[v12-engine] XJS V12 5.3 and 6L Conrod lengths

In reply to a message from wesley64 sent Wed 22 Aug 2007:

To answer your question, trhe trans is a GM 4L80-E on those cars,
which is a very reliable (and inexpensive to service) 4-speed
automatic with overdrive. A car with that few miles on it, so long
as it was taken care of, should be in very good operating order.
Really there are very few trouble spots. Jaguar seemed to have
gotten just about everything ‘‘right’’ with them. Even the cooling
system seems improved, as my friends with XJ81 (the XJ12 in an XJ40
body is commonly referred to as the XJ81 around here) in Phoenix
and Las Vegas don’t have the overheating issues that those of us
with earlier V12 cars have. Electrical failures can happen, but the
electrical systems on those cars were still pretty decent. I have
worked on/dealt with/owned a total of probably about 15 of these
cars. I have always found them to be a joy to drive and overall
relaible. If I had to list one ‘‘gotcha’’, it would be that these
cars have dual fuel pumps. One comes on above 2500 RPM or somewhere
around there to provide extra fuel. This is really not necessary,
but I have seen some failures associated with the twin fuel pumps.

For future reference, a question like this should be posted in a
new topic, rather than in a presently existing one. The topic you
posted in was about connecting rods, and your question is in no way
related to that.

Good luck!–
The original message included these comments:

is the trans. for the 94 v12 reliable.am thinking of buying a 95
xj12 with 62000 kilometers.are there any troble spot with these
cars?[xj40 body]


-Ted – '92 XJS V12 5-speed
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In reply to a message from TedDuPuis sent Tue 21 Aug 2007:

Is there any potential to lightened the standard rods without
loosing much strength.–
The original message included these comments:

From a power perspective, there’s nothing wrong with a stock set of
V12 rods. They’re quite strong. The issue comes in terms of weight,
as they are also very heavy. I would even say you don’t really need


V12 David
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V12 David wrote:

Is there any potential to lightened the standard rods without
loosing much strength.

Most particularly, there’s a big lump of metal on the cap! What
would happen if you just cut that thing off?

Here’s an interesting engine balance theory: You could theoretically
balance any piston engine – even a single cylinder – by hanging a
weight off the end cap that completely balanced the weight of the
piston, rings, and conrod. IOW, if you held the entire reciprocating
mass by the big end, it would balance. Then you provide
counterbalances on the crank to counter all that weight. The end
result is a perfectly balanced engine – albeit a very heavy one.
I’ve never seen an engine actually balanced in this manner.

When I look at those chunks hanging off the end caps, though, that’s
the only purpose I can think of for them. They’re obviously not
massive enough for a complete counterbalance of the piston – not by
a factor of 100 or so – but they do look like they’re out there to
counterbalance something. Otherwise they appear completely worthless
to me. It wouldn’t be a difficult matter at all to chop them off and
leave a simple rib to provide good end cap rigidity.

– Kirbert

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In reply to a message from V12 David sent Wed 22 Aug 2007:

Let’s see… well, it’s been probably about 2 years since I’ve
taken a good, hard look at a V12 rod. I recall seeing some areas
where weight could be removed without losing much strength, however
I don’t believe that the weight would really be significant enough
to notice any real improvement. Chad showed me one of his Crower
rods a few years ago. Compare that to a V12 rod, and the weight
difference is enormous. That is how you will notice a difference!

Of course, your wallet will notice a difference as well. So, you
have to balance (no pun intended) what you want out of your
rotating assembly vs. what you want in your wallet. :)–
The original message included these comments:

In reply to a message from TedDuPuis sent Tue 21 Aug 2007:
Is there any potential to lightened the standard rods without
loosing much strength.


-Ted – '92 XJS V12 5-speed
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In reply to a message from Kirbert sent Wed 22 Aug 2007:

The mass on the V12 rod cap moves the centre of gravity of
the rod towards the big end so proportionately more of it is
considered as a mass acting around the crankpin where it can
be balanced by counterweights. It also provides a handy
point for balancing rods by total weight in production.

