Today I removed the engine from below for the first time. Also the
first time removing the engine solo. It went ok but there are a
couple of things I would do differently next time, if I choose to
go this route again. I think it’s safer than pulling the engine
from above, especially solo, but I’m not so sure it will go back in
as easily as it came out.
I used a shop crane to lift the engine off its mounts and lower it
onto a dolly. So far so good, except that I also used the shop
crane to lift the front end of the car so I could roll the engine
forward, and of course the shop crane gets in the way for those
last few inches and I had to do some fancy dancing to shore the car
up and pull the crane out of the way. Easy fix is to screw a 2x4
into the ceiling above and then an I-bolt to attach a comealong.
Piece of cake. More important thing I’d do differently is leave the
IRS in place. Yes, I dropped it first. Fine if you’re going to pull
the engine but not so good if you need to raise the front of the
car up at a severe angle to wheel the engine out after dropping it.
Live and learn. I had jackstands positioned near the ends of the
monocoque frame rails and had to systematically raise them while I
raised the front end to prevent the car from sliding back. Never
any danger but it complicated and prolonged the process. 'Twould be
much simpler with chocked wheels back there to keep things stable.
Incidentally, I removed the reaction plate by relieving the torsion
bar moment on the lower A arm with a floor jack then disconnecting
the upper A arm from the subframe, letting the suspension hang then
lowering the jack. This worked very well, and was quick. Much
better than what the manual suggests.
Tomorrow the suspension and subframes come off and the monocoque
will be ready for mounting onto a rotisserie.–
1968 E-type OTS since 1982, 1954 XK120SE OTS since 1991
Ontario, Canada
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Nickolas S. sent Fri 13 Jan 2012:
Congratulations, Nick, have fun with the rebuild.
Some good tips there. A fool learns from his mistakes but a wise
man learns from the mistakes of others, glad we were able to
provide you with plenty! Don’t worry, going back in is as easy as
or easier than coming out.
Good idea taking the top A Arm off, that is a bit easier than
breaking off one of the ball joints, I’ll remember that.
Good luck with the work.
Jerry–
Jerry Mouton '64 FHC 889791 ‘MIK Jaguar’
Palo Alto, California, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from mouton sent Fri 13 Jan 2012:
Nicolas,
I’ve only done this with the IRS and wheels in place but I can
see where it might be tricky with the rear on jackstands.
Also I had use of a nice cherry picker and there was just
enough room between the two lower square tubes to roll the
engine out. Going back in is a straightforward reversal and
should be a piece of cake. Enjoy.–
Jim Horvath, '67 OTS, 1E13653
San Jose/CA, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Nickolas S. sent Fri 13 Jan 2012:
Some good tips indeed. I usually disconnect the balljoint of
the lower A-arm when working on the suspension, but it can be
quite a pig to get back in. I have to reset the torsion bars,
so I’ll give your strategy a go.–
Andrys, '69 e-type 2+2 back on the road since 14.10.2009
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
G’Day Nicholas,
Would it not be simpler to lift car with the crane from the side instead of
front so dolly would roll straight out? Could put a long plank across shop
door and use the come-along to draw out the dolly too if it was reluctant
to
roll easy. Probably something I have missed as the message crossed the
equator. :-))
Cheers, John B. 67 2+2 in Oz______________________________________________________
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In reply to a message from john bennett sent Sat 14 Jan 2012:
Thought of that, John. It wouldn’t work with my particular shop
crane because the base would still interfere with things. That
said, it doesn’t take all that much energy to lift the front of the
car once the engine is out so I could have rube goldberged an
extension onto the crane with a scrap piece of lumber, which in
retrospect would have worked quite well.–
The original message included these comments:
Would it not be simpler to lift car with the crane from the side instead of
front so dolly would roll straight out? Could put a long plank across shop
door and use the come-along to draw out the dolly too if it was reluctant
to
roll easy. Probably something I have missed as the message crossed the
equator. :-))
–
1968 E-type OTS since 1982, 1954 XK120SE OTS since 1991
Ontario, Canada
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from mouton sent Fri 13 Jan 2012:
Should have posted a couple of pics. This one is just after
disconnecting the upper A arms. 5 bolts and 5 minutes each side
using an air ratchet and 1/2’’ spanner. You’ll notice I also took
off the damper, unnecessarily. A testimony to my initial indecision
on which way to go.
This is lifting the car with the crane and attempting to roll the
engine forward. Even after positioning the arm out as far as it
would go the base of the crane interfered with the extraction and
by this time I have the car raised up quite high on jacks.
Definitely going to have the IRS in place next time.
All’s well that ends well. Now to remove what’s left of the front
suspension and subframes.
