New (to me) '70 E-Type 2+2 with perhaps odd vaccum and wierd plusing lights!

I suggest that you update your profile with the type of car you have '70 S2. 4sp? AC? PS? I have a few comments on removing the water pump if your car has AC & PS.

Good reminder @ozusa. I updated the profile.

The car is a 1970 SII, Auto, with both A/C and P/S. - Yes, I know…Automatic 2+2…not everyone’s idea of an E-Type, but its what I fit into and what I wanted :slight_smile: -) I wouldn’t want it any other way.

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This may help with how to approach the water pump removal if you haven’t done it yet: Notes on Water Pump Removal – Engine in-situ with Aircon & Power-Steering

Thanks - I’ll read it over. I haven’t started taking the pump off yet - but at a glance it looks relatively straight forward. I’m sure there are a few “remove this to get to that” issues.

This might also help. The hoses should work for you, but the belts will be different for a late car with P/S:

Don’t bother trying to order the belts, there are enough variations to guarantee that what you get won’t be right. Just bring the old belts down to the store and try to match them. If you turn up any new interchanges, let me know and I’ll update my page.

Thanks -

I’ve ordered a hose kit from XKs, along with three of the four belts - my hope is that XKs know what fits, but I’m not sure I’ve ever received a kit (for anything) that was actually 100% right, so I’ll definitely refer to your document. I do like the idea of a one-piece lower hose - whatever made Jaguar use a two-piece?

The original 2 piece hase has a metal tube in the middle. Is is so that the hose doesn’t collapse at high speed and “lots of suck” from the water pump. Notice that even the all rubber ones have a metal “coil spring” inside to hold the hose open.
LLoyd

Society has discovered discrimination as the great social weapon by which one may kill men without any bloodshed.
Hannah Arendt

Actually, that coupling is an excellent place to put a fan switch. But at the time, Jaguar was putting the switch at the hottest point of the system. It wasn’t until the V12 came along that they realized that what matters is the temperature of the coolant entering the block. I always wondered if they hadn’t been arguing about relocating the switch to the last minute before production. I have some thermoswitch adapters made up if you want to experiment.

You know, I was just thinking the other day that its odd that my fans spin up immediately. In most electric fan applications I’m aware of, including those I;ve installed and retrofitted myself, there is always a thermoswitch to cycle the fans -sometimes a simple ground switch in the intake, sometimes more elaborate. In my E-Type though, the fans just come on when you turn the key to “on” and stay that way. I assumed that was normal for this car. Am I to take it that the fans should be controlled?

I’ll say this much though, even with a clearly wonky water pump, the car never ran hot - stayed about midway to a hair over midway on the gauge.

There is a device on the front of the radiator, opposite of the upper radiator hose neck called an otter switch. As the coolant heats up the otter switch is activated and closes the circuit, starting the fans. So your fans should not come on until the coolant entering the radiator reaches a certain temperature.
I forget the exact value but it’s around 180F - 185F, IIRC. When the temperature of the coolant drops below a certain value the fans shut off.

If you have air conditioning the fans run constantly while the air conditioning is running. If your car’s fans are running as soon as the ignition is turned to the on position and the air conditioning is off it is possible that a previous owner has bypassed the otter switch with a jumper wire so the circuit is always completed.

It does have A/C, but its non-functional as of now (and never did function even when new, according to the previous owner’s father). All the parts are there, but turning the dash switch does nothing. Could be it needs recharged, I know that at least for some Chevy compressors, they will not activate if the volume of R12 or R34A is too low, so perhaps that is the case here. Something to investigate after I her her back up and running.

The original thermostat used in S2’s was set for 74C later cars had 82c thermostats. The otter switch should turn the fan on around 85C. I think the very late cars had a hotter fan switch. Break point was around 7R5264/7R37490.

Just as a possible reference point I recently got a new digital oven thermometer. It has started to cool off some in Texas so took my non-AC '68 FHC out for an around town drive on one day last week. It was in the low 80’s F outside. Got back home and let it idle in the driveway for a while too. The gauge needle was on the A in NORMAL. Shut off engine and slowly opened cap on the radiator and coolant read 187F on the oven thermometer . Probably can be some variations in gauge accuracy from car to car. I have the twin Coolcat fans on my car.