AJ6 engines have the same feature, which is not uncommon,
BMW being one of several other manufacturers to have done
the same.

Actually Kirby it is not possible to fully balance a single
cylinder engine other than by adding the complication of
synchronized balance shafts.

Masses can be added to the crank webs of a single to balance
the crankpin, piston and rod weight but such masses will
then become unbalanced in the horizontal plane (apart from
mass of the crankpin and rod eye) so would merely shift the
primary out-of-balance shake from vertical to horizontal.
That is why most singles (motor bikes, etc.) use a balance
factor of about 60% to spread the vibration into smaller
forces acting in two directions, dividing the peak inertia
loads acting on the main bearings in similar fashion.

One solution in pursuit of total balance is to add another
cylinder at right angles to form a Vee twin so that the
balance weight is always countering one piston assembly or
the other. In practice Vee twins usually have a cylinder
angle more like 60 degrees to get more even firing impulses,
accepting the compromise of then still having some moderate
out of balance forces.

All of the above relates only to primary balance and takes
no account of the secondary forces generated by the
different piston accelerations around top and bottom of the
stroke caused by the swing of the connecting rod.

Of course four 90 degree Vee twins joined in line become a
V8 and if the crank throws are arranged at 90 degree
intervals (i.e. a two plane crank) then the primaries and
secondaries will be balanced out and counter weights can be
added to resolve the remaining unequal couples. Use a
simpler single plane crank and couples will be resolved but
the secondaries will reappear as a horizontal shaking force
which can be quite severe.

Even though an engine configuration may be in perfect (?)
balance, counterweights on the crank webs are still
necessary in order to reduce the peak inertia loads on the
main bearings just as with the single. Taking the masses off
the big end caps of the V12 would upset this effect to some
extent.

There is quite a science governing the subject of engine
balance.

Incidentally the 5.3 V12 has a rod length to stroke (l/s)
ratio of 2.16 whereas many production engines are more
likely to have a figure of around 1.8 (e.g. Jaguar�s 4 litre
V8 being 1.75) so if any benefit is to be found from
lengthening the rods further it can surely only be very
marginal. Closely packaged F1 racing engines generally have
quite high l/s ratios but that is inevitable as the stroke
gets very short because the bearings and internal clearances
do not shrink in the same proportion.–
The original message included these comments:

Most particularly, there’s a big lump of metal on the cap! What
would happen if you just cut that thing off?
Here’s an interesting engine balance theory: You could theoretically
balance any piston engine – even a single cylinder – by hanging a
weight off the end cap that completely balanced the weight of the
piston, rings, and conrod. IOW, if you held the entire reciprocating
mass by the big end, it would balance. Then you provide
counterbalances on the crank to counter all that weight. The end
result is a perfectly balanced engine – albeit a very heavy one.
I’ve never seen an engine actually balanced in this manner.
When I look at those chunks hanging off the end caps, though, that’s


Roger Bywater / AJ6 Engineering
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RogerBywater wrote:

Actually Kirby it is not possible to fully balance a single
cylinder engine other than by adding the complication of
synchronized balance shafts.

Masses can be added to the crank webs of a single to balance
the crankpin, piston and rod weight but such masses will
then become unbalanced in the horizontal plane (apart from
mass of the crankpin and rod eye) so would merely shift the
primary out-of-balance shake from vertical to horizontal.

Incorrect. If the rod and piston are balanced around the crank pin –
only possible with a very large weight hanging off the cap – then
the engine would be completely balanced by corresponding masses on
the crank webs.

That is why most singles (motor bikes, etc.) use a balance
factor of about 60% to spread the vibration into smaller
forces acting in two directions, dividing the peak inertia
loads acting on the main bearings in similar fashion.

No single I’ve ever seen comes even close to trying to balance the
rod and piston around the crank pin. Once you give up on that,
correct, the thing to do is spread your imbalances out.

All of the above relates only to primary balance and takes
no account of the secondary forces generated by the
different piston accelerations around top and bottom of the
stroke caused by the swing of the connecting rod.

