I have a 1988 XJS V12 H&E Convertible and the left/front door power
window motor nylon drive gear has stripped in one spot. I THINK
the motor is okay…just the stripped gear. I took it out. and
there is a label on it which states ‘‘Delco Products Made in
England’’ with the numbers 22069097 and 12V 217. All I’ve been
able to find is new Bosch replacements which need some sort of a
kit and extra wireing. I’d like to stick with a Delco ‘‘bolt-in’’
replacement unit (good used would be great), and was wondering if
any other year/models used the same Delco motor/unit as mine.
Also, would there possibly be any interchanges with any US GM
models, since it’s a Declco unit? HELP!..–
345 DeSoto
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I have found that the motor itself is common but the drive unit is
unique…perhaps not totally unique to Jaguar…but not common to any of
the umpteen Delco motors I’ve seen which are for American cars. The mounting
lugs are oriented in a unique way and, as I recall, the driven gear …the
one that actually engages the regulator…has fewer teeth.
However, perhaps the nylon gear is garden variety and you might get
lucky.
This doesn’t address your situation specifically, as I had the opposite
problem, but as a thought starter it may help…
Doug Dwyer
Longview, Washington USA
1987 Ser III XJ6
1988 XJS V12
I have a 1988 XJS V12 H&E Convertible and the left/front door power
window motor nylon drive gear has stripped in one spot.
Also, would there possibly be any interchanges with any US GM
models, since it’s a Declco unit? HELP!..
// please trim quoted text to context onlyFrom: “345 DeSoto” tdefoster@aol.com
Several years ago I too looked for some / any solution to the worn Delco
drive gear problem. I finally gave up and bought a rebuilt unit from
Florida Window Lift. They have a web site.
Jim Johnson - NCJOC
'88 XJ-S (LHD), V12, Lucas (CEI), TH400 (w/B&M), Dana 2.87
Annapolis, Maryland
In reply to a message from Jim Johnson sent Thu 25 Aug 2005:
Since the nylon driven gear is bad and not the motor/housing, I did
some investigating and ran down the manufacturer of the gear. I
found NO supplier of replacement gears at all. The manufacturer is
the Davall Moulded Gear Company in England and I have emailed them
some pictures and a run down of the situation, requesting a supplier
(s) of these gears. I will wait to hear from them and willtake it
from there. It seems to be terrific waste of money to have to buy
a complete new unit, when all the old one needs is a nylon gear
that probably costs less than $2. I had a similar problem with a
DeSoto water pump. All it needed was a rubber seal but all the
rebuilders would do is offer to rebuild mine or sell me one
outright…BIG bucks. NO one would sell me a seal or tell me who
supplied them. I ran down THE manufacturer of the seals, but they
would only sell in lots of 500 minimum. The saleswomen on the
phone said she’d send me a half dozen ‘‘samples’’ and didn’t even
charge postage. Took me ten minutes to install the new seal, and
the pump works like new. I will Post what I find out about the
nylon gear when/if I hear from Davall…–
345 DeSoto
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In reply to a message from 345 DeSoto sent Thu 25 Aug 2005:
I’m still waiting to hear from the British Manufacturer of the
Nylon driven gear, however, I have completely disassembled my
defective units and found a number of reasons why they failed AND
how to permenantly repair them… for free.
The large nylon gear is only worn in one spot, and only on 1/2 of
the tooth. The reason appears to be the tension adjustment screw
for the end of the worm gear shaft. Under load, if this adjustment
is not RIGHT on, it will allow the worm gear shaft to ride up ever
so slightly as it engages the Nylon driven gear. Eventually the
driven gear will strip. If this adjustment screw is over
tightened, the motor will not turn or turn slowly, overheat, and
burn out.
The next thing I found was a twofold problem. On three of the
units I dissassembled I noticed that perhaps only 30% of of each
brush was contacting the commutator and the commutator surface
showed a very thin contact point from the carbon brushes. This
indicated that the motor was only receiving approximately 30% or so
of the power it needed to operate at it’s full potential. Along
with this, I found on one motor that although the brushes were
contacting the commutator 100%, they were covered with grease.
