Greetings fellow Mk2 owners – hoping someone can provide a couple simple measurements for me. I’m in process of redoing the veneer on my entire dash including the dash cap and instrument cluster, glovebox, etc. My dash cap is missing the vertical wood piece that spans the entire width of the cap. I assume this piece, in addition to making it appear more finished, keeps stuff from sliding between the dash cap and the windshield and into oblivion. This vertical piece sits at the front edge of the cap right up against the windshield.
What I’m looking for measurements on is 1) how far above the dash cap this piece rises and 2) how thick this piece is. I have some wood coming (anigre) that will match the veneer accent strips which will also be anigre. The main veneer will be walnut burl. I’ve got a vacuum press system made up and forms to hold the various pieces. These forms simply provide support in the press and will enable the pieces to sustain the 2,000 pounds per square foot of pressure from the vacuum press. Will report out on how the process goes. May be a month or so before I give it a go.
They are laminated with sapwood on the outside. I made new ones for the last dash I redid. The curved sections need to be laminated with the end curves in them.
They are just over 1/8 thick, and stand just over 1/8 above the surface of the dash.
There are few pics of the way I did them in the album “Wood refinishing final” on:
The ones near the green vacuum bag with 15:25 written on it show the lamination.
I think you are talking about the same parts I remade for my 420G, sorry if wrong.
The pics show the “height” of the parts, match metal strips for protrusion, 3 ply, with straight-grain walnut, note the original had a chamfer, i did not copy. The curved parts were made damp and taped in position to take a bend
Great photo collection, Andrew. I’ll be tackling all the wood in the car eventually, but starting with the dash. The shop-vac press system – did that perform satisfactorily for you? I picked up a used (from Craigslist here in US) vacuum pump that was used for HVAC work and built a bag from purchased scrap polyurethane. Works great and pulls nearly a full vacuum. I’ve done some trial runs with it so far…but eager for the real deal.
Tony’s pics give me some ideas for mix-medium…maybe polished aluminum around the air vent areas. Wouldn’t be stock, but I’m open to tasteful deviations.
I plan to make the vertical piece from solid anigre cut down to the 1/8 inch thickness. Will likely use steam to soften the wood for bending. All a big experiment!
The Shop-Vac system worked fine for the shapes I did, but I’m still keeping an eye out for a proper vacuum pump. Deadheading a vacuum cleaner like that will burn the motor out pretty fast - that one gave up the ghost a few weeks after I’d finished the interior, but it had also been through a home renovation. One advantage of the reduced vacuum of the shop-vac is that because it doesn’t pull much vacuum you can get by with pretty flimsy backing boards and high density styrofoam forms. The bags I used were just heavy duty garden waste bags.
Vacuum bagging is great - even if just improvised like I did. I would suggest doing a couple of representative practice pieces to get used to the method. As you’re doing a full re-veneer I would suggest practising doing the taping on book matched bits too - do you know the trick about wetting and hammering a joint before gluing?
As to the lip on the dash top, I thought about making it from solid, but couldn’t find a wood with a grain that was close enough to the original grain. If you’re going to go with Al then I would suggest doing it all in Al, and fitting it after the top is painted, as:
I doubt the finish will stick once exposed to a few days of hot sunlight.
Rubbing the dash top down after finishing will be easier without the lip.
Fitting after finishing without glue will mean you don’t have the problem of excess glue.
I think black anodised would look great, particularly on a dash like the 420/420G which already have the black crash pads.
I glued the wood lips on before finishing, and used an epoxy (non foaming) glue sparingly. I didn’t have much squeeze out, and once that was scraped I filled up the few gaps with finish until they were flush, then when I sprayed the actual finish I ended up with a nice fillet. Give some thought to this before you start - I ended up doing a lot of fiddling here.
I would copy whatever is correct for a mk2, as far as possible?
the 420G has curved metal sections that are chrome,
it has straight grain walnut veneer on the upright segments, I ordered this off ebay for $10
the originals had 3ply backing, so did I.
steam is a pita, i just made mine damp, wrapped in gladwrap and taped to cantrail to shape (before veneer)…the items are NAILED onto the cantrail anyway. The pieces are 1" “high” from memory
One variation i did make is to use sparyed marine grade UV resistant polyurethane on ALL surfaces.
The original does not have any coating on 3 ply, so it delaminates, baking heat, and any moisture, on thin unprotected wood is not a recipe for longlife
I’m not familiar with the wetting and hammering of a joint, perhaps you could explain. By the description though it sounds like it would mesh the two pieces together better.
I do plan on doing a bit of practice over the coming weeks. Last thing I want to do is have to pull new veneer off the actual dash pieces! That would be a disaster.
When you’re joining veneer it is difficult to get a perfectly straight edge on both pieces. I start by clamping the two sheets together between two straight boards, then sand with a longboad to get it straight. Then I lay the two sheets side by side on a flat surface and join the two pieces with veneer tape at the back. To get the join really right I then flip the sheet over and moisten along the joint with water and a 1/4 - 3/8" brush. I let the water soak in, then with a planishing hammer polished to a mirror finish I gently hammer along the join just enough to make the wood fibres expand to fill any small gaps, and also relieve any tension in sections where the join is too tight.
Doing this does two things: It makes your sheet lie flatter during the layup and gluing, and it removes any small gaps which show up during the first few finishing layers.
I can’t remember where I learned this, probably in Fine Woodworking magazine, but it was a looong time ago.
I’m using a PPR adhesive called Ultra Cat. It’s supposed to be the glue for extreme conditions like what might be encountered on a dash cap. Downside is it requires minimum of 70 degrees F for four hours to cure. Living in Seattle means there are few days of the year I could do this without some heat assistance. I plan on using an electric blanket to eliminate this concern.
