Fitted Luggage MKIV & SS

Just a guess, “ND.” showing in a parts number column might mean “not designated” or “no designation”. N.B. (nota bene, note well) is closest I know, I don’t know a Latin abbreviation using ND.

Perhaps “None Deraintanni” as if in answer to the question, “What’s the part number?” :wink:

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" ND" is also applied to number plates in the pars book
Which in UK were, I think mad e by outside companies.

I think it might be No Detail.

I see that where in the '38-'47 parts books the individual parts are given Part No.s for pre-war SS and Code No.s for post-war Jaguar parts, contrarily in the '36-'37 parts book that parts are given Detail No.s, and that the gearbox assembly has N.D. in the Detail No. column.
image

My front number plate was made by Hills and there is a London WC1 address stamped in the lower edge.
My rear number plate has no marking, but it seems to be the type described in the '38-'47 parts book as Bluemel’s prismatic translucent.

Its a little vague what’s going on in the '36-'37 book.
Tie rod ends and steering connecting tubes have the same detail no.s and the same prices.
Road wheels, outer covers and inner tubes all have the same detail no.
Wings and bonnets have Jig No.s.
Most Lucas parts have a detail no., but the trunk lamp does not. (yes it says trunk, not boot)
Front number plate has a detail no. I’m not sure why, wouldn’t these be purchased from a government agency?
Quite a few other parts supplied by outside sources do not have detail no.s, like most tools, Ace wheel discs, polished number plates, Desmo fog lamp and Desmo spot lamp.
Maybe in those days they didn’t need part numbers for accessories, a customer would just ask for the part by name.

Has anyone come up with a picture and/or description of the luggage straps? The only set I’ve seen so far is on a 1948 DHC, which has multiple incorrect restoration issues. I doubt the buckles at the attaching points are correct. Here’s the picture I took.

I couldn’t find a reference to the straps in the Parts Catalogue. I’ve seen various versions though they would have to be easily removed and not fixed to the cleats. I guess you went to your local saddlery and ordered a set which would accommodate the size of your luggage (trunk)?:+1:t2:

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I’ve ordered a pair of 60-inch long, 1.5-inch wide belts, with 20 buckle holes in each strap. I will do somewhat of a test fit, then cut each belt somewhere in the middle. Each of the cut ends will fit through one of the attachment points on the top if the boot or the edge of the boot lid. I will fold the edge over and attach it to the strap with matching brass screw posts, which I also ordered from the same leather shop. That way the straps will be removable, but not so clumsy looking with multiple buckles, as those in the above picture. I’ll post pictures when I get them done. Here’s the only other picture of the straps which I’ve found, and I’m sure they can’t be correct either.

I’m pretty sure that there is no “factory correct” strap.
And even if there was, it would have been whatever some midlands saddle shop would have supplied to every car builder of the period.
Here is a set in a Mark V.
PICT1982

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I have been thinking about the straps and would imagine that it would be best to be able to remove the straps after using them. If they were fixed in place (as in your photo, Rob) they would slap and bang around in the boot.:weary: Better to have a loop at either end with the buckle and adjustment holes in from the cleats, if you get what I mean? I had a photo of a MKIV somewhere in my photo’s with that arrangement. I’ll keep looking.

In a quick web search I found this company. I’m sure there are others but they might have something to offer or just ideas?

Tim

What about a good old fashioned tack shop?

Nothing at all. I guess if you look at what others have to offer you can go to a saddlery (is that a ‘tack’ shop?) with a firm idea of what you are after then that would help the process. Personally, I can’t think of a worse idea than having the boot (see what I did there :wink:) open to the elements and letting all the dirt, grime, rain, insects… flow into the boot. There is a rubber seal around the boot for a good reason. :blush:

Not only that, but when it rains or snows, all that liquid sunshine runs through the tool kit and into the boot lid, which only has the wire hole and grommet for a drain.

Obviously anything that I or anyone else here does with this would not be for functional use, but to demonstrate how the car was designed to be used. It gives a legitimate answer to questions which arise of what those cleats in the boot and on the boot lid are for. It would make much more sense for the cleats to have never been there…but they are and are part of the history of the car.

I used and have referred others to https://www.barefootleather.co.uk. The owner will make just about any leather strap, etc… you may need. A friend had luggage straps made for his Morgan +4 and was very satisfied.

Here is the page showing what he provides for classic cars - https://www.barefootleather.co.uk/leather-cat-basket-bicycle-hamper-picnic-straps/car-straps

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I totally agree!

My MKIV & MKV both have the cleats fitted. It’s a strange anachronism probably associated with the way the boot opens down unlike every subsequent Jaguar saloons which all opened upwards. The straps, if tightened properly would probably support the boot’s hinges with it open while driving. I wonder if boot hinges broke on long trips and going over bumpy roads? The cleats are only held on by two self-tapping screws as well! Fascinating stuff.

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My cars have 1" x 1/8" plates behind the panels, tapped for the 2BA chromed screws.

I have a theory for the provision of these cleats and it is to do with the evolution of the motor car to be increasingly versatile for a variety of owners.

Right up into the early '30s, car boots were almost unknown. Any volume of luggage was bundled inside with passengers or stacked on the optional accessories of the fold-down rear rack or behind the running board fence - if you could afford them. There was also the dicky seat in the two-door coupé.

From the '30s to the '50s boots became standard, but the body styles were rounded or sloping, and not very roomy, particularly after housing the spare wheel and tools. From then, boots gradually became more boxy and far more functional.

About the cleats - in those early decades long family touring trips or holidays would have been very rare, so the provision of a large luggage capacity would have been needed only by very few. Because the Mk IV and V would have been owned by those more wealthy than most, they would have been in a better position to afford longer and more challenging family trips - Europe, Scotland, etc. - the ‘expanding’ boot would have been a bonus. No security or protection for anything in or on it of course.

That’s my fairy tale logic on it.

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Here’s where my reading of old motoring books from pre-WW1 comes in.
In the early days of pleasure motoring, it was the usual thing to send your big luggage ahead to your next watering place hotel by train, and your day luggage would go on the roof rack and running boards, strapped down with those leather straps by the chauffeur or hotel footman.
The folding rear rack and running board extendable fence came along in the 1920’s.
running board luggage fence

BTW those are not called cleats, they are known as footman loops, presumably because the footman did the work of tying down. Google brings up a number of supplier sources. My Jeep has two on the bonnet/hood, and around here in this season they are used for tying down your deer.

That’s a fantastic piece of history, thanks Rob!

BTW I saw this Alvis with its fitted luggage this morning in an email.

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I got curious so I looked on the brochures pages; I think the first Lyons product to have a boot as we might interpret the term was the SS-II of 1931.


Here is an SS-I as offered in 1933.

And another.

And a project SS-I



As I recall there was some discussion on this forum about this car, some doubt as to whether the boot was original or not. It is not like any shown in the brochures. But either way, somebody built it a long time ago.

My 'rent’s PIII Rolls had a similar-style “trunk.”