Delco Window Motor 88-89

XJ-S
1

My driver’s window has always been a bit slow at the end. Well, recently it will suddenly stop working, and then suddenly one day work again. I checked switch, everything looks fine, motor is getting a good +/- 12V.

I discovered this in Kirby’s Book, and sure enough, when I tapped the motor with my fist, the window started working again.

So I will look at the bolts, but does anybody have any photos or more info on exactly which bolts? The description in the book is a bit abstract. Thanks!

The Book, Page 610 :
1988-89 ELECTRIC WINDOW MOTOR FAILURES: On the ‘88-89 Delco units, the housing on the motor itself gets loose and jams the rotor, or lets water in. Victor Naumann says, “I have replaced a lot of motors that the back has fallen off of and water has ruined.” Steven Draper reports, “After taking the door apart, I noticed that the case on top of the window motor that holds the magnets is held on by only two bolts. The rear bolt had slipped some, and could not be tightened completely because of
the soft metal. The bit of play between that casing with the magnets and the internals of the motor that spin about was enough to cause the motor to only work when you beat the side of the door. I inserted a slightly larger bolt with a nut on the bottom. I was able to put the new bolt in without taking the motor out. Believe it or not, the window now rockets up and down. If you’ve got a window that doesn’t want to go up and down and tapping on the door helps, this could be your problem.” If you can’t find a suitable long bolt, consider threaded rod with a nut at both ends.

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2

It’s the two long bolts that hold the motor cover to the motor body.
Once you get the motor out I’m pretty sure it will be all self-explanatory.

But if you want to make your windows work like a modern car install relays. It will make all the difference.

3

after an awful lot of work fixing mine… I finally changed the whole mechanism motor… riser and all to an older one… bolts right in… works fast and no more trouble… those 88-89 motors are crap

4

Thanks for the replies…I just found a post from 2003 by Doug (DD), he apparently found a Cardone 42-130 motor for $55 that works fine. You just have to swap your lower gear drive from Jaguar/Delco one to the Cardone.

I will see if I can fix my current motor, but will buy this Cardone and keep it as an option. It’s only $45 now!

Regarding relay, I was thinking about that, but I’m getting a solid 12V at the motor via my switch.

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5

Cheaper on Rock Auto.

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6

That’s where I just bought it! I added the $7 core charge and rounded up, since i won’t be sending anything back.

Tax and shipping, $58 total.

On Wednesday we had a hot 90F here in Seattle. My car was parked in sun all day. So hot, i couldn’t hold onto steering wheel. Let me tell you, driving home with only passenger window down and no A/C, in stop and go traffic, i sweat like a pig.

7

That’s trpical weather in Alabama. This is the first week this summer when it hasn’t been 95+ everyday. A/C is not an option, it’s a requirement.

8

Yes, you get 12v at the motor, but that’s without any load.
Even if you had the thinnest little cable you would still get the same.
And presuming your battery is charged, you already lost 0.5 volts.
Very different story when the motor is running. Those extra Ohms of all the meters of cable going back and forth slow things down a lot.
I have put relays and the speed of the windows going up and down doubled.

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9

Which is why I love the PNW!

Sure we have a lot of rain and cloudy days, but it’s quite rare to get above 90F or below 32F.

We have plenty of water.

And 2/3rds of our electricity is hydroelectric.

10

Ok, i may look into it. Where did you put your relay for driver door, and what 12V/fuse supply did you use?

I will also take a voltage reading later today with engine running and headlights on to check drop.

11

And high humidity in south Alabama. Temp in 90s and humidity as well. A/C struggles sometimes

12

This will also not be very conclusive Greg, the only thing it will tell you is that your headlights also need relays…

Many ways to go around it.
Ideally is to have the relays inside the doors with big nice cables directly from the battery.
Albeit quite complicated, at least for my saloon with four doors.

I did half way in between and put everything under the center console and kept some of the original wiring. It was the simplest/easiest.

13

You need to load up the window motor bigtime to learn anything constructive here.

