Yes, it’s me again! I’m still fighting the good fight to get
my ignition in tune.
In SNG Barratt’s manual for the Opus conversion kit, it is
mentioned that the crankshaft makes two revolutions for
every single rotation of the distributor.
Any idea how to know which one is the right when setting the
crankshaft damper mark ‘A’ on the appripriate number on the
timing plate??
Please chime in if you ave any experience here!
Brgds,
Bard–
Bard Th Hesvik
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In reply to a message from Bard Th Hesvik sent Thu 1 Jun 2006:
Hello bard, sorry to hear of your struggle. In the correct position
of the crank at 10 deg BTDC the rotor arm in the distributor should
point at the left hand thermostat housing but that assumes the A1
cylinder is just finished it’s compression stroke. - Only way to
check this is either with the cam covers off where you can see the
cam timing slot is pointing upward or by turning the motor over
with a big spanner and putting your finger over the sparkplug hole
and feeling it pump (that’s a two person job really)
If you are on the crank mark and the rotor arm is pointing at the
servo (if right Hand drive)you are 180 degrees out and you must
remove the distributor and reposition the rotor within the body
before refitting it to get thepointing at LH thermostat condition.
Hope that helps a little.
Just back from Norway… what a lovely country.
Mike. Series 1 DDS–
Mike Badger
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Yes, it’s me again! I’m still fighting the good fight to get
my ignition in tune.
In SNG Barratt’s manual for the Opus conversion kit, it is
mentioned that the crankshaft makes two revolutions for
every single rotation of the distributor.
Any idea how to know which one is the right when setting the
crankshaft damper mark ‘A’ on the appripriate number on the
timing plate??
Please chime in if you ave any experience here!
Brgds,
Bard–
Bard Th Hesvik
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In reply to a message from Mike Badger sent Thu 1 Jun 2006:
Thank you, Mike! Just back from Norway? Whereabouts were
you?
My problem is that I’m now at square one, that is, an engine
without a distrtibutor installed. All I have to go by is the
‘A’ mark on the damper, and that appears twice a revolution
of the distributor. Ok, I can remove the valve cover to find
the right position where to place the distributor so the
rotor points to cyl no 1 (apprx. at five o’clock if twelve
o’clock is in the middle rearwards).
To get to the valve cover though, I have to remove the inlet
manifold and lots of other stuff, so I think it’s actually
better to try the two alternative positions once again in
the hope of striking gold in one of them…
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In reply to a message from Bard Th Hesvik sent Fri 2 Jun 2006:
Hello again Bard, I was in Stavanger and Bryne on business, with
some great scenery to see I may get over in the Daimler one day!
I agree it’s worth a 2:1 gamble rather than stripping more apart.
However you must also be sure that the distributor body is
orientated correctly so make sure A1 HT lead is lined up with the
rotor too by fitting the cap and then putting a marker pen line on
the body aligned with A1. Hopefully this will be near enough to get
you running!
Good luck, Mike ('73 DDS)–
Mike Badger
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In reply to a message from Mike Badger sent Thu 1 Jun 2006:
Thank you, Mike! Just back from Norway? Whereabouts were
you?
My problem is that I’m now at square one, that is, an engine
without a distrtibutor installed. All I have to go by is the
‘A’ mark on the damper, and that appears twice a revolution
of the distributor. Ok, I can remove the valve cover to find
the right position where to place the distributor so the
rotor points to cyl no 1 (apprx. at five o’clock if twelve
o’clock is in the middle rearwards).
To get to the valve cover though, I have to remove the inlet
manifold and lots of other stuff, so I think it’s actually
better to try the two alternative positions once again in
the hope of striking gold in one of them…
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In reply to a message from Bard Th Hesvik sent Fri 2 Jun 2006:
Bard, finding TDC for the number cyl is not that big a deal, and
you DO NOT have to remove a cam cover to do it.
Number cyl is,as you are facing the car, the 1st spark plug at the
front of the head on the left cyl head. Now if you are sitting in
the car, it would be the 1st spark plug on the right hand head at
the front of the car.
With the spark plug out, and since you do not have a distributor in
the engine, make it easy on yourself and remove all the plugs,
makes it easier to turn the engine over. With the help of a friend,
to spin the engine with the starter, let the friend do that while
you stick your finger in the number 1 plug hole. Let the friend
bump the engine over. When compression forces your finger from the
hole, you are now approaching TDC for the number 1 cyl.
Next look under the car at the damper and the timing tab located on
the front of the engine, bolted to the front of the pan. You may
have missed the ‘‘0’’ on the tab with the mark on the damper, so look
to each side for the damper mark. It is a good idea to have marked
the damper mark with some bright color or paint so it is easy to
see. Keeping in mind the damper rotates clockwise, note where the
damper mark is in relation to the ‘‘0’’ on the tab. Should the damper
mark be nowhere to be found, is an indication the ring on the
damper has moved. If you see the mark, note which side of the ‘‘0’’
it is on, again keeping in mind the dapmer rotates clockwise. You
want the damper mark to line up with the ‘‘0’’ on the tab, then you
are at TDC. Install your distributor with the rotor pointing to the
number 1 plug wire, which is numbered on the distributor cap or at
least it should be.
