[Lumps!] Series 1 Heater matrix exchange - continued

Lumps
1

For once the Jaguar Service manual is correct. You must remove the
evaporator to get to the heater matrix that lives in a ‘‘depression’’
behind the evaporator. I will post pictures soon, as I continue in
this quest to resolve the leaking heater matrix and the AC air flow
woes of my Series 1.

The heating problems are a leaking heater matrix - the spare has
been fixed and the unit cleaned and pressure tested. I will start
the car up and test it before putting all the AC stuff back in -
just to be sure!

David Boger sent me photos of a heater matrix ‘‘living’’ in the parts
car he removed my spare evaporator from - I am down to removing the
dash parts to get at the evaporator and that is on todays agenda. I
hope to R&R the matrix, start the car and test for any leaks and
then continue fixing up the AC flap vent seals and noisy heater
fan.–
'71 XJ6 383/200R, '74 XJ6 383/700R, '74 Nova SS Glendora, CA
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–

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2

In reply to a message from Roger Mabry sent Sun 3 Jun 2007:

I found out we cannot blame Jaguar or old age for my leaking heater
matrix. It did not leak until the new engine was installed. While
the engine was being installed, my friend and I totally rewired the
Jaguar under the hood. Unfortunately, we covered up the firewall
with BQuiet insulation material and covered up a critical mounting
hole for a wire bracket on the firewall. WE GUESSED = wrong by less
than 1/8 inch and made a hole with a screw into the previously good
matrix. We are paying dearly for that mistake!!!

Getting the leaking heater matrix out is a BIG JOB. It took two
good mechanics about (4) fours each to get the stuff out of the
car. The dash has to be totally removed, the dash pad has to come
off, the center braces to the top brace have to come out and
loosening the upper dash cross bar is required for room(from one
side of the car to the other needs to be loose). The steering wheel
and whole upper column has to be removed down to the U-joint at the
floor level. I did not remove the ignition switch per Jaguar - was
able to wiggle out the LH dash piece and only disconnected the
wires to the turn signal lever assembly. Easier than the Jaguar
manual.

Then the outer air vents on the L&R side have to be unscrewed, the
round vent tubes pulled out and the evaporator eight screws
removed. The fuse panels have to be removed from the evaporator top
sections and the attaching straps on the upper dash bent to allow
slack in the wiring harnesses. The harness connections need to be
uplugged on both sides. All the wiring has to be thrown up on top
to get the evaporator out.

The hardest part is the removal of the clips in the inside of the
vent on the outside of the car. Then the grill on the top of dash
has to be removed to get at those (2) clips that hold the vent rods
in place.

Then by carefully prying on the evaporator, keeping all the wires
out of the way, you can remove the evaporator. Try to save the
gaskets behind for samples - new ones have to be made to seal that
area or all the AC air will be lost behind the dash.

With the evaporator out, the matrix will be visible in it’s little
niche. If the hoses are removed, you can just pull it out of the
hole in the firewall bulkhead.

I will post pictures of all these steps on the Forum when we are
done doing the re-install portion. I need to make new seals for the
evaporator, the vent flaps and we are installing two extra cooling
vents while in there for this project - instead of just one. I am
remounting the radio to make it more secure, fixing a light that
was not working under the dash and cleaning all the ground
connections.

Even though we created the heater matrix leak, the extra two AC
vents, new vent flaps seals and good sealing on all the connections
will make it all worth while in the end.