Except that balancing around the crank pin does take care of both
primary and secondary forces.

– Kirbert

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In reply to a message from Kirbert sent Fri 24 Aug 2007:

Kirby, don’t even go there. Every Brit biker learns at their mother’s breast that you simply cannot balance a single fully (or a parallel twin for that matter, or even an in-line four). All you can do is decide where the vibes will kick in by playing with the balance factor to apportion the out of balance between primaries versus secondaries and engine mountings & frames etc. The picture changes when you add extra shafts and drives and weights purely for balancing purposes, but by that stage you’re looking at a more complex machine than piston, rod, crank.

This is a DEEP subject and you can’t just oss out statements without risking a serious egg-on-face scenario.–
The original message included these comments:

Incorrect. If the rod and piston are balanced around the crank pin –
only possible with a very large weight hanging off the cap – then
the engine would be completely balanced by corresponding masses on
the crank webs.


66 2+2, 74 OTS, 76 DD6 Coup�, 84 DD6, 85 XJS 5sp convert
Cambridge, United Kingdom
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In reply to a message from Kirbert sent Fri 24 Aug 2007:

Kirby, I think you need to take a trip to a library and read
up on the subject before you get in any deeper.

Believe me nothing can resolve the primary imbalance of a
single other than a separate balancer shaft or similar
mechanism. The same is true of the secondary forces.

Primary balance can be achieved with a four cylinder in-line
engine but secondary forces will still be unresolved unless
some sort of harmonic balancer is added - which is why the
famous Dr. Lanchester devised such a mechanism.–
The original message included these comments:

Incorrect. If the rod and piston are balanced around the crank pin –
only possible with a very large weight hanging off the cap – then
the engine would be completely balanced by corresponding masses on
the crank webs.
No single I’ve ever seen comes even close to trying to balance the
rod and piston around the crank pin. Once you give up on that,
correct, the thing to do is spread your imbalances out.
Except that balancing around the crank pin does take care of both
primary and secondary forces.


Roger Bywater / AJ6 Engineering
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PeterCrespin wrote:

Kirby, don’t even go there. Every Brit biker learns at their mother’s
breast that you simply cannot balance a single fully (or a parallel
twin for that matter, or even an in-line four).

All true, as long as you’re not trying to balance the piston/conrod
assembly around the crank pin. As soon as you balance the
piston/conrod assembly around the crank pin, all those old rules go
away.

This is a DEEP subject and you can’t just oss out statements without
risking a serious egg-on-face scenario.

Except for one detail: I am, in fact, a mechanical engineer. I know
of what I speak in this particular case.

Balancing an engine by balancing each piston/conrod around the crank
pin would be a joke, IMHO. It’s difficult to imagine what such an
assembly would look like, since the end cap would be so massive. And
it wouldn’t really buy you much on a single since you’d still have
one power stroke every two rotations which introduces its own noise
and vibration.

– Kirbert

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RogerBywater wrote:

Kirby, I think you need to take a trip to a library and read
up on the subject before you get in any deeper.

I could WRITE the book on this subject.

Believe me nothing can resolve the primary imbalance of a
single other than a separate balancer shaft or similar
mechanism. The same is true of the secondary forces.

Incorrect.

Primary balance can be achieved with a four cylinder in-line
engine but secondary forces will still be unresolved unless
some sort of harmonic balancer is added - which is why the
famous Dr. Lanchester devised such a mechanism.

Unless you balance each piston/conrod assembly around the crank pin.

– Kirbert

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In reply to a message from Kirbert sent Fri 24 Aug 2007:

I know you are Kirby, which is why I didn’t respond to
your ‘interesting’ balance idea initally. I had anotehr word in
mind… But I thought we were discussing the real world and
engines which could conceivably be built and run as normal.

Since a con rod in a normal IC piston engine is inherently an
unbalanced object (big/little ends etc), balancing that mass around
a crankpin presumably ain’t ever going to happen in the real world,
on any single cylinder engine that would ever be built. Once you
say that normal rules are not a constriant then of course all bets
are off and we’re into Heath Robinson / Rube Goldberg engineering,
which is not what you’re about, I’m sure.

