[xj] durability and feasibility

hello everyone,
I keep on being told, of course by non jaguar owners, that these cars are
unreliable, that I’m facing serious expenses, and that my “dream” of being
able to drive it like any other car is a complete utopy. I acknowledge that
I don’t have the time all you guys seem to have, but the passion, the
interest and the awe every time i open my garage, are still there. So
everyone understands my feeling, but is it realistic for me, a young civil
eng. with working hours, to expect to be able to repair it sufficiently (up
scratch I should say) so I can go visit that goddamn beautiful country? Do
you think Jags can be driven in all sorts of places (the other night I read
the whole chapter on headlights from Kirby’s book) and actually trust then
monster under the bonnet/hood ?
How long have you guys with S1’s been at it (of course I realise it also
depends on how deep your pockets are, and how well you can find the cheapest
AND best parts), and do you have other cars? Maybe I’m completely fooling
myself with that dream of driving (say in 1.5 months) from Durban to Paris,
but I don’t think so. For instance, have any of you done say New York - San
Fransisco (like in that Prolong advert - by the way is it all bull**** or
does it really enhance performance?) or some noticeable distance on the face
of this earth ?

I remember there were some french guys who drove around the world I think on
old Citroen cars. The mechanics of which probably were land rover or
something similarly strong, but what would you think about doing that with a
“new” S1 ? eh eh eh, food for thought!

please share your dreams (if they’re kind of similar, i.e. not just a motor
show acitivity, which, at my age, I don’t really give a damn about!)! cheers

guillaume
1972 xj6 (of course by now I realise they’re all S1s)===================================================
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The most recent issue of the JCNA (Jaguar Club of North America) magazine
has a very nice article about a fellow who took his Series I on a 8000km
journey …with no problems ! Of course, he had thoroughly restored the
car but the point is…yes, it can be done !

Don’t let others discourage you. Bringing any 30 year old car (Jag, BMW,
MB, Ford, Buick…you name it) “up to scratch” can be a real test of your
mettle (and pocketbook) but, in the end, and especially with a Jaguar, the
results are very satisfying.

Speaking for myself…and probably many others on the list…owning a
Jaguar was something I always dreamed about and waited many years for. Just
like anything worth having, it was worth the wait ! And I can promise you
that many of us still get a little thrill every time we open the garage
door…just as you’ve described.

Whether or not Durbin-to-Paris is possible in the near future…I can’t
say. Start by thoroughly assessing the condition of your car from
bumper-to-bumper, making notes of all required work. You can then formulate
estimates of the time and expense involved for each item which can then be
compared to your own pocketbook and schedule. Then add 50% to
everything…you’ll know the answer soon enough!

Good luck,
Doug Dwyer

hello everyone,
I keep on being told, of course by non jaguar owners, that these cars are
unreliable, that I’m facing serious expenses, and that my “dream” of being
able to drive it like any other car is a complete utopy. I acknowledge
that
I don’t have the time all you guys seem to have, but the passion, the
interest and the awe every time i open my garage, are still there. So
everyone understands my feeling, but is it realistic for me, a young civil
eng. with working hours, to expect to be able to repair it sufficiently
(up
scratch I should say) so I can go visit that goddamn beautiful country? Do
you think Jags can be driven in all sorts of places (the other night I
read----- Original Message -----
From: “Guillaume Patricot” patricot@iafrica.com
the whole chapter on headlights from Kirby’s book) and actually trust then
monster under the bonnet/hood ?
snipped

===================================================
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I bought a 120,000 mi SII for my wife as a daily driver over two years ago. other than almost immediate tranny problem (broken valve spring) we drove it for over 50,000 mi and just recently had to pull the head because of an exhaust valve that went bad. Small problems here and there but nothing that has interfeared with it’s continued use. Several times a summer she (or she and I when my schedule allows) does a 600 mi each way trip to Montana from our home here in Seattle - usually thru 90 to 100 degree temperatures for 300 mi of each leg - and I don’t worry excessively. These are very robust cars and though any 25 yr old car will have some problems they are usually of the bothersome type rather than major failure. Even with the exhaust valve burned and no compression showing on the guage my wife’s comment was “Oh yes - I’ve been meaning to tell you - it’s been running poorly for a month or so”.
Just my $.02 worth of opinion but I love these cars.

Scott Gilbert
SII Sable Seattle===================================================
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Dear Doug,

I can not agree with you more.