A voltmeter attached to the circuit while you load up the motor by holding the switch on after the glass has reached full stop.

Like Aristide said, relays are your friend here.

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14

I will see how it is with new motor and no relay, I don’t need supersonic speed.
My passenger window still works fine, and is quite fast enough.

Or is this so you can chop off people’s fingers who reach into your car? :wink:

One issue I see of having relay and live 12V in door is an accident. If you get hit in the door, you could easily start a fire.

15

If window lift switch failures are irking you, here is a copy of a post I made back in April 2007.
( No idea why bold type )

5 years ago I fitted relays to power the coupe windows as
suggested in the Book.
It did kind of put a shot of iron in those anaemic windows, now they
really move.
Not only that, no longer do the window switches need pulling out every
12 months to have the contacts cleaned up as is the case with the XJ6.

In the coupe I used standard DIN type auto relays, 2 per window. That
is a bit messy to fit and wire.

At the time I tried to find twin coil relays designed for window
lifting duty, but nobody had stock. A couple of years ago the same
outfit we buy the bankrupt stock from had a swag of window lift
relays, Japanese Matsushita which is a good brand. I bought 50 or
100, don’t quite remember but I know they were cheap. During an idle
moment, which are hard to come by nowadays, I made up a printed
circuit layout which includes the relay plus 1/4" quick connect tabs,
and loops on the board so you can daisy chain the +12V fused hot wires
needed to make a neat wiring job. As it was a small board it was easy
to squeeze a hundred or so on normal production panels so they cost
next to nothing.

The convertible windows appear to move pretty quick in any case. Do
they have larger motors, which I can believe, or did Jaguar fit window
lift relays ?

I really have no time or plan to solder those boards plus window lift
relays, except a few for the convertible and as spares, but if there
are list members feel the need I can supply kits of parts but not in a
big hurry. You need 2 boards, one in each footwell.

A kit of 2 boards is going to be roughly US$20 including a
spare relay just in case, as they are not relays you can easily buy retail.
Contact me off list.

Richard Dowling, Melbourne, Australia: 1979 XJ-S; 1985 XJ6; 1988
XJ-S V12 convertible

There is a photo in the archives;
http://www.jag-lovers.org/v.htm?1176283393

This shows a couple of DIN relays I used for one window in the coupe.
It also shows the printed circuit board made up with the dedicated twin coil window lift relay.
The board does the same job as the 2 DIN relays but is much easier to wire up and is more compact.
From memory about 20 kits were sold to forum members, some of who are still around and some who have departed to a higher place. I think at the time maybe the kit was about USD25 in the end + postage.
This was a labour of love, there are easier ways to make money.

I never heard back of any problems from anybody who bought a kit.
I know there are still some of the parts kicking around in the factory for more kits. If there is interest
on the forum I can ask the lady who assembles our boards if she will make up more kits at home. I cannot afford to have her do this in regular factory time.
I will check what we have, and what we need to buy in. My guess is USD40 a kit + postage.

16

You already have a live 12V in your door Greg, for the door locks.
If it’s fused there is no danger.

17

I remember that ! :slight_smile:

Cheers
DD

18

This sorta goes back to some recent discussions about upgrades.

For me: The window goes up. The window goes down. I’m happy. If the process takes 4 seconds or 7 seconds I don’t care. Adding relays and wiring introduces more possible failure points.

This is just me blathering and not intended to disparage upgrading. :slight_smile:

Carry on !

Cheers
DD

19

Not so sure it is about speed. For me this eliminates the need to fix or replace window switches.

Did this to a W123 coupe in 1983, still functions perfectly today after fussing with switches for almost ever, before.

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20

Duly noted! And so much of what we do depends on our own experiences.

I’ve owned several Jags over the last 25 years. I’ve replaced a couple of switches, and repaired a few switches…for an overall grand total of maybe $60 cost and a couple hours of labor. So, for me, there’s not a lot of incentive to change the system.

Others with worse experiences are more highly motivated.

Cheers
DD