As it happens, in their dying days, Triumph Motorcycles DID manage
to build a parallel twin with better balance. IIRC it involved a
dummy cylinder between and opposite the two functioning ones and
therefore pointing downwards between the frame rails. This had a
balance weight in the form of a reciprocating piston-type object
equal to the mass of the other two (i.e. presumably at 100% balance
factor) and gave the effect of a boxer twin, except it was two real
cylinders and one dummy one. In fact I seem to recall that the
reciprocating object had half the stroke but twice the mass, being
ferrous instead of aluminium, but I may well be misremembering that
and haven’t worked out if the maths make sense anyhow.

Needless to say, the idea never got off the ground but all credit
to them for dreaming it up as a way of smoothing out their
inherently unsmoothable trade-mark engines (short of using chain-
driven balancer shafts as Honda did with their Dream twins shortly
afterwards).–
The original message included these comments:

Kirby, don’t even go there. Every Brit biker learns at their mother’s
breast that you simply cannot balance a single fully (or a parallel
twin for that matter, or even an in-line four).
All true, as long as you’re not trying to balance the piston/conrod
assembly around the crank pin. As soon as you balance the
piston/conrod assembly around the crank pin, all those old rules go
Except for one detail: I am, in fact, a mechanical engineer. I know
of what I speak in this particular case.


66 2+2, 74 OTS, 76 DD6 Coup�, 84 DD6, 85 XJS 5sp convert
Cambridge, United Kingdom
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In reply to a message from Kirbert sent Fri 24 Aug 2007:

By convention the most significant out-of-balance forces
generated by a single cylinder are essentially threefold:-

  1. The rotational imbalance from the mass of the crank pin
    and that part of the connecting rod that can be considered
    to act through the centre of the pin.

  2. The primary imbalance with one positive and one negative
    peak in each revolution caused by the reciprocating motion
    of the piston and the upper part of the connecting rod
    (referred to as vertical motion).

  3. The secondary imbalance with two positive peaks and two
    negative peaks in each revolution due to the angular motion
    of the connecting rod and its effect on piston acceleration.

The rotational imbalance, being a constant force, can be
totally balanced by attaching counter-weights to the
opposite side of the crankwebs.

The primary imbalance can be totally balanced along the axis
of the piston motion by adding further to the counterweights
on the crankwebs. However around mid-stroke this extra
counter-weighting will act at 90 degrees to the axis of the
piston motion so will then produce an unbalanced force in
effect converting the vertical reciprocating imbalance to an
equivalent horizontal one. The general approach is therefore
to aim for partial primary balance thereby reducing the
vertical imbalance but introducing a horizontal one equal to
the difference.

The secondary imbalance has a frequency twice that of the
crankshaft rotation rate so cannot be resolved by any
counter-weighting or other masses attached directly to the
crankshaft. The theoretical exception is to make the
connecting rod infinitely long so that its angularity
becomes insignificant.

The original point was about the masses on the caps of the
V12 connecting rods. The relevance here is that they convert
some of the primary imbalance to a rotational component that
can be totally balanced by counterweights. Of course in
multi-cylinder engines like the V12 the primary imbalances
of individual cylinders are arranged to cancel each other
out within the engine structure, but it is still desirable
to balance out a proportion of the forces locally at each
crankpin to reduce peak loads on the bearings.

The secondary imbalances also cancel out within an in-line-6
or V12 though not for all engine configurations. The four
cylinder in-line for instance has no means of countering the
secondary out of balance forces without recourse to some
sort of synchronized balance mechanism

Because secondary imbalances create peaks at twice rotation
speed they can only be countered by other forces acting at
the same frequency which is why devices like the well-known
Lanchester harmonic balancer rotate at twice crankshaft speed.