My Daimler is now 31 years old (built in 1970 and delivered in Italy) and I
have in the last year changed a lot of things (a.o. the engine, the gearbox
twice, the rear axle, all brake calipers, repaired (yes) the mastercilinder,
the exhaust, the left hand fuel tank (right hand one replaced for an LPG
tank), the seats due to very hard leather, the alternator among a short
list), but you get something in return

The car drives like a dream and everytime I see it the car looks great (no
rust at all)

It is worth it!

Kind regards,

Jan de Jong
Daimler Sovereign 1970----- Original Message -----
From: “Doug Dwyer” DWYERD@email.msn.com
To: “XJ List” xj@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2001 3:46 PM
Subject: Re: [xj] durability and feasibility

The most recent issue of the JCNA (Jaguar Club of North America) magazine
has a very nice article about a fellow who took his Series I on a 8000km
journey …with no problems ! Of course, he had thoroughly restored the
car but the point is…yes, it can be done !

Don’t let others discourage you. Bringing any 30 year old car (Jag, BMW,
MB, Ford, Buick…you name it) “up to scratch” can be a real test of your
mettle (and pocketbook) but, in the end, and especially with a Jaguar, the
results are very satisfying.

Speaking for myself…and probably many others on the list…owning a
Jaguar was something I always dreamed about and waited many years for.
Just
like anything worth having, it was worth the wait ! And I can promise you
that many of us still get a little thrill every time we open the garage
door…just as you’ve described.

Whether or not Durbin-to-Paris is possible in the near future…I can’t
say. Start by thoroughly assessing the condition of your car from
bumper-to-bumper, making notes of all required work. You can then
formulate
estimates of the time and expense involved for each item which can then be
compared to your own pocketbook and schedule. Then add 50% to
everything…you’ll know the answer soon enough!

Good luck,
Doug Dwyer

----- Original Message -----
From: “Guillaume Patricot” patricot@iafrica.com

hello everyone,
I keep on being told, of course by non jaguar owners, that these cars
are

unreliable, that I’m facing serious expenses, and that my “dream” of
being

able to drive it like any other car is a complete utopy. I acknowledge
that
I don’t have the time all you guys seem to have, but the passion, the
interest and the awe every time i open my garage, are still there. So
everyone understands my feeling, but is it realistic for me, a young
civil

eng. with working hours, to expect to be able to repair it sufficiently
(up
scratch I should say) so I can go visit that goddamn beautiful country?
Do

you think Jags can be driven in all sorts of places (the other night I
read
the whole chapter on headlights from Kirby’s book) and actually trust
then

monster under the bonnet/hood ?
snipped

===================================================
The archives and FAQ will answer many queries on the XJ series…
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http://www.jag-lovers.org/cgi-bin/majordomo.

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I don’t think SI XJ’s in general are more prone to serious mayhem
than any other car of the era, provided you maintain them properly
and maybe do some extra prepping for this particular trip. Especially
the SI is not that complex with only a few electronic bits (unlike
the SIII). Just bring a bag of service items which are not available
in Ivory Coast or whichever country you’ll pass;)
Fan belts, points, emergency windscreen and a bunch of tools spring
to mind: they’re pretty resourceful in Central Africa, but you don’t
want to hear: “yes sir, I could fix that, but I’ve got no spanner to
take it off the car”.
Just curious: are you going back with the car as well, or will you
stay in France after this?

happy prepping:)–
Arnoud

iMac, therefore I am

http://www.se7en.nl

1972 XJ6 4.2 MOD
1973 Daimler Double-six
1989 XJ12 Sovereign

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-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Dwyer [mailto:DWYERD@email.msn.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2001 8:46 AM
To: XJ List
Subject: Re: [xj] durability and feasibility

The most recent issue of the JCNA (Jaguar Club of North
America) magazine
has a very nice article about a fellow who took his Series I
on a 8000km
journey …with no problems ! Of course, he had thoroughly

That, and some wierd guy got a cold-start injector checklist published…
:)===================================================
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As a further to my previous $.02 worth I would like to add that in some ways
your SI (as is true with my early SII) might be a better long distance driver
as it is equipped with carbs rather than the later FI system. I know that I
will get opinions going on this and I will admit that the FI yields better
mileage, etc but ther carbs are not reliant on temp sensors, etc which are
great as long as they are working but which can take the system down with
their failure. A manual choke conversion would rid you of the problematic
Starting Carb or AED or whatever you’re currently equipped with and yield a
very straightforward system that would soldier on thru almost anything. For
the long hauls thru areas not equipped with available knowledgable service
simplicity is a virtue to be extolled.

Your car should also have the trunk mounted fuel pumps which are at least
easier to get to and swap out than my later in-tank pumps which require
draining the fuel to replace. You could even put in manual shut off valves
to allow you to change pumps with virtually no spillage. In my experience
such a set-up along with the carrying of spares would all but ensure that you
would never need to touch it.

