[xk] Batteries - single 12v or pair of 6v?

Hi

I was going to try and turn over the motor on the XK 120

It still has the original batteries in it,

Can I just use a single 12v battery to turn it over ?
I do not think there is a small enough 12v battery to fit in
the battery box so I will probably later send the original
batteries out and get them rebuilt somewhere…

What would you do ?

thanks Beaulieu–
beaulieu
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Beaulieu … I am running a single 12v in mine … Bob (681431)-----Original Message-----
From: owner-xk@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xk@jag-lovers.org] On Behalf Of
beaulieu
Sent: November 06, 2007 6:43 PM
To: xk@jag-lovers.org
Subject: [xk] Batteries - single 12v or pair of 6v ?

Hi

I was going to try and turn over the motor on the XK 120

It still has the original batteries in it,

Can I just use a single 12v battery to turn it over ?
I do not think there is a small enough 12v battery to fit in
the battery box so I will probably later send the original
batteries out and get them rebuilt somewhere…

What would you do ?

thanks Beaulieu

beaulieu

In reply to a message from Bob England sent Wed 7 Nov 2007:

Yhis is what I found under Parts Interchange.
I think someone just discuused this topic recently. Sears
(Diehard) makes a battery to fit one battery box. I don’t recall
the part #. It also could have been Group 26. I would think all
battery companies use the same part/group numbers.

System: Electrical
Part name: 12V Battery
Jaguar part#: N/A
Cross reference: Group 26
Vendor: Any
Market: All
Submitted by: Mark Stephenson
Date submitted: 2003-03-04 02:46:03
Date updated: 2003-03-04 02:46:03
Models: XK120/140/150
Info: 12V battery to fit in a single XK120 battery box. Use Group
26 for positive ground. Use Group 26R (reversed terminals) for
negative ground.–
norm larsen
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Hi
I used 2 small 12 volt batteries in parallel. This improves the
crankingpower to much more than the 2x 6v in series
Never had any starting porblems since
regards
Duco----- Original Message -----
From: “Bob England” rje@rmdg.ca
To: xk@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 3:19 AM
Subject: RE: [xk] Batteries - single 12v or pair of 6v ?

Beaulieu … I am running a single 12v in mine … Bob (681431)

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-xk@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xk@jag-lovers.org] On Behalf
Of
beaulieu
Sent: November 06, 2007 6:43 PM
To: xk@jag-lovers.org
Subject: [xk] Batteries - single 12v or pair of 6v ?

Hi

I was going to try and turn over the motor on the XK 120

It still has the original batteries in it,

Can I just use a single 12v battery to turn it over ?
I do not think there is a small enough 12v battery to fit in
the battery box so I will probably later send the original
batteries out and get them rebuilt somewhere…

What would you do ?

thanks Beaulieu

beaulieu

In reply to a message from Duco Jan Avis sent Wed 7 Nov 2007:

Hi I use an Odysey 12V 53RC in my XK120, it fits in one of the
battery compartments and so far has held up better than the 6 volt
ones that have always failed every 3 years or so. Plenty of
cranking amps. I went to the trouble of mounting the original
Lucas covers on some standoffs and routing the cables so that it
looks stock. This battery has ‘‘side’’ terminals on top so I used a
kit to add posts. About $130.

Dave Wathen
53 XK120 OTS
66 Etype OTS–
DaveXK
Bloomfield Hills, Mi, United States
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Two characteristics are important for batteries - cold cranking amps and
amp-hours. If those are better for one or two 12V batteries compared to twin
6V, you will get better performance - i.e. faster and longer cranking.

I have always used twin 6’s for originality and with a properly set up and
tuned engine, you should have no problem with starting. Mine starts easily
at 15 degrees. On occasion, I have had some kind of a problem and cranked it
over for what seemed like forever - long enough to figure out what the
problem was before the battery died, anyway.

