[pre-xk] MKV Floor, once and for all

Pre-XK
1

Hi,

It seemed easier for me to draw stuff in Photoshop before
starting to cut the felt and especially before applying the
bitum based sound deadening to replace Mutocel.

So here I have a bunch of photos from my car when I have
drawn various bits and pieces.

I remember that there were indeed many small errors in the
MKV parts book, but some of these are really confusing and
take a lot of interpretation:

The Saloon part is much more descriptive, maybe this is
because they didn’t provide as many pictures as for the DHC.
(Saloon body = 1 plate, DHC body = 2 plates)

Most of the felt and Mutocel parts listed on page 77 (Saloon
Body Fittings) can be found on pages 105 and 106 (Body And
Fittings, Mark V Coupe Only) and the ones for the rear seat
may indeed be a bit different, but I think the ones for the
floor should be identical and the floor pressings are identical.

  1. BD.2429 Felt in depressions at Rear of Floor 2 pcs (Saloon)
    BD.2429 Felt (Disc) 4 pcs (Coup�)

I think 4 is the right number as these are for the two fake
and two real floor mounts. Or then the ones with the bolts
did not have a felt disc in the beginning.

  1. BD.2443 Felt, under Carpet for Clutch Housing Cover 1 pcs
    (Saloon)
    BD.2443 Felt for Clutch Housing 2 pcs (Coup�)

Surely only one piece?

But then there’s also BD.3127 Felt for end of Gearbox Cover
2 pcs (Coup�) but surely this was only one and also used in
Saloons? As BD.2458 Felt, under Carpet for Gearbox Cover is
the same 1 pcs for both.

  1. Then there’s a big bunch of felt on page 106, especially
    BD.5201-BD.5206 that do not appear for the Saloon. Lucklily
    the have provided the sizes so I’m going to cut those out of
    cardboard and see where they could fit (!?!) I’ll of course
    report back here.

Did some of these replace earlier ones? (no numbers or
explanations to be found in this book) as BD.5201 Felt,
Floor depressions (7 1/2’’ x 5 1/4’’) could be replacement for
either BD.2425 or BD.2426. The large ‘‘Cushion Roll’’ (51’’ x
14 1/2’’) BD.5203 and BD.5204 and BD.5205 ‘‘Pedal boards’’ (2
pcs of each) as well as BD.5206 Felt, Gearbox Cowl, Inner
(16 1/2’’ x 9 1/2’’) seem really strange…’‘inner’’ to what?
Inside the cabin or inside the Gearbox Cowl?

I think most of these are due to the Saloon being ready for
production first and some things were either changed later
(and for the coup�) or left out of the books first edition
due to haste.

Please feel free to comment what you have found and
especially anything concerning the size on the the Mutocel
‘‘parts’’ and if there was any on the toeboards or not, as
well as he amount of felts used in some areas.

Cheers,
Pekka T. - 647194

http://www.jag-lovers.org/v.htm?1232796235--
MKV 3.5L DHC, E-type 2+2 Ser.1 MOD, XJ6C MOD, XJ8 Executive
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2

In reply to a message from ptelivuo sent Sat 24 Jan 2009:

Ok, I was able to cut and finish almost all felt pieces this
evening, the first layer is complete and the largest piece
for the second one is almost done.

I didn’t cut the edges for it however as I started to wonder
again. The MKV Service Manual does talk about ‘‘pressing with
a screw driver’’ when referring to getting the carpet back
into the ‘‘rocker sill channels’’. Now I don’t have those, but
I think the BD.4045 Retainer for Carpets (by Doors) would be
the same problem. Which is my first issue:

How can one get the felt and the carpet to fit inside that
retainer (or the rocker sill channel)? With a screw driver?
not likely with the felt I have at hand. I was also thinking
that maybe the retainers were screwed on top of the felt,
but unlikely as that would take away the benefit of having a
retainer. Maybe in a DHC the felt should not go all the way
to the edge? That is should the felt be cut so that the
retainer will be clear of it and will only take the edge of
the carpet?

So now you know why I didn’t cut it, yet! I thought I had
seen a picture of the jacking access plates, but maybe I
haven’t at least I could not find it. I’ll have to also
check the Driver’s Handbook once I have a chance.