Once you have done that you should be able to start the engine, the
using a timing lite set the timing.
Chadbourn Bolles
803 798 3044–
Dr. Chadbourn Bolles
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In reply to a message from Mike Badger sent Fri 2 Jun 2006:
Thanks guys!
And Mike, Stavanger is just a couple of hours, including tunelling
under two fjords and a half hour ferry across yet another fjord. If
you plan on bringing your DD6 to see some scenery, don’t hesitate
to call, and we’ll try and meet up, maybe give you the grand tour
of Rogaland county q:-)
There is now only one thing that’s bothering me; the car starts
immediately and has a close to perfect idle! How can that be if
it’s 180dg out??
I’ve thought through all I’ve done and the only thing I can see
could have happened at one point, is that I may have mistaken the
HT from 6A and the one from the coil. What whould happen if I did
that? Can the current state of things be caused by a blown ignition
coil (or other things in the loop that can have been damaged)? How
do I check the coil? Measure it for ohms?
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In reply to a message from Bard Th Hesvik sent Fri 2 Jun 2006:
Hello Bard, The coil continuity test calls for 0.8 to 1.0 Ohm
between + and - terminals. There is a section in the ROM detailing
a step by step check for the ignition system but I suspect it is no
longer relevant if you have replaced the pick-up and the amplifier.
Do you still have the ballast resistor? Is your tacho working when
ticking over? Do you think the centrifugal advance could have
seized in the fully advanced condition which you are resetting at
static (this would certainly cause a major power drop as revs
increase)
Running out of ideas here…maybe others can pitch
in…
Good luck,
Mike (S1 DDS)–
The original message included these comments:
that? Can the current state of things be caused by a blown ignition
coil (or other things in the loop that can have been damaged)? How
do I check the coil? Measure it for ohms?
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In reply to a message from Mike Badger sent Fri 2 Jun 2006:
Mike,
The system that’s been fitted is a brand new Opus conversion
kit from SNG Barratt, consisting of replacement distributor,
amplifier, ballast resistor and ignition coil. It’s all in
pristine nick.
It’s still a mystery to me how nice it runs on tickover if
I’m 180dg out…! I will try and rotate it 180dg though, and
offer a report on how it went. It’s going to be a few days
though as we’re going to our mountain chalet over the Whit
holiday.
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E-Type seies III V12
I have replaced the Opus set-up with a Cranes XR700 and it
worked but not smoothly. I have found that, I think, the
ignition has beeen set up badly for years (owner for 20
years +) with the 1 A plug on the distributer pionting to
the middle of the block. So I took a guess with the TDC
center position (front marker not present) using a screew
driver down 1A and found all the spark plug leads did not
make sence. So I have replugged all the spark leads to the
book stating with 1A pointing to left headlight still no
good. So have taken cam cover off to try to find TDC by
using valve settings and cam position. Am I on the wright
track or wildly wrong.
Don–
Don Manning
Herts, United Kingdom
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Kirbert
(Author of the Book, former owner of an '83 XJ-S H.E.)
12
TheDon wrote:
E-Type seies III V12
I have replaced the Opus set-up with a Cranes XR700 and it
worked but not smoothly. I have found that, I think, the
ignition has beeen set up badly for years (owner for 20
years +) with the 1 A plug on the distributer pionting to
the middle of the block. So I took a guess with the TDC
center position (front marker not present) using a screew
driver down 1A and found all the spark plug leads did not
make sence. So I have replugged all the spark leads to the
book stating with 1A pointing to left headlight still no
good. So have taken cam cover off to try to find TDC by
using valve settings and cam position. Am I on the wright
track or wildly wrong.
I believe you’re on the right track, but have omitted a critical
step. You need to position your crank at TDC with the distributor
rotor pointing at whereever your 1A plug wire presently is, and then
remove the distributor, turn the distributor shaft around until the
rotor points towards the left headlight and reinstall. Actually,
you’ll have to turn it a bit beyond where the rotor points towards
the left headlight because it turns a bit as it’s being installed.
You want it to end up pointing towards the left headlight.
Chances are things got messed up to begin with by someone pulling
that distributor and reinstalling it with the rotor pointing the
wrong way. Then, rather than correcting his error, he just moved all
the plug wires around to try to get it to work.
I don’t think it will ever work quite right until it gets put right,
because the number of teeth on the distributor drive gear is NOT
twelve, so having it off one tooth puts it off something other than
one plug wire position. Then you try to correct by adjusting the
timing. From then on, everything is messed up.
