Newbie to XJ6 series 1

XJ
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Further updates, the AC compressor is an Italian made unit, Aspero Frigo and the size of a small battleship, it seems to be working and still charged and looks the correct vintage but makes getting at the bottom mounted alternator a PITA so will come off in due course to be replaced by something more sensible. Thanks for the suggestion of the later XJ6 model.The alternator is a Lucas but I can’t see the model number till I get the unit out, I tried this morning but access is difficult till I get the use of a ramp next week. The car was originally registered in Italy, 1L 50267 BW by the way and was originally silver with blue trim, now BRG with beige trim. The other Italian addition is a switch by the drivers left knee which switches between the sedate jaguar horns and a pair of strident Fiame air horns a la Ferrari. I’m slowly getting to know the car not helped by the fact there’s no owners manual with it and I still haven’t received my service manual. The wiring at the back of the dash seems more or less stock, just one added bit of blue wire that I can see. Can’t do much more this weekend, her indoors is requesting jobs be done so needs must. One thing I have noticed is that the tyres are dated 1997 so need changing urgently and even more surprising, there is no British rustproofing on the underside, not a drop of oil has escaped the motor, is it real? The motopr runs very smoothly and quietly with now tappett noise or timing chain rattle.
The odometer shows less than 21000 kms and the seller says he suspects it may be genuine. I know it was last used in 1997 from the registration documents which came with it so if I can find someone in Italy who can help me I’d like to try to verify it’s history, ex mafia maybe?
I’ll keep updating the forum as I go because no doubt I’ll need your help as I go If anyone has an owners manual for a series one, even a photocopy for the moment, I’d be interested to buy it. Let me know.

Thanks again.

Ian

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I’m about to acquire a Series 1 with an owners manual and service manual. I will keep you posted. I’m trading my Series III that I picked up a couple of weeks ago for a Pink Series 1. The only redeeming quality is that the car is a Series I fully documented, and well maintained up until the current owner. he wants to turn it into a Lump. I’m trading it more or less to save it. It’s going to be a ton of work to get it back to some sort of original state. I think I’m going insane.

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The phrase “save it” resonates with me. When I rejoined the Jaguar Drivers Club of Australia I met the XJ Register secretary and commented to him that I had a Series 1 for his books, restored after 23 years. His response was “another one saved”. It was a spiritual experience for him. Paul

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Thanx Paul… Im having a bit of trouble with my motives. Sacrificing a series III, but i think it will be worth it, right? Please tell me right… :confused:

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Thanks Mark, your motives are admirable.

Ian

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The compressor is either an aftermarket, replacing a defective original, Ian - or the AC system may be an Italian aftermarket.

But no matter, if it works there is no reason to replace it at this stage, ‘in due course’ is fair enough. In fact; better use the time and money to fix known faults as they are identified or appear. When accessing the alternator; check for the brown/black - detaching it should eliminate the warning lamp. In addition; on some alternators the warning lamp circuits serves as an exciter - getting the alt charging. As alternators usually ‘self-starts’ due to remanent magnetism it’s unlikely that the loss of charging is due to a disconnected brown/black…but still…

You seem to have got a remarkable specimen, and your problems is likely to be minor ones - though access sometimes require contortions. The Italian owner may have been driving his Ferrari, hence the fitting of the Fiumes - but at some times in Italy; if you were not heard, you were not seen…:slight_smile:

As an aside; a xk engine not leaking oil must be empty…:slight_smile:

Frank
xj6 85 Sov Europe (UK/NZ)
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Ian,

this is very remarkable indeed, first because in my impression, the 4.2 l cars were hardly sold in Italy due to Italy’s restrictive tax policy - the 2.8 l models, otherwise considered ugly ducklings, were purposefully designed for markets as the Italian. But then the extremely low mileage makes your car appear even more unique. With the low mileage, do you have any information when and why the “restyling” took place? What kind of interior was used?

I wouldn’t think of the mafia as first owner - they changed cars more frequently and didn’t stick with outdated cars -, but rather a retired commendatore or - even more likely given the lack of oil leaks - the catholic church. This is also indicated by the unobtrusive switch between original horns and Fiamms - no Italian driver, let alone family member, would have cared to leave the original horn setup intact. When Monsignore was hauled to the Vatican, the chauffeur would use the original horns and when the chauffeur zoomed down the autostrada alone, he’d beam away slower Fiats with the Fiamms …

In fact, when my horns failed last year I was tempted to install Fiamm air horns as well - fortunately it turned out to be a simple electric cause of failure …

With regard to your AC I can’t help out. It seems that the factory “Air conditioning equipment (early) cars” is described in section R of the SI ROM. While I do have an online version at my hands, it ends at section Q unfortunately. In a way, it seems strange, however, that an Italian buyer in a position to afford a 4.2 litre car and not drive it afterwards would not order the factory AC …

The XJ series cars had poor rustproofing ex factory. The Swiss importer, Emil Frey, treated all cars imported to Switzerland to a waxoyl rustproofing, making them very desirable original examples today. Maybe in Italy nobody found this necessary at the time and - nel mezzogiorno - it actually was not.

As for the engine running so quietly: Wonderful, just check for valve clearances. With a car driven so little, even overly tight clearances may have been tolerated, but you shouldn’t tempt fate.