The same fine pages in the MKV Service Manual, N.16 & N.17
have a paragraph about Carpets, Remove and Refit that says:
‘‘Note that carpets and underfelts , excepting toeboard
carpet and underfelt, are solutioned in position during
original assembly.’’ Huh? :frowning:

Now that may answer my second question, but it’s funny they
didn’t mention the (both) front floor carpets, and the
gearbox cowl carpet that they have just told us how to
remove! Which make me think that the big rear carpet is
probably not glued originally either as the seat rail
screws, retainers or rocker sill channels will also keep it
in place and as the jacking instructions say, the rear edge
can be raised to gain access to the rear jacking points.

My second question would be that since the Toeboard Carpet
(BD.2450, GZ.26 plate GZ) can be removed by releasing the
four fasterners at the top (I still have them) what keeps
the felt (BD.2442 Felt, under Carpet, for Dash Front) in
position? It is glued? I think it also has to end a bit
before the fasteners for the carpet, that is just a bit
lower so the carpet can be properly attached.

I’d hate to cut something too short only to find out that it
wasn’t supposed to be so (I only have the amount of felt
I’ll need) or glue something onto the scuttle or floor only
to try and remove it a few days later…doh!

This makes me think that should the felt under the gearbox
cowl carpet be glued to the gearbox cowl or not? Maybe not,
it’ll probably stay there if the carpet is also only held in
place by gravity and that toeboard carpet on top of it!

Rob? Anyone?

I’ll try and cut the ‘‘mystery pieces’’ that I have dimensions
for tomorrow and see what I can come up with.

Cheers!
Pekka T. - 647194–
MKV 3.5L DHC, E-type 2+2 Ser.1 MOD, XJ6C MOD, XJ8 Executive
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3

In reply to a message from ptelivuo sent Sat 24 Jan 2009:

Ok, I did most of it and report here what I found out.

I didn’t yet cut the BD.5203 Cushion roll (51’’ x 4-1/2’’) but
my guess is that based on the measures it would be the 1/2’’
felt between the dash and the top of the scuttle.

  1. Felts on page 106, especially BD.5201-BD.5206
    So I really do believe that these replaced earlier ones, I
    guess no one knows if they changed this officially, at least
    there are no chassis numbers related, but these parts are
    not to be found in the early versions of the MKV spare parts
    book, this information is from the JDHT CD-ROM revised in
    1958 version.

BD.5201 Felt, Floor depressions (7 1/2’’ x 5 1/4’’) could be
replacement for BD.2425 as it fits in the front depression
in the footwell.

BD.5204 ‘‘Pedal boards’’ (2 pcs of each) 18’’ x 16’’ is most
likely the 1/2’’ felt under the front carpets, size fits well.

BD.5205 ‘‘Pedal boards’’ (2 pcs of each) 18’‘x 13-1/2’’ would
then be the actual pedal boards, replacing the complex one
piece BD.2442.

BD.5206 Felt, Gearbox Cowl, Inner (16 1/2’’ x 9 1/2’’) would
actually seem to fit inside the Gearbox Cowl, so maybe that
replaced the Mutocel later in production. It would seem too
small to replace the felt for the cabin side of the gearbox
cover (BD.2458).

I don’t think they ever changed the floor panels, that would
not make any sense, but it is likely they simplified the
felt pieces for the front footwells and pedal boards as
these would be the area where the carpets and underfelts
would get most dirt, water, wear and abuse, and would thus
need to be replaced most often.

This could also be a DHC issue, but I doubt that, they made
ca. 1.000 DHC’s and 18.000 Saloons and the floors and felts
are the same.

These pieces give me the idea that the felts under these
front carpets were indeed a bit smaller than the carpets,
thus allowing the fasteners (Durable Dot on Toeboard carpet
and BD.637 Spring Bow Type on Front carpets) to be screwed
onto the floor and the carpets the attached (four at the top
of the toeboard carpet and two at the front and three at the
rear edge of each front carpet, right?)