David
68 E-type FHC

Does that mean it takes ten minutes to fry an egg on the sidewalk instead of five? :joy::joy::joy:

The XKE A/C ain’t that smart.

SO, operation “water pump removal” was renamed “operation Impossible task” and was subsequently renamed “Operation @#&#&!! @@#&#*!!!” and finally named “Operation [Censored]” However, said operation is now complete, so far no leaks and the grindy, rattly noise is gone. There are however other issues now, which I’ll detail later, but first - for anyone reading this at a later time and looking to replace their water pump…here is some info…

There are several threads on water pump removal, some more detailed than others and it varies depending on which series of car and whether or not you have AC. So …here is my short version of just the A/C / Alt bracket combo.

Car: 1970 2+2 with A/C and Power Steering.

1 - There are, count them, 9 bolts / nuts that hold on the combination A/C Alternator bracket. If you think 9 bolts / nuts is insane, it is. I have never seen anything more over done, there aren’t even that many bolts holding the engine to the frame…but I digress. Assuming you have removed the Alternator, belts and hoses …

  1. There are two 5/8th bolts under the AC compressor that hold the bracket to the engine block - both accessible with long extensions.

  2. Moving up, you will note two nuts that hold the A/C compressor to the block, to the left of the forward exhaust manifold - I found removing these much easier than removing the single bolt on the same bracket - these are 1/2 inch.

  3. Moving to the left and forward, you will see a bolt (partially hidden by the bracket arm) on the top of the water pump, also 1/2 inch - this is one of 5 bolts that connect through the bracket to the water pump itself.

  4. The upper bolt of the powersteering pump connects through the P/S bracket, through the A/C / Alt bracket and into the Water pump. This can be accessed best from the front wheel-well, looking under and to the left of the A/C compressor pulley, or potentially from under the car.

  5. There are now three bolts remaining, all in a quad pattern (the P/S bolt was the fourth). These are tricky to get to - again, possibly an under-the-car thing, but that wasn’t a option for me. The best method is to remove the lower P/S pump bolt and get the P/S bracket and pump out of the way. This will make the lower left water pump bolt more accessible. Next, you need to separate and remove the water pump pulley - it is not immediately obvious that the pulley is in two parts, but it is. If you separate them, it is possible, though takes some patience, to remove the pulley. This provides room enough to snake your hand around and get to the three remaining bolts (all 1/2 inch).

Once these have been removed, you should be able to pull the entire AC/ Alt bracket, along with the A/C compressor to the side, just enough to give you room to work. You can remove the A/C compressor from the bracket, but I didn’t find it necessary. At this point, you can go ahead and remove the other water pump bolts, don’t forget the one on the bottom - this too is a bit of a pain, but I found a really long extension from the far side of the picture frame, positioned between the electric fans, worked well. These are also 1/2 inch. You may now remove the water pump and yell victory!..I believe I yelled " I have exorcised the demon"…then looked around to see who might be calling the medics.

Most every hose, bolt, nut and belt during this project was a royal PITA. Just be aware of that and understand it going in. I’ve worked on cars these last 20-odd years - replaced engines, lumped Jaguars, converted this to that, swapped heads, manifolds - you name it. I count this blasted water pump among the more frustrating - not “hard” per say, but frustrating.

The various bolts are different lengths and pitches. Sorry, I should have posted this for you:

This might help you to sort out the weird vacuum plumbing that was introduced in 1970 to the EX/EM cars.

http://www.xkebooks.com/images/1970%20Specs.PDF

Richard Liggitt

LOL - Yea, that was another thing that would have made me laugh, had I not been semi-homicidal. The only two bolts I am not sure about, order wise, are the two at the bottom, under the P/S pump, but to be honest I think they were the same length, and this isn’t the first time the pump has been replaced, so who knows what bolts were used.

@rcliggitt This is a great resource! thank you!