XK145/150 steering rack info

IIRC, I emulated the setup that the XKE uses from an old 65 rack I have. That works fine and I just abandoned the arcane XK140/150 setup. It’s been a while now so I can’t detail it and I don’t have pics, but if you look at the XKE rack stuff, you’ll see what I did.

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Thank you @ribbler, @clivejer, @Taz for your responses. Hopefully I will make some progress getting the ball joint apart in the near future. Then I will be able to see what is inside. I don’t see how a 0.004" shim supported by a spring could form a very effective cup for the ball joint, but maybe all will become clear. I checked out Guy Broad’s catalog and I see he lists the shims (as do SNG Barratt) but not the spring (C8472). I may have to call him if I don’t get anywhere with the US suppliers. I agree that I’ve found that he has parts others don’t, and has been helpful in the past. I like the E-Type arrangement better, but it appears to rely on adjusting out the play by screwing the large nut onto the end of the rack and then locking it in position with a skinny lock nut. It thus avoid the need for shims, but does require a male thread on the outer surface of the rack, which the XK140 rack does not have. I’m struggling to see how an XK140 rack could be adapted to use XKE components to this end. Maybe all will become clear with more thought on my part. Thanks again everyone!

Hi David,

See also this thread: [E-Type] Help with XK-140 steering rack.

According to the XK150 spare parts catalog, the shims come in two thicknesses 0.010" and 0.004", and are the same as used for shimming brake calipers. It also says the spring goes behind the shims. The XK140 catalog describes it as an anti-rattle spring. Spring and shims available from SNG and XKs Unlimited - seems they are used on later cars as well.

Regards,
Clive.

Thank you Clive. Interesting that Mike’s initial post indicates that the joint has a female cup which makes more sense, though it’s missing from the Jaguar Parts List. I have more shims on order together with the two tab washers so I hope it will be fixable if I can get it apart. From a quick test the joint on the other side seems to have much less play, so I hope to leave it alone.

Hi David,

Guessing the cup is from an e-type, it is listed there. My XK150 joint did not have a cup. I suppose I dismantled the other side to clean and lube at the same time.

Clive

Bingo, found the worn out inner tie rod, an it does have a cup! I think only Guy did the complete joint.

There are also two pounded out shims, paper thin.

Photos not so good as there was little light.

Clive.

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looks right to my damaged head- as i remember the tab was broken on lock tab.by me or previous. looks right to me now compared to diagram in my 140 factory parts manual opposite page 95 plate AC . may have more info from long ago west coast & uk clubs if you require? john

I managed to get my joint apart late yesterday after manufacturing a 11/16"-16 jam nut from a truck lug nut. It appears that what I found matches Clive’s photos.



In my case I had 5 shims between the cup and the cap - 2 thick ones (probably 0.010") and three thin ones (probably 0.004"). The spring sits in the hexagonal recess in the cap, and the shims and cup sit on the annulus around the hexagonal hole, so the spring is only in play to prevent things rattling around if there is any play. The flaw in the design to my eyes is that the locking tab washer goes between the face of the cap and the “nut” that holds the ball. As a result, the thickness of the tab washer determines the number of shims required to set up the joint. The washer on my joint appears to have had a hard life, and to have been made of fairly soft steel. The area where it contacts the nut and cap has been squeezed thin, presumably as it has been re-used and probably over-tightened. I can see that setting up this joint is going to be a challenge, as even with a new washer, which being a modern reproduction will probably me made of Chinese “butter metal”, the number of shims will depend on how tightly you do up the nut. I’m inclined to think that it really isn’t intended to be tightened much at all, but relies on the tab washer doing it’s job to keep it together. I’m going to have to think hard about the order I assemble this, as the cap also screws into the end of the rack with a second tab washer…

Congratulations David,

I agree with everything you say, including no need to tighten the nut too much given the tabbed washers - maybe it is designed that way to allow you to tighten the nut just up to the point there is no more play, once you have it shimmed near enough.

These tabbed washers do seem a very Heath Robinson/Rube Goldberg approach!

Regards,
Clive.

I had the same thought. Just a note for others who might be looking for the cup that is not listed in the Parts List. It is 1" diameter, with a total height of 1/4". Maybe it is the same as the one used on the E-Type - I don’t have one to hand to check. It appears to be made of steel.

shim c11723 0.010inch - # as required
shim c7569 0.004 - # as required
above noted selective thickness
spring anti rattle c8472 behind shims
tab washer securing ball housing c7605 - for use with slotted type ball housing
tab washing securing ball housing c10027 - for use with hexagonal ball housing many chassis # and series fitment

I reassembled the inner tie rod yesterday with a new flat washer C.10027, a new dished washer C.8053, and more 4 thou shims C.7569.


I ended up adding 0.020" of shims to the 0.049" already in the sloppy joint, for a total of 0.069". The flat tab washer C.10027 is very thick (1/16"), so it takes a considerable amount of violence to bend the sides over against the nut to secure the cap. I ended up using a blunt axe head that I hit with a 4lb hammer. Of course, you really need to be sure you’ve got the shimming right before you bend the tabs over…

The dished washer C.8053 has an internal tang that needs to be shaped to do it’s job.


I found a great piece of advice from @Bob_K1 in this thread Xk140 tie rod ends

and shaped the washer accordingly:


The tang fits in one of the two slots in the end of the rack like so:

You have to take care to avoid the tang getting out of position as you tighten the tie rod into the end of the rack. To avoid damaging the tang you shouldn’t overtighten it.

To secure the inner tie rod to the rack you then need to stake the dished tab washer to the cap of the joint at the three notches in the cap. Easier said than done with the rack installed in the car…You can see two of the stake points here.

Then you just have to screw the outer tie rod end into the inner tie rod tube. If you haven’t removed the outer tie rod end this requires that you rotate the inner tie rod joint many (20+) full turns, which in my case proved to be a trial. As the inner tie rod ball joint is far from straight when the full weight of the car is not on the front suspension, my somewhat worn ball joint was very tight at a couple of points per revolution. The vice grips have left their impression on the inner tie rod tube… The good news is that the play in the joint has gone, so maybe my wheel shimmy will have gone with it. Time will tell. Thanks everyone for their help and advice.

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Knowing your attention to detail, the wheels are running true, yes?

True enough, I think. I measured about 1/16" runout on each front wheel, maybe a tad more. The reason I’m focussing on the steering as a cause of the wheel shimmy is that it seems to be triggered by taking a gentle curve at some speed (50-55 mph). On a dead straight road it doesn’t seem to happen. That said, I’ve only measured the run out with the wheels off the ground. If I’ve got some loose spokes, maybe the run out is a lot more with the weight of the car on the wheels. I should probably look at that…

Time for a “tink tink TONK” test!

Yes indeed…

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Just bumping up this old thread as it covers info that i was struggling with on my 150 rack(current steering rack thread)…the small cup that the inner end of the tie rod fits into…any one found a source for them…i can get the new tie rod and nut but not the cup…is it the same as from an XKE(SNGB have them) C7599 tie rod end socket… .Also does anyone know a source for just the large nut that holds the tie rod ball to the rack…thanks…Steve

Steve - you could try Kiley and Clinton Engineering in Birmingham. They rebuilt my rack which solved all sorts of steering related issues.
Ian

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Steve,

Try Guy Broad - he supplied me complete tie rod with nut and cup, etc.

Regards,
Clive.

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Just to add for info the larg nut and cup are the same as those used on the E type steering rack. …Steve