Cold air and enough air volume to be happy and heat on demand!–
The original message included these comments:

For once the Jaguar Service manual is correct. You must remove the
evaporator to get to the heater matrix that lives in a ‘‘depression’’
this quest to resolve the leaking heater matrix and the AC air flow
The heating problems are a leaking heater matrix - the spare has

–
'71 XJ6 383/200R, '74 XJ6 383/700R, '74 Nova SS Glendora, CA
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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3

In reply to a message from Roger Mabry sent Sun 3 Jun 2007:

Oh, sounds like SO much fun. I can’t wait to tackle mine!–
Todd Vess, Windsor, Colorado
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4

In reply to a message from Jag11 sent Mon 4 Jun 2007:

Yes you also made up my mide,I’m pulling my unit out and putting a
vintage air unit in.doing complete overhaul and never what to pull
the dash again.Good luck Roger,hopefully by next year I’ll be back
out in calif,so we can take the 2 ser I’s up azusa caynon for a
nice run.That should be a sweet ride,some hot rod jags growling up
the mountion.–
sparkster
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5

In reply to a message from sparkster sent Mon 4 Jun 2007:

If your Jag heater is not leaking, leave it alone.

Good luck doing the conversion, you will have to go through the
same R&R process to take out all the Jag stuff.

Then you will have to adapt the Vintage Air stuff. You might wait
until I finish to see the results of using 50% Vintage Air stuff -
the stuff under the hood that you will have to change anyway.

I believe the Jag AC stuff will work properly and you will save
about $1000 USD and a lot of time.

If we had not poked a stainless screw right into a heater tube of
the heater matrix, my project would be finished.

Running the two cars up in the canyon would be a lot of fun. I gave
up riding a motorcycle because I used to ride in the canyon and was
always getting ‘‘pushed’’ around by the cars.–
The original message included these comments:

nice run.That should be a sweet ride,some hot rod jags growling up
the mountion.

–
'71 XJ6 383/200R, '74 XJ6 383/700R, '74 Nova SS Glendora, CA
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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6

In reply to a message from Roger Mabry sent Mon 4 Jun 2007:

Roger:

Don’t feel bad. It’s done all the time!

When running copper plumbing through 2 x 4 or other frame members,
the drill is to get in the center of the wood to drill the openings
for the pipe to pass through. If not possible , then put in a nail
plate on the surface to protect the line from stray nails.

Is this always done, of course not. Then comes the dry wall and
base board and guess what! A nail or screw gets driven into the
copper. Then even worse, the pressure check doesn’t pick it up as
the fastener seals the hole. But, later as the fastener corrodes in
the wet, the seal breaks down little by little and mysterios
moisture starts appearing in greater and greater quantities. Runs
people nuts tracking it down!

Jaguar lesson, the one you already learned the hard way as most
are!!

Carl–
The original message included these comments:

I found out we cannot blame Jaguar or old age for my leaking heater
matrix. It did not leak until the new engine was installed. While
the engine was being installed, my friend and I totally rewired the
Jaguar under the hood. Unfortunately, we covered up the firewall
with BQuiet insulation material and covered up a critical mounting
hole for a wire bracket on the firewall. WE GUESSED = wrong by less
than 1/8 inch and made a hole with a screw into the previously good
matrix. We are paying dearly for that mistake!!!

–
Carl Hutchins
Walnut Creek, California, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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7

Actually, I can go one better…

Years ago, I was finishing up an 85 XJS conversion
with a TPI engine. The car was by then running and I
was doing some of the finish work. I had the right
front seat out to find a place to mount the ECM, and
that seemed like a good place. I pulled off the ECM
bracket and set it down on the floor to match drill it
for screws for mounting, but noticed some pop rivets
in the area, coming in from the other side. I was just
about to look underneath to see what they were when
the phone rings, and I ran in to answer it. Once off
the phone, I cam back, held the bracket down and
drilled the 2 holes. As the second hole went through,
a powerful fine stream of fuel shot past the drill
bit, past my head and soaked a section of the
headliner above me, ruining it. As it turned out,
those rivets I noticed were holding the fuel feed line
to the underside of the floor, and lucky me picked the
exact spot above the line to drill…

One compression union and a new headliner later I was
back in business, but it’s a dopey story…____________________________________________________________________________________
Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles. Visit the Yahoo! Auto Green Center.

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8

In reply to a message from A sent Tue 5 Jun 2007:

At least your repair was easier than mine and a little cheaper in
time and money. If you can imagine, you have to remove everything
in front of the inside of the firewall to SEE the S1 heater matrix
living in it’s little shelf.

