Bought a jag master cylinder from Parts Geek. The pic showed the plastic elbows were included, of course they were not which was not a big surprise.
SO, is there a source for the elbows, or an alternative?
Thanks
Bob
Heads up that the brand new vac booster that I was unable to fit is for sale in the classifieds.
Bob
You believe it will fit the pre-ABS car just fine?
It is the correct PN for the pre-abs car. So I would expect it to fit.
Just found this for sale on eBay:
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F352891587730
Thanks John and Happy New Year!
OOP! Jumped the queue, PM to Bob.
Thanks guys! I have already sourced the mc and fittings so I am set. Thanks for looking out for me!
Project has slowed a bit due to some family commitments but hoping to get back to it this week.
Bob
Progress continues.
Regarding removing the Teves III system:
There are 3 pipes on the FW held on my these nifty clamps. Two of these pipes can be removed, the supply pipe (big one) takes fluid from the bottom of the MC reservoir to the Teves pump, and the pressure line which sends pressurized fluid back to the MC. The 3rd line is for the right front wheel. To remove these the little metal cover has to be fully removed from the rubber block, then there are slots on the front of the rubber block and you can pop the line free.
The screwdriver in this pic points to the connector for the famous engine speed sensor / aka flywheel sensor on the Marelli cars.
Once the lines are freed from the right and left rubber blocks, they can be pulled thru from the left side of the car. Here they are after removal.
Still left to do is removing the Teves III pump and accumulator ball assembly. This is the same mounting surface that the pedal box uses on a RHD car. I am kind of excited about reclaiming this space, I am thinking about moving the coolant overflow tank from inside the fender up to here.
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Since the Summit 8" booster uses a slightly smaller bolt pattern than the Jag booster that I tried to used previously, we had to make a new adapter plate. The bolt pattern is small enough that we could only use two of the existing Teves MC holes. The âouterâ two holes got milled away when we were clearancing for mounting studs and nuts. We added the other two to complete the pattern. This means there is no going back to Teves with this pedal box, two of the mounting holes are gone. I am pretty broken up about that.
It is far easier to assemble the pedal box on the bench than in the car. Here is a shot of the linkages all buttoned up.
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Here is a look at the mill work on the bottom of the pedal box. If you look closely right above the near booster stud you can see what is left of the threads on one of the original Teves mounting holes.
As previously mentioned, the Teves clevis is the wrong thread size and too short to reach the Summit booster. Here is the new clevis we fabbed next to the original.
One unforeseen obstacle was that my pedal box and pedals were from a RHD car. They âswept leftâ which is the opposite of what is needed. The solution was to get after the clutch pedal with a torch and make it a mirror image of what it was, it needed to âsweep right.â For the brake pedal I cut down the face on an existing auto box pedal to be a close approximation of the manual box brake pedal. The face on the auto pedal is slightly shorter than a real manual brake pedal, but I am hoping a stock pedal pad will still fit. Worst case I have the actual manual brake pad, it unbolts, and I could mill this one off and attach the real deal. That feels like unnecessary work at this point.
I thought about keeping more of the auto box brake pedal, as it would make it easier for my un-talented self to heel and toe. But, 3 things: 1 - It looked weird. 2 - I want to try to use stock rubber pad and 3- you canât get the assembly with the big brake pedal thru the bulkhead, it wonât fit. Hereâs the pedal box hole, you can see the firewall and the inner bulkhead that you have to maneuver thru.
One more mod necessitated by the Summit booster is that the Jag MC mounting holes must be enlarged 1/16" outward. Which we did with a file as there is no way to get a hold of it in the mill. Not perfect, but doesnât show and fits fine.
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Are you sure it wouldnât have been easier to find a pre-ABS pedal box and modify it for a clutch pedal?
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Who knows. Maybe. Consider that unless you had one to look at, fabbing a clutch pedal and pivot bracket to get the geometry, linkages and stroke right is not a trivial undertaking. Youâre working with pretty heavy steel, you need to do some welding, and so on. Obviously itâs doable, thatâs what the kits that are available are. The easy route would have been to go throw down $600 for one of the kits. Which would probably result in at least 2-3 things that I would look at and think âI would have done that this wayâŚâ
However, if youâre just looking to convert a Teves auto trans car back to a vacuum auto trans car, then definitely go get a pedal box, thatâs just a bolt in. The only drama should be fabbing up some brake line connectors.
The rear brake line out of the Teves unit is larger than the other fittings, 12mm vs. 10mm. These are all bubble flare fittings, unlike inverted flare on many US cars. The rear brake circuit also features this âpressure delay valve.â No idea why, probably something to do with the boost pump supplying direct pressure to the rear brakes. (EDIT: I later learned that the rear brake outlet on the conventional MC is also 12mm⌠details a bit farther down.)
The booster and MC are all bolted up and ready to go. Donât forget to set the booster pushrod depth (if it is adjustable - on the Summit booster it is, and needed to be set.) Lots of youtube vids on this.
The clearance between the first nylon elbow and the cowl brace is tight, might require one washer under the brace just to be sure no rubbing occurs. You can see the front brake lines that I need to connect to down below, will require a T just like any non-ABS XJS. The rear connection is in the dark by the newspaper in the top of the pic. It is a pretty straight shot from the front port on the MC.
The car now features the correct number of pedals! Too bad the left one doesnât do anything yetâŚ
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Can you simply rotate the nylon elbow and use a longer hose to connect to the reservoir?
Good question, unfortunately no⌠Iâll get a pic with the brace in place⌠it passes right over the front half of the elbow, already the âlowestâ part. @gregma said he has like 3/4" clearance⌠so I guess this further âevidenceâ that the angle of the booster and MC on non-ABS cars must be a bit shallower.
Also, for the record, the elbows are a tight fit in the MC! I lubed everything up with brake fluid and could not press in by hand, either straight down or trying to cock them and starting with an edge. I ended up using a big C clamp and being careful to keep everything square, they finally popped in.
I picked up some brake line, couplers and a T fitting this morning at my local VW shop, the 10mm bubble flare is a common VW thing, who knew?
The last âproblemâ to solve is mounting my new Mitusbishi MC reservoir. I have a couple of bracket ideas, I might try to come right off the firewall rather than hooking to the pedal box. I will stew on things while I do the brake lines.
I have a faint recollection of similar issues, but I was trying to reinstall old nylon elbows with new rubber seals! I thought sure something was going to snap.
This is a fascinating story! Thanks for the sharing of it.
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I bought NLA elbows/seals as a kit, the rubber was way too hard, impossible to seat elbows. I ended up having to buy new seals (you can still get those without the elbows)
Definitely a high pucker factor for something so simple. Mine were NOS from eBay. I am embarrassed to say what I had to pay for them. They were all shiny and white and even the seals in the kit were in good shape. But yeah, I was thinking âbreak this thing and itâs gonna ruin your weekâŚâ Once in they are nice and snug and level, and I guess they wonât leak!