Hello all, once again, on behalf of my ever-seeking friend who is in the search of making an as close to original as possible XK120 tool roll reproduction, I am looking for a source of the buckle used on the strap that secured the tool roll after it was rolled up. The buckles used in todays XK120 tool roll reproductions seem to be the “modern” and “improved” buckles with a roller built into the buckle. Jaguar used a buckle, it seems, that was very simple and had no roller. Below are two images from an original XK120 tool roll. You would be amazed to know how much time has gone into seeking this item and hopefully a buckle of this type is still made. I realize, as with our search for the original Rexine used in the XK120 tool roll piping, we are being very picky. Thanks in advance for any all all suggestions, Gary
Gary, that’s called a “center bar buckle.” Look on eBay, and you may find something pretty close.
Another item not being accurately reproduced is the leather strap that secures the XK120 tool roll to the left side of the boot. That also used a center bar buckle. I have all the measurements and specifications from the original leather strap if anyone wishes to make-up a batch of them.
Hello Mike, and thank you Gary!
I have checked just about every Center Bar Buckle listed on eBay, Amazon, and a host of other websites. No luck so far. The “Original” Buckles were produced as a almost flat Stamping, rectangular with radius corners. Today’s Buckles are all “Cast” pieces so they have a 3 dimensional quality about them. This is what we do not need, unfortunately. They certainly look better and are available with or without “Rollers”.
As you can see in the pictures Gary S. had included, we are trying to find the “Old Style” Buckles. I am sure they were available from the turn of the century until the mid to late 60’s.
I make the Leather Strap for the XK Tool Bag or Roll and it is a exact facsimile off a 70 year old Tool Bag. Duplicating the Strap in the Trunk or Boot will not be a problem. Please send me some details, and I will respond. Thank you!
+1 248 766 9141
Hi Karl, welcome to Jag-Lovers. I just sent you an email with the specifications and photos of the original leather strap for securing the XK120 tool roll to the left side of the boot.
Steve Kennedy, who lives in Colorado, produces the tan, green, and black XK120 tool rolls to a very high standard. I understand he copied original tool rolls loaned to him by Roger Payne.
I have one of his tan tool rolls. Later today I’ll send you another email with photos and measurements of the center bar buckle that Steve supplies with his tool rolls.
Look at your quest as an archaeologist would. In 1950 Jaguar was not about to tool up to make a few hundred belt buckles for an almost un-seen purpose on the new model 120. They used what was immediately available at the time. That time was just after WW2, so there might have been 1 or maybe 2 companies making a range of buckles, these being the smallest. A bit of digging into business archives might find a source still around.
I’ve done this with Jag parts from the '60’s. Jaguar (or Lucas) would go to the US and buy left-over parts from the auto makers and incorporate them into the new Jags. Foreign (to us) car makers have been doing this to bring costs down. After parts are not used in the new cars for 10 years Ford would be happy to get rid of excess inventory for pennies on the dollar.
I wouldn’t be surprised if those buckles were sourced by Jaguar from military applications.
it would have probably been best to include this topic under this previous one?
there is a comment on this thread " I only know of ONE small back-yard enthusiast who has properly addressed belt/buckle accuracy, and NONE of the major outlet/suppliers…" so if we knew who this was it may answer your questions terry
A flat buckle like that would be child’s play to draw up. You could produce dozens of them with a CNC water jet or laser.
Really? What parts did they do this with?
I know early Volvos had Prest-O-Lite wiper motors.
I suspect Phil is on the right path…
In researching these tool rolls in detail, with a view of most accurate as possible reproductions, after a lot of not accurate enough efforts at finding a matching CANVAS material as used for the Second Material type tool rolls - remembering the previously discussed REXINE is the third/final Material type used for XK120 tool rolls over 1949-54 period - I finally had a brain wave - - to try British Military WW2 Surplus outlets, as the Green canvas as used in certain Tents and certain clothing applications was ‘probably’ readily available to Jaguar in the early 1950s, and indeed what we found is a perfect match, albeit it had to be our best guess re colour shade matching, given the genuine original Canvas tool rolls all chemically colour degrade to be more a dirty khaki looking colour. (I note this is same problem with Tyre Pump flex braiding, and indeed Lucas electrical braided cables). But the significant issue is that in WW2/early 1950s all CANVAS and flex braiding and electrical cable braiding was 100% cotton, and the colour vegetable dies were just not all that colour fast/durable. All the modern Canvas is a greater or lesser percentage, up to 100%, of synthetic material (nylon etc) and indeed totally different colouring chemistry, and net result is even if you can match the thread and the weave, it just doesn’t look right due to the synthetic apperance…
So as Phil suggests, same logic with Buckle, but to date I have been unable to find a source of 1940s/50s/WW2 surplus buckles which indeed if anyone was prepared to bite the bullet would be easy to get made, but I dare say in the hundreds to justify the tooling/effort/design-control, so good luck with getting your money back…, as who is going to pay $5-$10-$20-$50-whatever each for a buckle, bearing in mind that also includes the more difficult ‘pin’ and not just the perimeter-piece???, when many/most people don’t want to pay more than $100 for a complete reproduction tool roll…
But all of this is why I haven’t ‘published’ the name of my “one small back-yard enthusiast” as I don’t want lurkers and commercially motivated plagiarizer’s to white-ant his efforts (as has already been tried), albeit as offered, a few genuine ‘private’ inquiries I have received actually wanting to purchase these ‘best practice’ XK120 tool rolls, I have put them directly in touch… But he hand makes the buckle (perimeter and pin and assembly) not having found any volume source of anything accurate; so if anyone finds a box of WW2 surplus NOS buckles, please, I would love to know…
Looks very similar to military use. Perhaps for back pack , canteen, helmet chin straps. etc. Probably thousands of these things in the back of warehouses.