I was happy to discover the cause, that way when the hole is
repaired, I will be confident that it is all OK again since a new
heater matrix for the Series 1 seems to be NA. It had to be
something like the screw since it worked before the new
engine/wiring was installed.

Your sharing of the fuel line story and mine might help someone in
the future plan better than we did. LOOK ON BOTH SIDES BEFORE YOU
DRILL.

The total cost: about 16 man hours, evacuate/charge up the AC,
$30.00 repair to the heater matrix and some gasket sealer.

By the way, my heating and AC said they will NOT do those types of
jobs anylonger and they used to quote 12 shop hours @ $62.00 for
the labor only portion of the heater matrix R&R. Then there are the
parts and the recharging of the AC since the AC hoses have to be
removed from the evaporator. About a $850.00 repair plus any little
parts.–
The original message included these comments:

One compression union and a new headliner later I was
back in business, but it’s a dopey story…

–
'71 XJ6 383/200R, '74 XJ6 383/700R, '74 Nova SS Glendora, CA
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php –

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9

In reply to a message from A sent Tue 5 Jun 2007:

Andrew:

You struck oil, a gusher!!

Should Rob look under his floor under the passenger seat?

Shouldn’t have hurt the headliner, except that part was cleaner
than the other!

Drilling or nailing is like riding the dunes, know what is on the
other side before you charge.

Don’t answer phones when doing Jaguar surgery!

Could’ve been worse!

Carl–
The original message included these comments:

Actually, I can go one better…
Years ago, I was finishing up an 85 XJS conversion
with a TPI engine. The car was by then running and I
was doing some of the finish work. I had the right
front seat out to find a place to mount the ECM, and
that seemed like a good place. I pulled off the ECM
bracket and set it down on the floor to match drill it
for screws for mounting, but noticed some pop rivets
in the area, coming in from the other side. I was just
about to look underneath to see what they were when
the phone rings, and I ran in to answer it. Once off

–
Carl Hutchins
Walnut Creek, California, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php –

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10

In reply to a message from cadjag sent Tue 5 Jun 2007:

I just received my original repaired heater matrix back today. They
rodded it out and soldered up the screw hole and pressure tested
the unit. I will put my ‘‘experienced’’ core back into the car.

The other S1 repaired heater matrix will end for sale on Ebay or
the Forum for the next person in need. I will also hold onto or
sell the other evaporator - have not decided yet.

I have collected the foam to wrap the heater matrix in and to make
a replacement gasket to seal the evaporator to the inner bulkhead.
I have foam to replace the 36 year old stuff on the vent flaps and
will attempt to add another vent onto the spare evaporator.

Plus I will photograph the insides of the spare evaporator
for ‘‘future’’ needs of others. The car will be better than before as
all the flaps will open and seal and the joints in the vent tubing
will be sealed up well. I do not plan on ‘‘cooling the dead air’’
under the dash any longer.–
The original message included these comments:

Don’t feel bad. It’s done all the time!

–
'71 XJ6 383/200R, '74 XJ6 383/700R, '74 Nova SS Glendora, CA
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php –

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11

In reply to a message from cadjag sent Tue 5 Jun 2007:

I learned my lesson on looking on both sides of the
sheetmetal when drilling a hole in my 1967 Mini Cooper. I
was drilling a hole in the floor when all the sudden sparks
starting flying and things started popping. I drilled right
into the positive battery cable (battery is in the boot) and
the drill bit making contact between the cable and the car
was quite a show.–
Todd Vess, Windsor, Colorado
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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12

That’s a good one as well…

I drilled right into the positive battery cable
(battery is in the boot) and the drill bit making
contact between the cable and the car was quite a
show.____________________________________________________________________________________
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13

In reply to a message from A sent Fri 8 Jun 2007:

So far, my story wins the ‘‘most work to fix award’’. Glad to hear
there are so many ‘‘honest Forum users’’ that will admit to being
human.–
The original message included these comments:

That’s a good one as well…

–
'71 XJ6 383/200R, '74 XJ6 383/700R, '74 Nova SS Glendora, CA
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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14

In reply to a message from Roger Mabry sent Fri 8 Jun 2007:

I was helping a guy with a VTX 1800 motorcycle repair a stripped
stud that holds the rear seat down. We cut off the stud…and I told
him to drill out the stud…then we’d put a nut under the fender so
he could screw the seat down instead of using a nut on the stud.