Scott Gilbert
SII Sable Seattle===================================================
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Hi Guillaume,

I am the custodian of my fathers 1971 XJ6, which he bought sometime around
1972 and has been either his, or my daily driver ever since.

If well looked ater, these cars will last a lifetime, and yes by “looked
after” I do mean the occasional engine, gearbox (etc) rebuild as it proves
necessary.

Dad’s car has done its fair share of miles, it reads 19 000 now, but add 300
000 on to that, plus add a 20 000 or so for the year or so dad drove with
the speedo not working… and you get an idea how long these cars will go
for.

Yes, the head came off in the early '80’s, the gearbox replaced in 1981 (now
due for another) and the engine rebuilt in 1993. But otherwise just a
constant replacing of components as they wear out.

I went through the service records from 1980 to date, and the things that
have needed most attention over the last 20 years have been the AED, welding
up the drivers seat frame, brake pads, brake pads and brake pads, the fuel
pumps, the exhaust rattling, shock absorbers and the air con…nothing
serious… just sometimes the odd annoying thing.

We have no plans to sell it… I want to give it a light tidy up, its still
rust free, but suffers from great wads of filler where accidents have been
poorly repaired by penny pinching insurance companies, it needs new screen
rubbers to keep the water out… and carpet… that kinda thing. If its
lucky, it might get a respray… but I don’t want to pull it apart and
restore it properly… it would destroy the cars ability to be the daily
hack… I mean, who takes the rear seat out of their restored Jag, fills up
the passenger compartment with garden clippings and takes them to the tip??

I got a few looks that day.

Guillaume, its not impossible to drive the things around the world…save
for the amount of fuel you’d consume. Just keep on top of the maintanance.
And if you’ve bought some tired old thing, just get your hands dirty. It may
cost a little to get a good base… but once its there… look after it, and
it will look after you. ANY second hand Jag will cost you a few thousand to
put right, I’ve not seen a perfect one yet. Believe me, I’ve sunk plenty of
money in some weird projects, and in the end, they all turn out OK, and give
huge amounts of pleasure.

And oh, worried about being young, being slightly strapped for cash?

I’m 22 (bought my first Jag when I was 13… on my 11th now), I’m still at
university, and to earn a quid I’m driving a cab, which pays for books and
little else.

Have fun!
Aaron Goldman
Brisbane Australia
Have had:
1 x 3.8 Mark 10
1 x 4.2 Mark 10
1 x 420
2 x 420G’s
3 x Series 1 XJ Jaguars
1 x Series 1 Daimler Sovereign
2 x Series 2 XJs>hello everyone,

I keep on being told, of course by non jaguar owners, that these cars >are
unreliable, that I’m facing serious expenses, and that my “dream” of >being
able to drive it like any other car is a complete utopy.


Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

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I keep on being told, of course by non jaguar owners, that these cars are
unreliable, that I’m facing serious expenses, and that my “dream” of being
able to drive it like any other car is a complete utopy.

Utter nonsense!

I acknowledge that

I don’t have the time all you guys seem to have, but the passion, the
interest and the awe every time i open my garage, are still there.

That’s the first step…admitting that you have the disease.

So

everyone understands my feeling, but is it realistic for me, a young civil
eng. with working hours, to expect to be able to repair it sufficiently
(up
scratch I should say) so I can go visit that goddamn beautiful country?

Yes…but you are going to have to learn about the car, get to know it to
live with it, and be aware, like any truly world class car that it is
expensive to a certain extent, to keep one of these cars in top shape.

Do

you think Jags can be driven in all sorts of places (the other night I
read
the whole chapter on headlights from Kirby’s book) and actually trust then
monster under the bonnet/hood ?

Oh, you bet! I had a '76 XJ-6L that I bought when it was fifteen years old,
had a 100K on it, had a blown head gasket, and the DPM was a total moron
unqualified to work on a Lawn-Boy.

I rebuilt pretty much everything under the hood, did the brakes, front
suspension, shocks and springs in the back, exhaust, CD player, A/C,
etc…

And I got pretty strange with the engine and changed the trans to an older,
stronger unit.

I know that my car wasn’t a Series I but I had a tri-carb HD-8 setup and ran
a points and condenser distributor like a Series I would have. My trans was
a Model 12 Borg-Warner like the Series I.

Here’s a link to the basic pictues…

http://www.jag-lovers.org/snaps/snap_view.php3?id=991683312

My wife used it as her daily driver.