Then BD.5202 Felt, battery (7’‘x6’’) 2 pcs, this seems very
much the same as the original piece on my car glued onto the
backwall of the battery compartment, on the inside of the
cabin under the dash. The only thing that puzzles me is that
they say 2 pcs when I only have one. maybe there was one on
the underside and it’s gone on my car (the underside was
rusty) or maybe these both were on LH and RH side of the
heater on the bottom of the battery tray, but it could again
by an error by the same typist who suggested there would be
2 pcs of the felt for the gearbox cover end (hardly
possible?) and who could not tell the difference between
pedal board and heel board or floor board, huh?
(BD.5204 2 pcs and BD.5205 2 pcs are all called ‘‘Pedal
boards’’, now surely there were no cars with four ''pedal
boards, were there? :slight_smile:

Cheers,
Pekka T. - 647194
PS. The mystery continues with more discoveries…–
MKV 3.5L DHC, E-type 2+2 Ser.1 MOD, XJ6C MOD, XJ8 Executive
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4

Pekka, I applaud you for making the first forays into trying to understand
all this mess in the parts catalogue. I admit I have not attempted it until
today, when one of your statements intrigued me and I began to study it
more.
There were indeed two pieces of felt on the rear face of my gearbox tunnel,
a double layer, so I submit that it is not a misprint.
However, as I dug into it further I came to believe that the list of felts
in the saloon body section represents the early cars without the side vents,
and the list in the DHC section represents all later cars with side vents.
The saloons section only calls for (2) felts in the scuttle sides, but I
have (4) in mine as the DHC section calls for because I have side vents.
And there are some inconsistencies that have yet to be sorted out.
For example the saloons section calls for (2) BD2429 Felts for Depressions
in the Rear Floor, but the DHC section calls for (4) of these and just says
they are Discs. That makes more sense, because I have 4 round depressions
and they are in the front floor, not the rear.
The felts in the saloon roof are also missing from the list.
BTW there were about 9500 saloons.
So between your observations and mine, perhaps we can put together a more
accurate list of what all these felt pieces are.
On Saturday I will pull out my box of old felt bits and see if I can
identify them.
Rob Reilly - 627933> but it could again

be an error by the same typist who suggested there would be
2 pcs of the felt for the gearbox cover end (hardly
possible?)

5

In reply to a message from R_and_J_Reilly sent Thu 29 Jan 2009:

Hi there,

Another difficult topic: the Jaguar MKV Service Manual and
Operating & Maintainance Handbook pictures and the
differences of the pre-production cars used for the
photographs and reality.

I have added a few pictures from these book that some of you
most likely have, but just to make sure we all know what I’m
talking about.

http://www.jag-lovers.org/v.htm?1235747585

I have included also Plate GZ to help identify some bits.

First the carpets, should the front carpets be like in the
picture Plate GZ (GZ.24 and GZ.25) so that they are roughly
rectangular and end below the front seats before the front
seat rails, or like in the Plate 7 from the Handbook?

I suspect the picture in the handbook is from a
pre-production MKV Saloon and this difference (the front
carpets being extended along the sill) so they overlap the
main carpet was not used in production, but can anyone
confirm or deny that?

My carpets are being made at Coverdale’s in the UK, thanks
to a tip from this forum and I have sent them the patterns,
but as I had no original carpets to begin with I don’t know
about these details.

The second question is concerning the heelboard below the
rear seat. Plate N.14 from the Service Manual shows a DHC
with the rear seat cushion removed and it looks like the top
edge of the heelboard carpet has vinyl (or Rexine) wrapped
around the top edge of the heelboard. I know the carpet will
be glued, but it’s hard to tell from this picture if:

a) the vinyl just goes around the egde?

b) the carpet continues onto the rear seat underpanel?

c) there is carpet or Hardura on the metal panel under the seat?

Too bad we don’t know what the colours are in these B/W
pictures, this DHC clearly has a light interior colour and
piping in the same light colour. The only ‘‘Pale Blue’’
interiors I have seen in pictures both had dark blue piping,
but I doubt that was standard. Then again I can wait for a
very long time for anyone to show my otherwise (a Pale Blue
interior without dark blue piping) :slight_smile:

Cheers,
Pekka T. - 647194–
MKV 3.5L DHC, E-type 2+2 Ser.1 MOD, XJ6C MOD, XJ8 Executive
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