler / 66 2+2 ‘E’
Buxton, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
<As Ray said, the usual price for a very nice set in need of rebuild
is around $1200. The cost to rebuild…>
If I may jump in here…if you’re not in a hurry, I suggest watching XKs
Unlimited (and the other usual suspects as well) for sales or specials,
which is where I found the set for my SIII. $1,200 for a set of four, new in
the box and ready to go.
I was over at Welsh Jag recently and remember seeing a few used sets there.
Didn’t ask the price since I don’t need them (already have), but, if you
are looking might be a good idea to give them a call.
<As Ray said, the usual price for a very nice set in need of rebuild
is around $1200. The cost to rebuild…>
If I may jump in here…if you’re not in a hurry, I suggest watching XKs
Unlimited (and the other usual suspects as well) for sales or specials,
which is where I found the set for my SIII. $1,200 for a set of four, new
in
the box and ready to go.
<As Ray said, the usual price for a very nice set in need of rebuild
is around $1200. The cost to rebuild…>
If I may jump in here…if you’re not in a hurry, I suggest watching XKs
Unlimited (and the other usual suspects as well) for sales or specials,
which is where I found the set for my SIII. $1,200 for a set of four, new in
the box and ready to go.
Regards,
The problem is it takes a bit more to convert a dual Stromberg car.
Maniflold, linkage, carbs, air cleaner setup, etc.
The manufacturer has the nearly complete kit on their homepage at http://www.burlen.co.uk/ for 1.749 GBP which is a few pennies under $2,962
today. And this doesn’t include the air cleaner setup or breather parts
which will have to be sourced seperately.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen one of the new kits for converting to triple
SU’s on sale because they know they can sell every one at full price and get
it.
In reply to a message from Mike Frank sent Mon 27 Oct 2003:
Mike,
I especially enjoyed this line:
‘‘I actually received an e-mail from K&N stating their filters
filter within 99% of the OEM filters.’’
Wow! 99%! So if we assume the OEM filter is 99% efficient,
then K&Ns let about twice as much dirt pass through!–
The original message included these comments:
Guitarstar,
What Ray said and they’re also available new from http://www.burlen.co.uk/ I believe somewhere around 2800USD. From what
I’ve seen you’d be very lucky to find a complete set with air cleaner.
If you don’t you can still get those pieces separately. They show up
on ebay and I’m sure some of the usuals would be able to help you not
the least of which would be Stefan Roundy.
pauls 67ots
Anyone know what the going price for a set of SU’s is currently ?
I’m looking around for some for my 68 OTS and of course would want
them with the manifold, linkage, air cleaner attachment, etc. but
I’m not sure what a reasonable price would be for a set at this
point in time. Does anyone have any leads for me ?
And he has the data to back that up! So what’s K&N’s issue?
Mike Frank
At 06:30 PM 10/27/2003, you wrote:
I especially enjoyed this line:
‘‘I actually received an e-mail from K&N stating their filters
filter within 99% of the OEM filters.’’
Wow! 99%! So if we assume the OEM filter is 99% efficient,
then K&Ns let about twice as much dirt pass through!