Battery power has something to do with bulk. Two sixes in series may have
more power than one twelve that is small enough to fit. Each cell in a six
is larger than the cells in a twelve that is the same size as one of the
6’s.

Anyhow - just check the specs on the specific brands and models your are
considering as alternatives. You will have to figure out whether cold
cranking amps or amp-hours are more important to you. Cold cranking power is
more important under colder conditions for faster spinning when the oil is
thicker.

For my road grader, I keep a second battery next to it where it is parked in
the winter and I hook it up in parallel with jumper cables when it is below
15 degrees to start the diesel engine.

If you have trouble starting the XK with twin sixes, you should solve the
problem.

Bruce

'52 XK120
'85 S3 XJ6
'79 Triumph Bonneville special (kick start only)

and BTW - in calculating the specs for two sixes in series, just double the
specs for one

lead/acid batteries are just sets of 2V cells connected in series whether
they are in the same box or not - i.e. a 12V battery is only two 6V
batteries in the same package - each cell has its own cold cranking and
amp-hour spec

this isn’t rocket science - just chemistry and ohm’s law

Bruce

If I remember my university electrical class (a LOOOONG time ago mind), am I
not correct in saying: 2 batteries in series double the voltage same
current; 2 batteries in parallel double the current (amperage) same voltage?

Bob
681431-----Original Message-----
From: owner-xk@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xk@jag-lovers.org] On Behalf Of
Bruce Cunningham
Sent: November 07, 2007 10:15 AM
To: xk@jag-lovers.org
Subject: Re: [xk] Batteries - single 12v or pair of 6v ?

and BTW - in calculating the specs for two sixes in series, just double the
specs for one

lead/acid batteries are just sets of 2V cells connected in series whether
they are in the same box or not - i.e. a 12V battery is only two 6V
batteries in the same package - each cell has its own cold cranking and
amp-hour spec

this isn’t rocket science - just chemistry and ohm’s law

In reply to a message from Bob England sent Wed 7 Nov 2007:

Yep. So long as you are talking single phase, DC, that is correct.–
The original message included these comments:

If I remember my university electrical class (a LOOOONG time ago mind), am I
not correct in saying: 2 batteries in series double the voltage same
current; 2 batteries in parallel double the current (amperage) same voltage?
Bob


Mike Spoelker 672027
Louisville, KY, United States
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Bob - absolutely right - and two batteries in parallel is like one battery
with cells twice as large. Two or more batteries in series - just add up the
total number of cells and multiply by 2 to get volts.

There are some applications with multiple batteries with a two-way switch
for series or parallel connection so you can get more volts to the starter
for cranking power by switching to series configuration. Just don’t try that
unless you have a starter motor designed for that lest you burn up your
starter. Some of the big diesel trucks and heavy equipment are set up that
way.

oops - sorry - series doubles the voltage and current doubles as well with
the same resistance

parallel with the same resistance will produce the same current with twice
the amp-hours available

Ohm’s Law: E=IR (I think E is for Electromotive force. I can’t remember why
they use I for current.

Bob,

Correct and a very good simple “rule of thumb”!

Mike,

Does DC have “phases” down by you?

Have fun guys and remember that if you put your battery in backwards your
horns will suck instead of blow!

Regards,

Rick

Bruce,

You are close to the battery answer when you said “bulk”, but the better
way for the laymen to differentiate between “good” “better” and “best” is
by weight! Wiich set up weighs more, factoring in the hard rubber or
plastic cases out, to estimate dead lead weight. The overall electrical
worth of a conventional lead acid battery resides in how much lead it
contains. Newbie battery companys try to optimize the wetted plate
surfaces by rolling up insulated foil strips but it is still the amount
of lead that is the key. Heavier is better!

Regards,

Rick

Beaulieu,

I’d turn the engine over by hand (short wrench) long before I applied
battery to the cranking motor! And depending on how long it has “sat” I
would also seriously consider forcing oil through the system via the main
oil galley at the base of the block. It will not guarantee that all
bearing points are wet, but it will be better than rapidly spinning a dry
engine until it pumps by itself.