Will be running some test pieces this weekend. Will mock up a complex curve or two. I have some veneer softening at moment for this purpose. I bought plenty of extra veneer for this reason. Will also test various finish options. Striving for an authentic old-style look with a matte finish.
I use a moisture activated foaming polyurethane. It’s a bit unforgiving if you don’t get the veneer positioned just right before and while bagging the piece, but then again - I never make mistakes.
I would suggest you find a local supplier for West System Epoxies. I’ve used their stuff in boatbuilding. If it’s good enough to hold a boat together salt water under tropical and arctic conditions it’ll probably be ok for the dash.
I mocked up a small piece of wood today to replicate the complexity of the glovebox door with the compound curves. Intent was to test three things 1) whether I could get the veneer to conform to the compound curves, 2) how well the PPR adhesive works, and 3) whether placing the walnut veneer on top of the anigre would provide a satisfactory result (instead of a butt joint). As you can see in the picture I didn’t bother getting too precise with the fit (e.g. you can see the seam on the curve and I wasn’t super precise with the walnut either). I also used dark glue which can be tinted lighter when using light wood…but didn’t bother lightening it under the anigre. This makes the seam on the corner really show as with the glue lightened it would blend in. This seam is really just a notch cut out to be able to fold the veneer over the corner and lie flat.
I have a few modifications to make on my technique but I’m pleased to have successfully tested all three things I was after. I’ll need to be a bit more precise with the mitering on the curves but even with my hastened technique it wasn’t bad. The PPR adhesive worked without a hitch even though I initially thought I mixed it too thin. I did use a heating pad on it t get the temp up over 70F (my barn is unheated and it was in high 40s this morning and only got up to high 50s). For all the other mating of walnut to anigre on the dash the seams will be butted, but on the glovebox door placing the walnut on top of the anigre seems to be satisfactory and also makes dealing with the compound curves easier.
I’ll be testing a few finishing techniques on this piece in the near future.
just to enquire how you are treating the chamfered areas, on for example the pictured glovebox lid?
did you veneer the chamfer with straight veneer, then the flat with burr, joined and sanded?
I noticed with MK8-10 that the whole item seems to be venered with straight cut, then burr layed over that, but but only on the flat, others seem to be burr veneer all over, and other again seem to have veneer on flat surface only, sanded mahogany base wood on chamfer
The picture is a made up piece of wood to replicate the complexity of the glove box lid. It’s not the actual lid…I’m not quite ready for that. That said, the lighter veneer (which in anigre) is one continuous piece that covers the whole piece. There are only two notch cutouts required to enable it to conform around the corners. The walnut burl is simply then glued right on top of the anigre. With the glove box beveled edges this technique works as you can sand the transition smooth and it becomes unnoticeable. Elsewhere on the dash this technique won’t work as well and I’ll use butt joints.
There are solid pieces of wood on the dash, for example on either side of the center instrument panel. I don’t know if this is mahogany…but looks like it could be. I’ve seen Mk2s where this is left as bare wood and some where it’s veneered. I’ll be veneering mine. I don’t know how these came from the factory.
That’s exactly what I use…see the last picture. Paid $50 to a former HVAC technician on Craigslist.
Andrew is correct that you need strong forms to work with a pump like this. Pulling close to a full vacuum puts 2k pounds per square foot of pressure on the piece. Can easily do damage if not setup correctly.
Next up for me will be cutting and fitting veneer pieces. I’m satisfied with my prototype run. Still sort through some finishing options, but have time to figure that out.
I know what I need. I just don’t live in a place where they appear on the used marked: neither often, nor for a decent price. Last time I saw a used one here it was about 500$.
I don’t plan on reveneering another dash. I’ve done 4 whole cars and a few individual bits. If I do get a hankering to do another dash then I’ll probably just buy a new vacuum pump and pay the shipping and import duties.
Switzerland is different. My woodworking “Shop” is about as big as what you would call a decent sized bathroom. In there I have a drillpress, an Inca tablesaw, a Myford lathe, and all the other stuff one would expect - I have to be circumspect about what tools I acquire - good kit does come on the market, for a price, but I don’t do much woodwork anymore.
Besides, the next major project is to make an astronomical regulator from scratch. I’m still thinking about design and tooling. At the rate I work it will probably take me close to a decade until I’ve got a working movement, then I’ll start on a case.
Had a nice warm weekend here in Seattle so started on with the vacuum veneering of various dash parts. Got the dash top complete in raw form…has not been sanded, sealed, finished, etc. Below pictures are as they came out of the press (save for a wipe of water to make the wood pop a bit). The dash top is burled walnut and anigre for the accents. I purchased some pelin veneer that is beautiful and was originally planning on using this for the accents…but deemed it would compete too much with the walnut, so went with the more subdued anigre. I did decide to veneer the inside of the glove box and eventually the picnic tables with the pelin as it’s too beautiful to not use somewhere. That piece is completely flat but gives the illusion of peaks and valleys. Should be stunning when finished.
Process overall is time consuming and a bit tedious…but worth the efforts. Vacuum press worked perfectly and with four hour press times for the glue to cure gives ample time to work on fit-up of other pieces. Will be a few weeks before all the veneering is done, then onto finishing. I have learned some interesting grain filling techniques that result in an extremely smooth finish. The process uses pumice and sealing shellac and should eliminate the joint lines visible where pieces were book- matched.
excellent work…i dyed a grain-filling mix just a little darker to cover any joins and sand lightly, otherwise once clear coated the crack stands out like you-know-whats on you-know-whats