If, as you seem to infer, you know of some method by which
secondary imbalance can be countered by weighting in respect
to the crankpin, then you should indeed write THE BOOK on
the subject, Kirby, and tell the world how it can be done.
Perhaps you will tell us first � I for one would be most
interested.–
The original message included these comments:

Kirby, I think you need to take a trip to a library and read
up on the subject before you get in any deeper.
I could WRITE the book on this subject.
Believe me nothing can resolve the primary imbalance of a
single other than a separate balancer shaft or similar
mechanism. The same is true of the secondary forces.
Incorrect.
Primary balance can be achieved with a four cylinder in-line
engine but secondary forces will still be unresolved unless
some sort of harmonic balancer is added - which is why the
famous Dr. Lanchester devised such a mechanism.


Roger Bywater / AJ6 Engineering
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RogerBywater wrote:

The original point was about the masses on the caps of the
V12 connecting rods. The relevance here is that they convert
some of the primary imbalance to a rotational component that
can be totally balanced by counterweights.

I find it fascinating that you understand this concept perfectly and
can elaborate it so eloquently, yet cannot fathom the idea of simply
increasing those masses on the caps to convert ALL of the primary
imbalance to a rotational component that can be totally balanced by
counterweights.

Because secondary imbalances create peaks at twice rotation
speed they can only be countered by other forces acting at
the same frequency which is why devices like the well-known
Lanchester harmonic balancer rotate at twice crankshaft speed.

Only if the piston/conrod assembly is not balanced around the crank
pin. The so-called secondary imbalances – which are not really
“secondary” in the traditional mathematical or resonance sense of the
word – are caused by the angling of the conrod during a revolution.
Because the conrod is at an angle at the 90 degree and 270 degree
positions, the piston is not actually halfway between TDC and BDC but
rather a bit lower. Hence, as an example, if you have four pistons
and 1 and 4 are at TDC while 2 and 3 are at BDC, the center of mass
for the group of pistons is halfway between TDC and BDC, but 90
degrees later when all four are at 90 or 270, the center of gravity
is a bit lower than that. The center of mass of the group is
therefore moving up and down a bit as the engine spins, resulting in
the familiar buzz of a 4-banger.

Fortunately, balancing each piston/conrod assembly around the crank
pin will completely eliminate this source of vibration, just as it
does the “primary” vibration. This is because the counterweight
hanging off the bottom of the end cap is affected by the angle of the
conrod in exactly the same way.

Look at it the simple way: If you completely balance the
piston/conrod assembly around the crank pin, then for analytical
purposes the entire piston and conrod assembly can be represented by
a mass at the crank pin. And you can completely balance a mass at
the crank pin with weights cast into the opposite side of the crank.

– Kirbert

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In reply to a message from Kirbert sent Sat 25 Aug 2007:

Your interpretation of the source of secondary vibration is
interesting but doesn�t seem to work so well if one
considers a single cylinder, which still produces secondary
imbalances as well as primary ones. Indeed, in balance terms
a multi-cylinder engine is just a collection of single
cylinders each creating its own primary and secondary
forces. They are usually configured so that forces from one
cylinder will counteract those from another, as far as that
is possible.

Your description does recognise that the secondary effects
have peaks at 90 degree intervals but you don�t seem to
realise the full significance of this. The secondary inertia
forces induced by piston accelerations occur at twice the
frequency of the primaries so there are positive peaks at
TDC and BDC and negative peaks at 90 and 270 degrees. There
is a well known diagram in most text books showing how these
forces produce cosine waveforms at the two frequencies.

The primary inertia force is positive at TDC and negative at
TDC so the positive secondary peaks increase the positive
acceleration at TDC and reduce the negative acceleration at
BDC. Hence there is more inertia force generated by a piston
passing TDC than at BDC so a counterweight attached to the
crank that is correct for one cannot be so for the other.
The negative secondary peaks create forces acting downward
at 90 and 270 degrees but at that point the counterweight
would be producing a horizontal force so cannot provide any
compensation.

It is because the secondary peaks occur at 90 degree
intervals that the secondary forces will balance each other
out in a two plane crank V8 but combine to produce a
horizontal shake in a single plane crank V8. This can be
illustrated quite easily by sketching out the directions of
the secondary forces acting at each cylinder with the crank
at TDC for the first cylinder.