Hello Karl - in doing your search for the particular style buckle, have you checked with any saddle tack shop that still does their own on-site leather repair work - specifically the older shops - I have seen this center bar buckle style years ago on saddles so thought I would mention it - Tex Terry, II - 1991 XJS V12 Classic Coupe, 1986 XJS V12 Coupe - sent 11/21/2020 2309hrs. EST USA.
No I haven’t looked at saddlery suppliers yet. Thanks for mentioning it.
I too remember the plain center bridge buckles from years ago, and could not believe it when I could not find any, anywhere.
Will keep looking.
Try Stuart at Coventry auto parts U.K.
He specialises in xk120,140,150 and tools, tool rolls etc
Sending a buckle across the pond shouldn’t cost a lot
Two pics of an (assumed) original later XK 120 black tool roll. Is this the correct version of the buckle? There is some doubt as the backside seems different from the ones shown in this thread which show a rivet with a round head and round end.
Bob, Yes, this is correct Buckle as I would expect on not just C2882 XK120 tool rolls but also on C5578 XK140/XK150 as well - and I cant tell from your photo if yours is a late 1954 C2882, or indeed an early C5578; but a caveat, until I rewrite/update my XK Tool Kit Papers, following an exhaustive review of all my research notes/photos I cant be sure about any subtle variations to this same basis flat-rectangular buckle. You may be aware I have more recently had a paper published on E-type tool kits, and in this I have for the first time detailed Buckle variations, noting the following photo shows the Buckles on a 1961 E-type C5578 roll that remains pretty well the same as the XK120 C2882 Buckle, but also shown in the inset is the first major style change of a pressed/shaped Buckle as fitted on a 1966 E-type C5578 tool roll…
The next style of Buckle seen was introduced on the Series 2 E-type C31164 Tool Roll, being a rectangular Buckle with an added Roller…
Now I only mention these later Tool Roll Buckles, as what I am seeing more and more is people either trying to repair original Tool Rolls, or ‘improving’ Reproduction tool rolls, by sourcing original tool rolls of various ages but still with good buckles and straps and refitting them. Indeed I have done that myself, albeit I did source/use correct Buckle for the C2882 Tool Roll application…
The Rivets used, I have only looked at superficially to date, but what you show in your photos is what I would typically expect for a C2882 XK120 tool roll, but I am yet to exhaustively look into this, and am aware that again there are variations in the 1960s, but indeed greater variations with the leather strap itself.
For now, I think the biggest priority is to find a volume source of accurate flat-rectangular Buckles as suit XK120 to early E-type tool rolls, rather than the main stream reproduction tool rolls all using pressed buckles with added rollers - thus my comments … NOT EVEN CLOSE.
I’d search suppliers of current uniforms, war re-enactment costumes and fishing equipment (goulashes, tackle boxes, etc.)
Find a proper size (stamped) and cut the roller off of it. I have one (stamped with a roller) on my new soft leather helmet, so they must be available somewhere.
Thanks for this extensive and sound reply (as usual). It definitely is the late XK 120 black roll C.2882 if I follow the descriptions on the subject in various books from your hand. It also fits your description of the REXINE material used for these later tool rolls. See photo.
presumably the solution to all this is to contact roger to contact the “ONE small back-yard enthusiast” who is making these correctly than chasing up WW11 chin straps, saddle tack shops etc etc may not be required?
“the buckle used on the strap that secured the tool roll after it was rolled up”
I have bitten the bullet and taken apart the Buckle from the Leather Strap on my old Tool Bag. It’s very old, Cotton cloth / Canvas with Burlap and Rexine Binding / Edging.
The Buckle is now separate and appears to be s touch smaller than some of the ones I see here. I will attach pictures as soon as I find a way to do so on this Thread. Might have to ask Michael to help me out here!
Karl Robertson sent me photos of the buckle he removed from, what he believes to be, an original XK tool roll. Karl knows of a company that can precisely reproduce the tool roll buckle. But before he contracts to have the buckle reproduced, Karl is asking others with original toll rolls to comment on the shape and measurements of his buckle. For example, is the shape of the center bar of the Karl’s buckle correct?