read thru the official statements and cautions: …it has NOTHING to do with tread or traction…it is the fibrous carcass and plies that can be damaged…even just sitting and weighted, certainly if rolling…even as the GM bulletin says…in a short move in transport off the truck or at dealer. The warnings are clear…no doubt about what they say,…anyone can choose to read something else into it, hide their eyes because the manufacturer statement is not as clear, find some reason to ignore it. IF…a tire destructs at 60 mph on a two lane road…you can be killed, and /or you can kill someone else. Do you have super liability and umbrella insurance? and A home where being a paraplegic will be comfortable…I don’t get " the debate". Fine to keep lookin for more clarification…but it is already substantial…I suppose just need to find some accident reports due to summer tire failure in winter cold. I don’t want to be the one in that report.
Nick
Something reeeeeally sexy, about a photo of a cat, in the snow…
All the more reason to stick to Michelin Defenders!
Nick,
As I understand it, the essence of “the debate” is that the term “summer tyre” is not well defined. Some “summer tyres” are made in such a way, or of such materials, that they can suffer permanent damage if exposed to low temperatures. Other “summer tyres” may not have this problem, but do not perform well in ice and snow, and so the manufacturer has classified them as “summer tyres”. The tyre manufacturer is the one that deems a tyre to be a “summer tyre” or an “all season tyre”. The tyre retailers are aware that some “summer tyres” can suffer permanent damage if exposed to low temperatures, and don’t want to be liable for any catastrophic failures or their consequences. So, in the absence of any other information from the manufacturers, the tyre retailers appear to issue the low temperature warning for all tyres specified as “summer tyres” by their manufacturer. John Walker’s discussion with the Vredestein representative seems to bear this out. I am not advocating ignoring the warnings. I am also not advocating driving on Vredestein Sprint Classics in the snow - the manufacturer, by specifying them as summer tyres, clearly thinks this is unwise. What I am advocating is finding out from Vredestein if it is safe for us to leave our cars equipped with Vredestein Sprint Classics in storage over the winter months when they may be exposed to temperatures of 20 degrees F and below.
-David
I couldn’t agree more. The rep I talked to said his colleagues in the NL were very responsive. I got the feeling that had I called earlier in the day (the NL is 6 hours ahead of the US), he would have put me on hold and talked to them while I waited. So far as I’m concerned anything other than the manufacturer’s statements, if any are the gospel regarding this issue; anything else is speculation.
what part of this G M bulletin is “speculation”, while not Vred tires, it is about summer tires…and vendors publish a similar warning specifically about the Vred Summer tires, so drive on em if you wanna. For me this is sufficient warning on all…until proven otherwise, else the “proof” be discovered in a most unfortunate way. The End. Nick
GM bulletin #13-03-10-001A: “Information on Tire Cold Weather Cracking” – (Jan 30, 2014) advises “avoid driving, moving, or test-driving vehicles equipped with high-performance summer-only tires below 20º F as operating at these temperatures can cause damage to the tires.”
I believe it is worth pressing Vred for a definitive answer. To my understanding, there are summer tires and there are performance summer tires. Summer tires, in the past, were further defined as three season tires, and cold was never considered an issue as far as cracking, etc. Winter tires were for better traction in snow and ice. All season were a compromise to help in winter, but were a compromise for all seasons. I will not disagree with GM on the performance tire issue. But I do not see the Vred Classic Sprint as a high performance tire with a super sticky summer only compound, but I see it as a typical summer/three season tire that should do well in cold, but not snow. I also emailed Vred some months ago and never got a response. I believe they need to address this issue.
Tom
I received the below e-mail from Vredestein in the US this morning. As promised Jared received the information form the Vredestein folks in the NL. Before I reply, thanking Jared for the information, is there anything you guys might want me to ask?
Hello Mr. Walker,
I have confirmed with our Tyre Information Center that the Sprint Classic is indeed rated as a true Summer Tire, using modern tread compounds as used in Summer performance tires. This does mean that while warmer temperature performance is superior to that of an all season tire, when temperatures drop below 40 degrees Fahrenheit there is a potential loss in performance and increased risk of damage to the tire. Please feel free to contact me if you have any further questions.
Best Regards,
Jared Scranton
John,
Looks like weasel words to me! Does “increased risk of damage to the tire” mean the same as “the tire should not be inflated or loaded in any way until temperatures return to above 40 degrees F?” If so, why not say so? Do you think you can press him to answer a direct question about whether it is safe to leave the tires on the car in storage over winter if the temperature could dip below 20 degrees? I think that this is the answer that those who live in the frozen north, and store their cars want to know.
-David
I live in Central Texas so Vredesteins are perfect for me and I don’t take the car out when it is freezing. However, I do go on the annual Oil Leaks that often venture north into chilly places. The past two tours have been through cold and snow although the temps were only below 20 in Yellowstone last year and I skipped that portion of the tour. I think I will go with the Vreds again.
–Drew
I read it differently and thought it was pretty clear. One would have to be driving to experience a loss in performance and increased damage to the tire. That also agrees with the statements of other manufacturers that warn of the dangers of the tire being flexed below a certain temperature, 40F. Tires sitting in a garage don’t flex.
I’ll ask about their winter storage recommendations. I’d bet they recommend taking the weight of the car off of the tires and keeping them at the car manufacturer’s recommended pressure.
Yesterday when I spoke with Jared he also mentioned that 40F was not an absolute knife edged cut off point, i.e. 41F is safe and 39F is certain disaster. Vredestein (apparently along with the rest of the tire industry) chose 40F as the dividing line. I’d guess they erred on the side of caution to allow some leeway and summer compounds are not all the same from every manufacturer so I’d bet one brand of tire may not be affected at, say, 35F while another manufacturer’s might.
Everybody can make their individual decision, but that’s the statement from the manufacturer. g
Thanks John. If you can ask about the storage recommendations for low temperatures I think you will have got about as much as we can hope for. Earlier in the thread I thought I read that some retailers said that the tires must be unloaded and deflated for winter storage - that’s the level of detail those who have the tires probably need.
-David
No real skin in the game either, as I only have Sprint Classics on the car that lives on the California coast where it never gets that cold. That said, the spare tire that saved my bacon on the GCOL is a Sprint Classic…
deleted post, done tryin
I recall some pretty cold mornings in San Diego in January-February 1971. We went to the Andy Williams San Diego Open at Torrey Pines and froze. Maybe things are different now. 
40 degrees feels freezing on the golf course! I don’t think we’ve recorded temperatures lower than 28 in all the time we’ve been there, and the garage would be more than 10 degrees warmer. Thanks for finding someone at Vredestein who is actually prepared to respond to questions. If you google this subject, there seems to be a lot of opinion, and not a lot of informed facts.
-David
I’ve been following this Topic closely and 40F is a different kettle of fish than 20F and I will be taking this into consideration when I make my next tire purchase. I seldom drive the car when the temperatures are 20 or lower and I really like the handling of the car with them on it especially in the rain (I had P4000’s on it previously and might as well been on slicks when it was wet) but even on this tour we had temperatures into the 20’s.
Cheers,
LLynn
Yes indeed.
More from Vredestein regarding storage. I asked if the tires, mounted on wheels on the car should or should not bear the weight of the car. The response:
Your storage solution with the tires not bearing the weight of the vehicle is correct. Ideally you would leave the tires inflated.
So invest in some wooden blocks tall enough to rest the suspension on such that the tires are off the ground.
…and Walker will sand and varnish them for ya!
Varnish is so 1940’s, I stain and gloss urethane everything.
True: I use urethane, too, and rarely ever use nails, anymore.