Went and got beer from the house…heard a POP…

Yep…drilled through the fender…and new Metzler 200 ($175) tire…

But he did finally get the mod done…–
XK120 owned 33 years S673396
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15

Still dealing with over heating. Have done it all, but check the OEM gauge
for accuracy. Going to install a good after market electric gauge and
curious about recommendations for placement.
I found a second sender unit tucked under the A/C compressor in the head
(forward, driver side) between 1 & 3 spark plug. The one being used is
rear, same position, on heads on passenger side.
I am also thinking maybe to use the plug in the stat housing and putting the
new sensor that came with the gauge there. The thinking is that knowing the
temp of the water at that final point before it heads to the rad might be
helpful.

Comments and suggestions welcome.

Smitty
Phoenix, Arizona
1977 Jaguar XJ-S (350ci/TH350 Conversion)
1967 Ford Mustang Coupe (Resto-Mod)

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16

In reply to a message from J. Rick Smith sent Sun 10 Jun 2007:

Have you checked temps with an infared sensor ? I check at the
return and inlet to see what differential temps are before and
after radiator.

Mine is 30 degrees cooler than the gauge. The gauge on my Tahoe is
pretty close to the infared temps…as our my wifes car…and kids
cars…so it seems a useful tool for me.–
XK120 owned 33 years S673396
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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17

I’d say forget the “good quality electric gauge” and
instead go for a full mechanical unit. These will read
very accurately. The sender (or bulb in this case)
should go in the front of the left head. Put the gauge
somewhere where you can see it and go for a drive. Let
us know what you see…____________________________________________________________________________________
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18

The problem with the mechanical gauge was the 7/8" hole I would have to
drill to get the gauge inside the car. No place really to lay it outside.
Just was trying to avoid unscrewing the forward driver’s side sensor to
replace with the new one, and thought that doing it on the stat housing
would be less fluid on the ground.

Smitty
Phoenix, Arizona
1977 Jaguar XJ-S (350ci/TH350 Conversion)
1967 Ford Mustang Coupe (Resto-Mod)-----Original Message-----
From: owner-lumps@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-lumps@jag-lovers.org] On
Behalf Of A
Sent: Saturday, June 09, 2007 10:01 PM
To: lumps@jag-lovers.org
Subject: Re: [Lumps!] Water Temp Sensor Placement

I’d say forget the “good quality electric gauge” and instead go for a full
mechanical unit. These will read very accurately. The sender (or bulb in
this case) should go in the front of the left head. Put the gauge somewhere
where you can see it and go for a drive. Let us know what you see…

Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV’s
Comedy with an Edge to see what’s on, when.
http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222

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19

No hole required- remove the access panel inside the
right front fender behind the right wheel and you can
lead the line in from the engine compartment, through
the rear of the right fender, down and into the car,
following the route of the original FI wiring harness.
Take off your right side kick panel and you’ll see the
other side of the hole…

Good luck> The problem with the mechanical gauge was the 7/8"

hole I would have to
drill to get the gauge inside the car.

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20

In reply to a message from J. Rick Smith sent Sun 10 Jun 2007:

‘‘I am also thinking maybe to use the plug in the stat housing and
putting the new sensor that came with the gauge there.’’

Don’t do that, it will give reliable readings only when the
Thermostat is open and don’t remove the thermostat - that will not
help with the overheat or high temp problems.–
lockheed
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