It will surely now be obvious that counter-weighting on the
crankshaft cannot be effective at balancing out secondary
inertia forces.

With regard to the hypothesis about adding mass to the
connecting rod to compensate primary and secondary forces
there seem to be two flaws to consider:-

  1. A connecting rod is subject to different actions at its
    two ends. The big-end, as we call it, undergoes rotary
    motion following the crankpin around which it is attached.
    The little-end undergoes reciprocatory motion in unison with
    the piston to which it is attached via the gudgeon pin.
    Whilst it is possible to arrange the mass of the connecting
    rod so that more of it can be considered to be one or the
    other it is quite impossible to arrange for all of it to
    conform to the action of one end alone. In other words,
    however much mass is shifted or added to the big end it can
    never prevent the small end from continuing to undergo
    reciprocatory motion. It is therefore impossible for the
    entire connecting rod to be balanced as if it were
    rotational mass.

  2. Even if it were possible to regard the entire connecting
    rod as rotational mass the geometry of the mechanism,
    because of its attachment to the reciprocating piston
    assembly, will inevitably generate secondary out-of-balance
    forces at twice the frequency of the primaries, which cannot
    be countered in the manner suggested.

I would have thought it is fairly obvious that because the
little end is restrained to linear motion, adding a mass of
sufficient size to the big end cap, in an attempt to
counterbalance the entire rod and piston, would act as a
pendulum sweeping through a path composed of two half
ellipses below the crankpin. This would surely generate a
substantial horizontal shake with an additional secondary
component, quite apart from any practical considerations.

The small mass close to the cap which prompted the original
question is hardly significant in this respect.

I do not know of any evidence to support the suggestion that
a single cylinder can be fully counterbalanced for either
primary or secondary forces by adding counterweights to the
crankshaft or connecting rod.–
The original message included these comments:

I find it fascinating that you understand this concept perfectly and
can elaborate it so eloquently, yet cannot fathom the idea of simply
increasing those masses on the caps to convert ALL of the primary
imbalance to a rotational component that can be totally balanced by
counterweights.
Only if the piston/conrod assembly is not balanced around the crank
pin. The so-called secondary imbalances – which are not really
‘‘secondary’’ in the traditional mathematical or resonance sense of the
word – are caused by the angling of the conrod during a revolution.
Because the conrod is at an angle at the 90 degree and 270 degree
positions, the piston is not actually halfway between TDC and BDC but


Roger Bywater / AJ6 Engineering
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RogerBywater wrote:

The primary inertia force is positive at TDC and negative at
TDC so the positive secondary peaks increase the positive
acceleration at TDC and reduce the negative acceleration at
BDC. Hence there is more inertia force generated by a piston
passing TDC than at BDC so a counterweight attached to the
crank that is correct for one cannot be so for the other.
The negative secondary peaks create forces acting downward
at 90 and 270 degrees but at that point the counterweight
would be producing a horizontal force so cannot provide any
compensation.

No, but a weight off the end of the end cap of the con rod can.

It will surely now be obvious that counter-weighting on the
crankshaft cannot be effective at balancing out secondary
inertia forces.

Unless the conrod/piston assembly is balanced around the crank pin.

With regard to the hypothesis about adding mass to the
connecting rod to compensate primary and secondary forces

Which is what we’re discussing. Are you somehow considering all of
the above as some other discussion?

there seem to be two flaws to consider:-

  1. A connecting rod is subject to different actions at its
    two ends. The big-end, as we call it, undergoes rotary
    motion following the crankpin around which it is attached.
    The little-end undergoes reciprocatory motion in unison with
    the piston to which it is attached via the gudgeon pin.
    Whilst it is possible to arrange the mass of the connecting
    rod so that more of it can be considered to be one or the
    other it is quite impossible to arrange for all of it to
    conform to the action of one end alone.

Uhhh, no, it’s not. It is most certainly impractical, though, which
I said at the outset.