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In addition to the normal issues involved in getting the rotor pointed
right
the Crane system introduces another variable: the positioning of the
optical pickup. The Crane installation manual gives the specifics.
IOW, I think the “point to the left headlight” trick applies to the
position of the timing disk and magnetic pickup in the OE Lucas/Opus
dizzy.
I believe you’re on the right track, but have omitted a critical
step. You need to position your crank at TDC with the distributor
rotor pointing at whereever your 1A plug wire presently is, and then
remove the distributor, turn the distributor shaft around until the
rotor points towards the left headlight and reinstall. Actually,
you’ll have to turn it a bit beyond where the rotor points towards
the left headlight because it turns a bit as it’s being installed.
You want it to end up pointing towards the left headlight.
Chances are things got messed up to begin with by someone pulling
that distributor and reinstalling it with the rotor pointing the
wrong way. Then, rather than correcting his error, he just moved
all
the plug wires around to try to get it to work.
I don’t think it will ever work quite right until it gets put right,
because the number of teeth on the distributor drive gear is NOT
twelve, so having it off one tooth puts it off something other than
one plug wire position. Then you try to correct by adjusting the
timing. From then on, everything is messed up.
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Kirbert
(Author of the Book, former owner of an '83 XJ-S H.E.)
14
Ed Sowell wrote:
IOW, I think the “point to the left headlight” trick applies to the
position of the timing disk and magnetic pickup in the OE
Lucas/Opus
dizzy.
I think it applies to the Lucas CEI as well. I don’t see why it
wouldn’t also apply to a Crane conversion, since that shouldn’t
change the rotor/cap orientation, should it?
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In reply to a message from TheDon sent Thu 14 Sep 2006:
Don:
Just to make sure you are on the right track - the manual says that
the rotor arm should be pointing in the direction of the left front
headlight at TDC, not the 1A terminal on the distributor cap.
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Kirbert
(Author of the Book, former owner of an '83 XJ-S H.E.)
16
Jeff MacGregor wrote:
Just to make sure you are on the right track - the manual says that
the rotor arm should be pointing in the direction of the left front
headlight at TDC, not the 1A terminal on the distributor cap.
They’re supposed to be the same thing. If they’re not, the
distributor has been installed incorrectly. But before repositioning
the distributor, you must make sure you’re on TDC with 1A on the
firing stroke, and the easiest way to do that would be to put it
on TDC with the rotor pointing at the 1A terminal, whereever it is.
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Kirbert
(Author of the Book, former owner of an '83 XJ-S H.E.)
17
Don Manning wrote:
The left front headlight distributor terminal, to the left of the
distributor cam adjuster (viewed from the back of the car) is 1A
That’s correct.
the distributor originally had 1A
pointing to the middle of the left hand cylinder head which I
thought was wrong…
You are correct, that was wrong. It’s not where I thought it was
wrong, though, I somehow got the impression it was off the other
direction, pointing straight ahead towards the A/C compressor.
Whatever, put the crank on TDC where the rotor is pointing sorta
towards your present 1A terminal (not 180 degrees the other way,
IOW), then pull the distributor off, turn the shaft, and reinstall so
the rotor ends up pointing towards the left headlight. Reassemble
with the plug wires where they’re supposed to be, and re-time the
ignition.
Good time to rebuild the distributor, BTW. Clean all the old grease
out of the centrifugal advance mechanism, lube with synthetic motor
oil, reinstall with new Viton O-ring, etc.
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In reply to a message from Kirbert sent Fri 15 Sep 2006:
Yes. you are right of course. I just wasn’t sure from Don’s post
that he had properly identified the 1A terminal on the distributor.
My logic was that the distributor might be properly installed and
he simply had the wrong starting point on the cap. Unfortunately I
didn’t really say that :-/
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I think it applies to the Lucas CEI as well. I don’t see why it
wouldn’t also apply to a Crane conversion, since that shouldn’t
change the rotor/cap orientation, should it?
When an aftermarket system is installed the installer is responsible
for positioning the pickup. It is supposed to be positioned angularly
such that the 1A lug is “covered” by the rotor tip regardless of any
advance that is possible. If that has not been done properly the
distance
between the rotor tip and the lug may be too large when the
spark occurs.
The Crane manual suggests, as a last resort, cutting a hole in
an old cap and shining a timing light
through it to see the relative position of rotor and lug when 1A
fires. I
did that, but found the positioning I had already done was pretty
good.
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In reply to a message from Ed Sowell sent Fri 15 Sep 2006:
I did the same Ed and also found my original posiitoning ot be very
good. BTW - your write up on your Crane installation was a very
helpful reference in setting up my system.
Jeff MacGregor–
The original message included these comments:
The Crane manual suggests, as a last resort, cutting a hole in
through it to see the relative position of rotor and lug when 1A
fires. I
did that, but found the positioning I had already done was pretty
good.
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