Hi Jerry,
yes there is a difference between USA and OZ…from another forum
" NZ and AU use the RON system, while the US uses R+M/2, which gives a lower number.
As far as I can tell, the NZ 98 is about the same or slightly higher than the 93 octane from the States."
luckily, being an old guy, I was also bought up in Oz with Imperial, so I can understand what you
American gents are on about, even though we have been metric for nearly 50yrs
Tony,
Yeah, the US went metric 40 years ago too, but it was sort of voluntary and never took in everyday usage. Fasteners and measurements in US cars are metric.
The R+M/2 is an abomination forced on the government by oil companies to fool many of us to get more octane than we need (OK, it may have been useful in some places too). We used to use ROM too. Now that all modern US cars’ fuels are specified by R+M/2 it does not fool many here any more, I guess.
Jerry
Pretty messy! I use ethanol fuel regularly in my V12 for several reasons: better starts when hot (i.e., seems to reduce vapor lock because of higher vaporization temp without ethanol), a little better fuel mileage (gas has higher energy density without ethanol), and less potential for rubber parts damage. Well, also because I’m mad at the government for imposing the ethanol stuff on us in the first place!
Hi Ferman, I am glad you mentioned that the presence of ethanol in gas is very much a political situation. I am not at all sure that the politicians even considered the science of it! I do know that the presence of 10% ethanol in gasolene showed no measurable affect on engine seals as measured by ASTM standards.In a closed system as with modern cars water ingress is not an issue. With our older cars, ageing of gas( including water pick up ) is a complicated issue as gas is a complex mix of chemicals long before any water gets on the scene!! And gas exposed to moist air without ethanol still picks up water, but less so.
Two things:
Andrew’s link sure tells it !!! I could only add that Agave, a desert plant yields tequila, a more than decent ethanol. And that some cacti yield Mescal,. a powerful ethanol.
Many old metal underground storage tanks were replaced. leaking!!! Replacements? Fiberglass !! Albeit, some early ones failed.
I tried to make fuel tank from glass. A flop. wrong material and a lack of skill, mine!! Solved two 5 gallon “jerry cans”.
Carl
I could be wrong…but the reason for Gasohol was to decrease our dependency on Middle East oil. Now that we are easing up regulations and we starting to take a lead in oil production with less dependency overseas, I wonder if the Federal Gov will ease up a bit and let the industry produce non ethanol gas like the good old days. Let the market deal with it.
IMHO…Abe
Not in a coon’s age!!! The Fed’s rarely ease up. Crunch down oh yes,
Ethanol as a chemical is OK. The other stuff as to the source, not logical.
Carl
I will have to catch up later (on vacation no access to a PC) but is there an assertion that V-power is ethanol free??
Yes, but only in Canada.
My .02… The whole reason that the EPA mandated the inclusion of oxygen in gasoline was to reduce CO emissions in cars by shifting the Fuel/Ox ratio slightly to leaner without re-tuning carburetors. Now that 99% of the cars on the road have active engine controls using oxygen sensors in the exhaust to actively control fuel/air mixture, oxygen in fuel is irrelevant and totally ineffective in reducing CO. The oxygen sensors don’t care where the O2 comes from, air or fuel! As previously stated, the continued presence of C2H5OH in our fuel supply is 100% political- a payoff to the corn producing states. Reduced mileage and potential damage to older fuel systems is the price we pay. I’m not against 
- I consume small quantities on a fairly regular basis! And as for race cars specifically designed for using the stuff, it is magical due to its high octane rating.
Oh…you forgot to mention that ethanol is also “organic” making people feel good about saving mother earth.
LOL…its a joke I am not that dense…or maybe I am.
Abe
There’s a myriad of variables I’m sure. My exact #'s as recorded in Excel are
over 27,000 recorded miles
8,000 thereof with E0
8,100 with Premium (93 octane, e10)
11,000 with Regular (87 octane, e10)
Average of 5 best fillups :
Regular 31.2 mpg
e0 32.4
Premium 30.6
If you’re astute you’ll note that the e0 average was only 7.6% improved not 10% as I recollected earlier.
Regarding subconscious altering of driving, I will say that since my car produces a bit better power on Premium I tend to fill up with Premium when I’m anticipating a bit of fun, or I may drive a bit hotter, thus artificially reducing the Premium average. I used the e0 as my “regular” for several months until the station raised the price such that it was no longer economically viable for the miles that I drive.
It is a bit of humour !!!
And the trucks to haul the stuff to the distillery? Diesel…
Not sure as to the fuel for the distillation process.
I’ve yet to acquaint her with “organic chemistry”. The two word just don’t go together in her lexicon. In my former profession, we had a term for a similar thing. “Mutually repugnant”.
Carl
Funny I saw a post on Facebook from a local “import auto” place chastising anyone for using other than 93 octane in any vehicle. Their clam : even at a no-name, generic gas station the 93 octane is still “good stuff” and manufacturers are lying to customers by telling them anything less than 93 octane is safe to use in their vehicles.
Quite a bold claim! My Focus actually says it recommends 87, but develops an additional ~8hp with 93 octane. Our Navigator requires 91+. Heck even dad’s 2005 Bentley Arnage says it requires 87 octane, but “superior performance may be achieved with higher octanes” or something along those lines.
Just my opinion but the “local import auto” place doesn’t have to warrant your car, the manufacturer does, which is why I’d follow the manufacturer’s recommendations.
Once a simple choice. Roughly, an engine with a 9-1 or better compression ratio Required the high octane fuel. In some cases, retarding the static timing, would silence the “clatter of death” aka detonation.
Then came FI and sophisticated engine management. High compression as the default build. But, fuel options expanded.
Knock detectors. If the engine clattered, because of ambient conditions or fuel or other stuff, the timing is retarded, just a trifle and only as needed. Aka “superior performance”.
Low ambient temps, high moisture content. Modern engine management allows maximum advance.
Oh, air density, more power. Fuel and timing related???
But, which definition of performance? HP and torque or MPG???
It ain’t that simple !!!
Yes, running with timing advance at optimum means engine HP and torque development.
Carl
Exactly!
As I said, even an MSRP $225k Bentley “recommends” 87, and leaves up to you if you want to maximize performance via a higher octane. Something tells me they weren’t doing this specifically to appeal to penny pinchers.
I think we all need to go out and buy Bentleys…think of the savings!!! No more high octane.
Abe
Even in my 90 HP 8:1 compression 4 cyl , 3 speed , Vega I run the higher octane stuff. Lets me bump up the timing a little more without pinging. It needs all the power help it can get. My father came in town one day several years ago and I let him borrow it for the day (it used to be his from 1973-1979) . He did me a favor by returning it with a full tank. Car was pinging like crazy. I asked him what he put in and he told me REGULAR so I assumed 87 octane (thanks Dad). I dropped the timing back down for that tank. I have been timing them by ear for years now. Bump it higher until it pings when your really get on it and then back it off a little. EDIS on them now helps with this too. Silly things still get around 30 MPG running around Houston and 35+ MPG last time I took one on a highway trip. My 2 cents
David
68 E-type FHC
Let me go a step further…forget octane. There are so many different blends of gas for winter summer state to state that you can go crazy. I can tell you that my wife’s 91 300 SEL ran better and had better millage when we traveled outside of our state of Kalifornia . It took a while to make that connection back then when we did not have the volume of information we have today. I can tell you…Kalifornia gasoline formulas is Sh*t …you get lower millage and car does not run as smooth.
Abe