In other words,
however much mass is shifted or added to the big end it can
never prevent the small end from continuing to undergo
reciprocatory motion.

It doesn’t try to. Rather, it balances that reciprocatory motion
with its own motion. If you think about the motion such a weighted
conrod cap would make, it’ll make a sort of oval in which the
vertical axis is equal to the stroke but the horizontal axis is
GREATER than the stroke. The net motion of all this mass – a piston
reciprocating vertically, an end cap weight moving in a horizontal
oval, and a conrod that moves in a combo of these motions varying
continuously from one end to the other – adds up to the equivalent
of one mass moving in circles with the crank pin. Which is easily
counterbalanced with weights on the opposite side of the crank.

It is therefore impossible for the
entire connecting rod to be balanced as if it were
rotational mass.

No, it’s not. Not just conrod, either, but conrod, piston, pin, and
rings. We’re talking about a seriously massive conrod cap.

  1. Even if it were possible to regard the entire connecting
    rod as rotational mass the geometry of the mechanism,
    because of its attachment to the reciprocating piston
    assembly, will inevitably generate secondary out-of-balance
    forces at twice the frequency of the primaries, which cannot
    be countered in the manner suggested.

Gee, it almost sounds as though you’re close to getting it! The
primary and secondary forces generated by the weight hanging off the
end of the end cap will exactly counter those generated by the
conrod/piston assembly.

I would have thought it is fairly obvious that because the
little end is restrained to linear motion, adding a mass of
sufficient size to the big end cap, in an attempt to
counterbalance the entire rod and piston, would act as a
pendulum sweeping through a path composed of two half
ellipses below the crankpin. This would surely generate a
substantial horizontal shake with an additional secondary
component, quite apart from any practical considerations.

Keep thinking, you’ll get there! You’ve got the vertical shake of
the piston, the horizontal shake of the end cap mass, both of which
add up to a rotational imbalance – which can be perfectly balanced
by counterweights on the crank. The same is true of the secondary
imbalances, except both of those are vertical.

The small mass close to the cap which prompted the original
question is hardly significant in this respect.

Agreed. Which is why I wondered why it was there at all, and whether
or not it could be safely sliced off by those interested in a bit
less reciprocating mass.

I do not know of any evidence to support the suggestion that
a single cylinder can be fully counterbalanced for either
primary or secondary forces by adding counterweights to the
crankshaft or connecting rod.

Just because it’s impractical doesn’t mean it’s impossible. And just
because it’s not covered in one of your books doesn’t mean it isn’t a
fact.

– Kirbert

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In reply to a message from Kirbert sent Tue 28 Aug 2007:

Well Kirby, I really do think you should put all this into a
book as you said you might.

With luck you might even find a publisher who no doubt would
catalogue it under �Science Fiction� but you will have to
come up with some sort of story line and add a few Martians
or some such to make it readable.

I have better things to do with my time than argue any more
about your nonsensical theories.

I�m off out of here.–
Roger Bywater / AJ6 Engineering
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In reply to a message from RogerBywater sent Wed 29 Aug 2007:

The very tought of a PERFECTLY balanced and vibrationfree engine is
very disturbing.Imagine having an action without a reaction.Won’t
happend.When ever something starts moving something ells needs to
absorb the released energy.If the force of the ignited exploding
fuel could be transferred into moving the car forward in an
instant, zero time spend ,then maybe if all perfectly balanced
moving parts were circling around the prefect center of
gravity,then academicly there seem to be room for this fantasy to
take place.Wankels rotaty concept attemted something in that
direction.But as long as time excist nothing takes place in an
instant in a combustion engine.
My intuition also tells me that the point attemted to be counter
balanced some how is so dynamic in its movements and or place of
exsistance that the idea of locating it,s exact placement becomes
close to absurd.–
nobogie
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Peter, I wonder, making my own XJ6 engine 3.4L with new oversize pistons I bought from ebay. They are long skirt and came with the old connection rods with an oil line in it. So they are different from the strong XJ connecting rods. Are they in length the same? Because the piston comes just a few mm in the head of the engine. Is that right ?
Frank.