When I got my car in 2007, it was oil tight as well, but it hasn’t remained like this … As Frank wrote: Make sure there is enough oil in the engine!

Good luck

Jochen

75 XJ6L 4.2 auto (UK spec)

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If you post a few pics of the alternator, listers can probably identify it,

most alt failures are loose wire or bad brushes, which on many Lucas, can be replaced in situ for a few $

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Hi Mark, if I try to remain unbiased: the Series III is supposed to be a better drive and quieter but the Series 1 is prettier to many both internally and externally. Also, so it is said, Lyons’ personal favourite - absent any Leyland influence. At least in Australia they are rarer and becoming more valuable. I think that you are doing the right thing. Paul

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Mark, Jochen is right about valve clearances. On a 4.2 they should be 0.012 (inlet) and 0.014 (exhaust) from memory. Smaller engines are 0.004 and 0.006. Our 3.4 Mk2 is running down to 0.002 on the inlet side - it’s not going anywhere until I bring back to spec - very quiet - like a big sewing machine. Paul

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I have a Series II and 2 Series III’s, XJR, 3 XJS’s; the XJS’s aside, I enjoy driving the Series III the best. Good handling, smooth riding, and quiet.

The XJR-100
Is a beauty, the power is intoxicating, the ride resembles that of a BMW, the handling is amazing. Still don’t like it.

The Series II
I drive my Series II to Seattle and back, and by the time I get back I’m worn out. Granted the Series II is a serious work in progress and strives to be a Hagerty Grade 4.

Minimal interior no carpets bare trunk (working on the Rust), No bonnet liner, The Glorious XK6 music turns into a mind numbing drone.

Steering resembles that of a yacht, Lots of input with little movement. I will say this about the car, I can do a U-turn in a two lane road - something isn’t possible in any of my Jags.

I get a ton of complements with the Series II that I don’t get with the Series III.

Thanx Paul,
Onward with the Series I, and my Sincere apologies to the Series III. It’s got nearly 150,000 on the clock, rust in all of the wrong places. It was always going to be a transition car (something for my Son to take to school and work) until my Green Series III gets back from the body man. it will be ok. :wink: Again, Thanx Paul

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Nothing wrong with that but IIRC the actual spec is 0.012-0.014 both intake and exhaust. But exhaust on the high side is considered good.

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Expect that us right. It’s a while since I have set them! Paul

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Might be an idea for Ian to check whether he may have a scarce 2,8, Jochen…?

A preliminary check would be the presence/absence of the expansion tank on the left inside the engine compartment. Apart from engine numbers, there are no instantly externally recognisable differences between the 2,8 and the 4,2 - or indeed much difference elsewhere on the car. And equipment level may vary with country…

Verifying the engine may have some advantage at some stage…?

Frank
xj6 85 Sov Europe (UK/NX)
**

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Frank,

you’re right. Yet, the car # 1L 50267 BW clearly indicates the 267th LHD 4.2 l Jaguar XJ ever built. So, at least there should be a big block in the car.

If it had been replaced by a small block, the expansion tank mounted on the engine would be a giveaway sign, but I doubt the care would have been taken to replace the expansion tank on the left wing. I’m fairly sure though that the small block is considerably lower than the big block. And, doesn’t the big “Jaguar” sign cast into the right side of the block also include displacement? Of course, access is not easy …

Best

Jochen

XJ6L 4.2 auto (UK spec)

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Yes, probably due to the shorter stroke. I found this out in a frustrating way. I bought a stainless exhaust system from Dick Ames (now deceased), a US vendor. This was in the 1980s. I fitted it to my S1 4.2, and everything was fine except that the downpipes were about an inch too short–with the horizontal portion just able to clear the undercarriage, the flange for attachment to the manifolds couldn’t reach them. Ames assured me that it was correct. I wound up cutting the downpipes and splicing in some extra tubing.

It was decades later when I concluded that I had bought “correct” downpipes for a 2.8.

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The simple way to ID a 2.8 is look at the back of the block below the head. There is no blanking plate. Due to the fact that the block isn’t as tall.

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Well, I’ve never messed with a 2.8. And only very briefly with the 4.2.

But, if the difference is in the stroke, it should not be hard to determine.

  1. Check the spec’s for the stroke of each. AKA, the vertical seep of the piston in the bore. 3//4 vs 1/2 inches. Example only.

  2. Remove a spark plug. Use the technique of a rod in the hole for finding TDC. But, here measure maxx down vs max up. That is stroke.

  3. If a known engine of either CC is available, use that technique.

Way back when flat head V8s were “stroked” by offset grinding of the crank throw. . One with a full 4" sounded just "bigger’ than one with a mere 3/4’.

A tale of mixing up the two for another day

Carl

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The 2.8 was a bad engine They burnt out pistons very often.You don’t want to ever get involved with them.

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Indeed, Carl - the 2,8 stroke is about 3,4", the 4,2 is 4,2’’…

The difference of about 0,8" is virtually undetectable on the outside…

As Nigel say, the 2,8 had a reputation for burning pistons, cause being unclear - but the smaller engine had to work quite a lot harder…:wink:

Frank
xj6 85 Sov Europe UK/NZ)
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