CAREFUL cleaning with laquer thinner and a small artists brush
cleaned up the grease from the brushes/brush holder, and just the
comutator. The comutator was cleaned using 1200 sandpaper. To get
a 100% contact surface on the brushes I miced the commutator and
found a deep well socket JUST slightly smaller than the
commutator. I wrapped 1200 grit sandpaper around it and carfully
inseted it into the brushholder with the brushes in it. I then
carefully worked it back and forth until the contact surface was
100%.
The cover on the gear case is held on by peaning over a few spots
on the potmetal case. I CAREFULLY tapped these back with a small
hammer and flat tip screwdriver, and removed the cover. I flipped
over the case, and with a punch, tapped the shaft through the steel
regulator drive gear and removed the Nylon driven gear, rubber
cushion, and shaft from the case. I washed it all clean with
solvent. At first glanse the nylon gear looks like a lost cause,
however, it CAN be flipped over exposing the unworn surface of the
teeth and used. I left the rubber bumper in the gear, and marked
the spots that engage the tangs on the drive shaft. I removed the
bumper, chucked the appropriate size bit in the drill press and
drilled out the penciled in marks. I reinstalled the bumper in its
slot, and reinstalled the nylon gear on the driveshaft UPSIDE DOWN,
and shimmed it out from the case with a washer. Before installing
the steel regulator drive gear, I SCRUBBED the splined surfaces of
the drive shaft and gear with laquer thinner and put a drop of
supper glue on the shaft/gear then quickly tapped the gear back on.
I packed the case with ‘‘Never Seize’’ and reinstalled/peaned the
cover. All three units work better than new.–
345 DeSoto
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In reply to a message from 345 DeSoto sent Sun 4 Sep 2005:
Your a good man! Thanks for the info!! I have two slow moving
motors in mine so I’ll probably pull them apart over the winter and
go through them. Thanks again. PS While we’re on the power window
motor issue, on my 89 xjs convertable, the d/s rear window (which
operates on a timer with the top) will sometimes not go down with
the top. Funny thing is it is only when the car has been sitting
all day in the very hot sun. If it is a normal day (75-80 degrees
or less) it operates as normal. Any ideas anyone?–
Rob Wade
Windsor Ontario, Canada
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In reply to a message from 345 DeSoto sent Sun 4 Sep 2005:
By the way…as soon as I can figure out how to do it (and Post
it), I’d like to go into step-by-step detail with this procedure
with pictures…if there’s any interest. I know this works on the
window motors in my '88 H&E XJ-S, but I have NO idea if it will
work on other years/models. I just couldn’t see paying through the
nose for a whole motor unit when just one very small spot on one
part was worn…–
345 DeSoto
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Electrical contacts! As the temp rises the contact is
lost. Try swapping the relays and see if the problem
swaps windows.— Rob Wade robsxjs@hotmail.com wrote:
motor issue, on my 89 xjs convertable, the d/s rear
window (which
operates on a timer with the top) will sometimes not
go down with
the top. Funny thing is it is only when the car has
been sitting
all day in the very hot sun. If it is a normal day
(75-80 degrees
or less) it operates as normal. Any ideas anyone?
Kirbert
(Author of the Book, former owner of an '83 XJ-S H.E.)
9
345 DeSoto wrote:
By the way…as soon as I can figure out how to do it (and Post
it), I’d like to go into step-by-step detail with this procedure with
pictures…if there’s any interest. I know this works on the window
motors in my '88 H&E XJ-S, but I have NO idea if it will work on other
years/models.
I don’t CARE if it applies to other models. You write it up, and
I’ll post it on the xj-s/book page. Of course, I suspect Dave
Johnson will probably want to post it someplace H&E-specific.
Marty Sullivan and I worked on the RR window on his H&E for a while.
I don’t remember what became of that, but obviously there is a
history of trouble there.