You must get it all sorted out before you put it into daily service, though,
or it will make you nuts.

How long have you guys with S1’s been at it (of course I realise it also
depends on how deep your pockets are, and how well you can find the
cheapest
AND best parts), and do you have other cars?

We drove ours for three and a half years and 35,000 miles as our main car
and did pretty much nothing to it.

Maybe I’m completely fooling

myself with that dream of driving (say in 1.5 months) from Durban to
Paris,
but I don’t think so. For instance, have any of you done say New York -
San
Fransisco (like in that Prolong advert - by the way is it all bull**** or
does it really enhance performance?) or some noticeable distance on the
face
of this earth ?

Well, I didn’t go cross country, but we traveled from here in central Pa to
Orlando Florida down and back in one day each and that’s about 800
miles…grew no moss…

We took it there three years in a row and it was HOT and humid there in the
end of September…no problems…

It also gets down in the single digits here in Pa in the dead of winter and
I never had any trouble with it under those conditions either.

I remember there were some french guys who drove around the world I think
on
old Citroen cars. The mechanics of which probably were land rover or
something similarly strong, but what would you think about doing that with
a
“new” S1 ? eh eh eh, food for thought!

Be a damn sight more comfortable and safe in the Jag…

Think about it…is there any reason that you would hesitate to do this in
a 2001 XJ-8? Of course not! It’s one of the finest cars in the world.
Jaguars always have been. Yours was one of the finest cars in the world when
it was new, a pristine Series I XJ-6 is a darn fine car now. But as with any
high end car, you will have to do some major work to it at some point to
bring it back to its original grandeur.

A friend of mine and I have been working on his '85 500 SEL and we have been
doing the same stuff to that car that we are doing here to XJ-6s…he’ll
have a good car when we’re done, but it needed all the usual stuff to bring
it back to a point where it is reliable, drives as it should and all the
amenities are back on line.

please share your dreams

I want another Series II XJ-6L…

Cheers,

JebFrom: “Guillaume Patricot”

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Guillaume and the rest,

I, too, been thinking about a BIG roadtrip. In my case, it’s a beer run
from here in Maine to Rio de Janeiro. I had planned this trip almost some
time ago codriving a trick Opel 1900, but the car caught fire while being
ferrried to our start point. Fate certainly wagged his fickle finger at me
that day.

Now, 20 years later I’m pondering another go at it. Since then the roads and
petrol quality are better, politics are better smoothed out and we’re living
an incredible age of communications and shipping essential for more reliable
transport of spares. The down side is I still want to drive an old car–this
time a Rover P6 (TC-2000) with a fresh low-compression single carbbed-engine
able to burn low quality petrol. One seat only, roll bar, fuel cell and
other standard race-safety.

Some recollections of planning my ill-fated trip: collect spares! I’ve
learned in in the past year owning my first '70 XJ6 that these vintage XJ-6
is poorly supported by the factory and the after market. You don’t want to
experience this in the bush. (Incredibly, I can get nearly ANYTHING for '65
Elan overnite. Even XJ-120’s are better supported because there’s a
restoration market out there for these cars whereas Series-1 XJ6’s don’t
have that cache. Probably one other sled is more neglected, and that’s the
Rover P-6…Sigh.)

With your spares, Guillaume, establish a spares carriage system for items
inconvenient to pack with you. Your spares should be inventoried back home
in Durban and someone dependable should be on call to ship them to you
ANYWHERE.

Study your itinerary carefully. The politics, road conditions, visa
requirements if any. Cartograpaphy has never seen better days. Is there an
ordinance survey for Africa? Such a thing would be indespensible.

Plan, plan and plan. Besides it’s fun. Also read “Jupiter’s Travels,”
Penguin or Viking Press. About a Brit in the 1970’s who rides a twin BSA or
Triumph (he doesn’t say specifically) around the world. His African travels
are the best part of the book.

Is a Durban to Pris run crazy? Of course it is–that’s why you must do it!

–Paul_______________________________________________________
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http://www.bluemountain.com/giftcenter/

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Guillaume,

Do not worry about the durability of the XJ Series I car, in the latest edition of
‘Classic Jaguar World’ (August), there is a story about a one owner car that has
covered half a million miles, many of were spent towing racecars all over the
continent.

Granted the car has not been pampered and is on it’s third engine now, but the fact
that it has seen better days should convey the idea that a well looked after car
should be able to match or indeed surpass this car for long lasting travel.

Regards

           Steve-----------------------------------------------------------------

Stephen Gibson
Supercat Jaguar Spares
www.supercatjaguarspares.freeserve.co.uk

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