[v12-engine] November's 'Octane' Magazine features Neville Swales XJ13

V12-Engine
1

Great write-up by Richard Heseltine and staff photos.
Interesting question…the rebuilt original XJ13 was
rebuilt using proud rivets as opposed to Malcolm Sayers
spec. calling for flush rivets…ie, Neville’s machine
which has flush rivets…Which is now the more
authentic??? Which would you rather own??..I’ll take the
newer machine as it is aerodynamically cleaner as Malcolm
intended. Just a thought. Best, JW–
86XJ-S cpes, Lutz stg.1-3, AAV service
Fresno, CA, United States
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2

JW,

I have a XJ13 with proud rivets, and I can say it looks stunning. Even my
wife, who usually thinks I am mad, thinks it is stunning. And even my
children, who would rather a Japanese Pocket Rocket with BIG turbo, think it
is stunning. I can’t comment on the aerodynamics, because it’ll never go
fast enough to matter.

Also saw a long nose D type replica last weekend, with proud rivets, and
that also looked stunning.

Might be just me, but it adds to the “old school” feel.

I take my hat off to Neville, who is trying really hard for authenticity. It
interests me that he is going down the route of “how it should have been
built”, rather than how it was actually built. I wasn’t aware that he had
gone to flush rivets. The real one has proud rivets??

Why they did that, if Sayer specified flush, who knows. No doubt what they
had to hand. And no doubt they expected to make more of them after testing,
perhaps with flush rivets.

As an aside, what was obvious to me when I admired the D-Type last weekend
was the lack of awareness and interest by the younger generations. They were
interested in all things of their generation, but didn’t even recognise the
Jags on display. Close to the lonely D-Type (and XK150) was “Mad Mikes” quad
rotor drift RX7 (pap pap pap pap), with enormous crowds looking on …

On a more positive note, everyone there (no matter what generation)
commented on the Jag F type on display. It is surprisingly big alongside the
older generation Jags but still sexy (Rachel Welch vs Twiggy). However, in
my country, the top of the range F type is alarmingly expensive at 2/3rds
the cost of a Mclaren …

I shall hunt out Nov Octane with interest. And maybe get inspired to move my
project on a little more (read: waste more money). I have a V12 awaiting
attention and I swore this was the year I’d finish it … hmmm.

Cheers
Mark

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3

I have a XJ13 with proud rivets, and I can say it looks stunning.

Two comments:

  1. The Soviets were notorious for building fighter planes with proud rivets at
    the front end and flush rivets at the back end. It’s the trailing end where
    you’re worried about laminar flow separation, so they saved money on the
    front end.

  2. I’ve often wondered why every engineer understands why a golf ball is
    dimpled yet continues to insist on smooth surfaces on anything that travels
    through air. Aircraft are finally coming to the realization that smoother isn’t
    necessarily better, so you can now buy kits for installing hokey little stick-on
    flow disturbers onto the surfaces of your wings. They’re plastic and look like
    they’re peel-and-stick, but they still require certification, so they’re not cheap.

And we’ve had discussions before about polishing inlet tracts. Some people
still insist it does something beneficial even though it’s well-established that
air flows better over dimpled golf balls.

– Kirbert

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !On 3 Nov 2016 at 15:33, Mark Eaton wrote:

4

In reply to a message from Kirbert sent Wed 2 Nov 2016:

Kirby
Your are mixing up two different concepts.
The golf ball dimples create a turbulent boundary layer
that stays attached to the golf ball longer than a laminar
flow would…so the size of the wake is reduced with the
dimples and there is less drag force slowing the golf
ball.
The polished inlets have less surface roughness which is
directly involved in reducing the pressure drop in the
flow through the tube.
Two different things.
Regards
Matt–
The original message included these comments:

And we’ve had discussions before about polishing inlet tracts. Some people
still insist it does something beneficial even though it’s well-established that
air flows better over dimpled golf balls.

–
Matt Furness 85XJS-HE 5 Speed Manual
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5

In reply to a message from Mark Eaton sent Wed 2 Nov 2016:

My impression (I could be totally wrong!) was that Neville
IS building it exactly to its original specs. What we see
now at the Jaguar Heritage Trust is the rebuilt version
after the famous crash, and does look noticeably different
than the original version. Choosing between the original
and rebuilt versions must have been a tough decision, but I
would respect either choice.–
The original message included these comments:

I take my hat off to Neville, who is trying really hard for authenticity. It
interests me that he is going down the route of ‘‘how it should have been
built’’, rather than how it was actually built. I wasn’t aware that he had
gone to flush rivets. The real one has proud rivets??

–
Bill Gutierrez, '61 OTS '73 OTS
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6

In reply to a message from Mark Eaton sent Wed 2 Nov 2016:

The original had flush rivets across the nose Mark. I have re-
created it as it actually rolled out of the Competition
Department in 1966 - not as is should have been built. As you
know, it is also different to how the rebuilt car now appears.

There’s a nice story about the build. Bob Blake took it upon
himself to inset a Jaguar badge on the nose - all nicely
recessed. When Malcolm Sayer saw what he had done he threw a
hissy fit and made Bob hammer it flat again so as not to ruin
his carefully-calculated air flow!

Here’s a bit more about the car’s recent appearances - smile
hasn’t left my face the last few weeks. We even made the news
on BBC!

http://buildingthelegend.co.uk/--
Neville - http://www.XJ13.eu, XJ13 in-progress 1962 3.4 MK2
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7

In reply to a message from V12 Racer sent Sun 20 Nov 2016:

Bravo Neville, the truth will out and integrity matters.
Best, JW–
The original message included these comments:

The original had flush rivets across the nose Mark. I have re-
created it as it actually rolled out of the Competition
know, it is also different to how the rebuilt car now appears.
There’s a nice story about the build. Bob Blake took it upon
himself to inset a Jaguar badge on the nose - all nicely
recessed. When Malcolm Sayer saw what he had done he threw a
hissy fit and made Bob hammer it flat again so as not to ruin
his carefully-calculated air flow!
Neville - http://www.XJ13.eu, XJ13 in-progress 1962 3.4 MK2

–
86XJ-S cpes, Lutz stg.1-3, AAV service
Fresno, CA, United States
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