Regards,

Rick
On Wed, 7 Nov 2007 01:42:37 +0100 “beaulieu” beaulieu@rock.com writes:> Hi

I was going to try and turn over the motor on the XK 120

It still has the original batteries in it,

Can I just use a single 12v battery to turn it over ?
I do not think there is a small enough 12v battery to fit in
the battery box so I will probably later send the original
batteries out and get them rebuilt somewhere…

What would you do ?

thanks Beaulieu

beaulieu
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–

In reply to a message from holland-rick@juno.com sent Thu 8 Nov 2007:

Hi…

I planned to pull the plugs , oil up the top end with Marvel
Oil and then turn it by hand ,

it looks easier to do a screwdriver against the flywheel
teeth ,

or is a socket ob the front pulley better ? What size socket ?

Thanks–
The original message included these comments:

Beaulieu,
I’d turn the engine over by hand (short wrench) long before I applied
battery to the cranking motor! And depending on how long it has ‘‘sat’’ I
would also seriously consider forcing oil through the system via the main
oil galley at the base of the block. It will not guarantee that all
bearing points are wet, but it will be better than rapidly spinning a dry
engine until it pumps by itself.


beaulieu
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php

In reply to a message from beaulieu sent Fri 9 Nov 2007:

Hi Beaulieu

A one and five sixteenths inch socket should fit.–
The original message included these comments:

or is a socket ob the front pulley better ? What size socket ?


Gary Grant S818919DN
Ottawa, Canada
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I would turn the crank with a wrench on the front end bolt. Its a 1-5/16"
socket.
Rob Reilly - 679187

In reply to a message from holland-rick@juno.com sent Thu 8 Nov 2007:

Why, lunar phases, of course!–
The original message included these comments:

Mike,
Does DC have ‘‘phases’’ down by you?
Have fun guys and remember that if you put your battery in backwards your
horns will suck instead of blow!
Regards,
Rick


Mike Spoelker
Louisville,Kentucky, United States
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Beaulieu,

I used an “antique” adjustable “spanner” that grabs the corners of the
bolt hex. My wrench is offset and acts like a socket but it isn’t thin
like a socket. The bolt head will take a one and five sixteenths socket
if you have one. Have patience, don’t force it, and take some
precautions if you try turning it over “tooth by tooth”.

I’d soak it from the top down for a while unless you know for sure it had
recently rotated freely.

Best of luck,

Regards,

Rick
On Fri, 9 Nov 2007 20:52:30 +0100 “beaulieu” beaulieu@rock.com writes:> In reply to a message from @holland-rick sent Thu 8 Nov

2007:

Hi…

I planned to pull the plugs , oil up the top end with Marvel
Oil and then turn it by hand ,

it looks easier to do a screwdriver against the flywheel
teeth ,

or is a socket ob the front pulley better ? What size socket ?

Thanks

The original message included these comments:

Beaulieu,
I’d turn the engine over by hand (short wrench) long before I
applied
battery to the cranking motor! And depending on how long it has
‘‘sat’’ I
would also seriously consider forcing oil through the system via
the main
oil galley at the base of the block. It will not guarantee that
all
bearing points are wet, but it will be better than rapidly
spinning a dry
engine until it pumps by itself.


beaulieu
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at
http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php

In reply to a message from holland-rick@juno.com sent Mon 12 Nov 2007:

Hello Beaulieu,

On the engine in my 150, it had sat in a barn for over 30 years. I
was told that the motor was frozen.

I found that only the water pump was frozen. Once I removed the
belt I was able to turn the motor by hand with a wrench on the
front crankshaft nut as described.

Just information for you in case you encounter a similar situation.
Regards, JB–
The original message included these comments:

Oil and then turn it by hand ,
Thanks

Beaulieu,


JB150S
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