1968 E-type OTS since 1982, 1954 XK120SE OTS since 1991
Ontario, Canada
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from mouton sent Fri 13 Jan 2012:
The way I tell it: '‘A fool never learns from mistakes, a
smart man learns from HIS mistakes, a wise man learns from
EVERYONE’'S mistakes. That gives you two out of three
chances to be in a positive area of experience!–
The original message included these comments:
Some good tips there. A fool learns from his mistakes but a wise
man learns from the mistakes of others, glad we were able to
–
Michael Slos 69 E-type OTS
Scottsbluff Nebraska, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from polestar sent Sat 14 Jan 2012:
I just removed and installed my engine the same way…the torsion
bar technique works well…very easy actually–
p willetts
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Nickolas S. sent Fri 13 Jan 2012:
Nick, ‘‘WELL DONE’’. Good description of the work involved, should
be valuable info for those doing same. Thanks also for the
photos. Good job.
Bob 64 OTS–
The original message included these comments:
I used a shop crane to lift the engine off its mounts and lower it
onto a dolly. So far so good, except that I also used the shop
crane to lift the front end of the car so I could roll the engine
forward, and of course the shop crane gets in the way for those
last few inches and I had to do some fancy dancing to shore the car
up and pull the crane out of the way. Easy fix is to screw a 2x4
into the ceiling above and then an I-bolt to attach a comealong.
Piece of cake. More important thing I’d do differently is leave the
IRS in place. Yes, I dropped it first. Fine if you’re going to pull
the engine but not so good if you need to raise the front of the
car up at a severe angle to wheel the engine out after dropping it.
In reply to a message from Nickolas S. sent Fri 13 Jan 2012:
Thanks for passing this info on, very timely for me,as I’ll be
pulling my engine next week, for the first time. I had thought
about removing the torsion bar tension the same way that you did,
thanks for proving that it will work. I am blessed with an I-beam
(joist suppport) in my basement shop, so lifting the car with a
come-along will be relatively easy, after I convince my wife that
the weight will not collapse our bedroom floor!–
The original message included these comments:
Incidentally, I removed the reaction plate by relieving the torsion
bar moment on the lower A arm with a floor jack then disconnecting
the upper A arm from the subframe, letting the suspension hang then
–
EdIrwin 62 FHC
Jefferson City Missouri, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Old Ed sent Sat 14 Jan 2012:
Ed, I think convincing the wife will be harder than any work
you ever do on the car. Good Luck!
Bob 64 OTS–
The original message included these comments:
come-along will be relatively easy, after I convince my wife that
the weight will not collapse our bedroom floor!
EdIrwin 62 FHC
Jefferson City Missouri, United States
In reply to a message from Old Ed sent Sat 14 Jan 2012:
There’s hardly any weight on the front end once the engine is out -
so your I-beam will be fine for that. I assume you’re not planning
to lift the engine/transmission (800#) using the I-beam. It is
doubtful that any I beam used in residential construction subjected
to a center load of that magnitude would not deflect considerably
and cause nails or screws to pop in the floor above.–
The original message included these comments:
Thanks for passing this info on, very timely for me,as I’ll be
pulling my engine next week, for the first time. I had thought
about removing the torsion bar tension the same way that you did,
thanks for proving that it will work. I am blessed with an I-beam
(joist suppport) in my basement shop, so lifting the car with a
come-along will be relatively easy, after I convince my wife that
the weight will not collapse our bedroom floor!
–
1968 E-type OTS since 1982, 1954 XK120SE OTS since 1991
Ontario, Canada
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Nickolas S. sent Sat 14 Jan 2012:
The beam is sturdy, 8’’ web,4’’ flanges, with span of 12’ between
anchor points, with load at center of span. I’ll use my engine
hoist for the heavy work, just to be on the safe side. Thanks for
your input.–
The original message included these comments:
so your I-beam will be fine for that. I assume you’re not planning
to lift the engine/transmission (800#) using the I-beam. It is
–
EdIrwin 62 FHC
Jefferson City Missouri, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
Nicholas, Creative way of dealing with the upper A arm, I had never thought of
it, as I have just always split the top ball joint.
Larry----- Original Message ----
From: Old Ed ednsue1975@yahoo.com
To: e-type@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Sat, January 14, 2012 10:19:51 AM
Subject: Re: [E-Type] Dropping the engine - lessons learned
In reply to a message from Nickolas S. sent Fri 13 Jan 2012:
Thanks for passing this info on, very timely for me,as I’ll be
pulling my engine next week, for the first time. I had thought
about removing the torsion bar tension the same way that you did,
thanks for proving that it will work. I am blessed with an I-beam
(joist suppport) in my basement shop, so lifting the car with a
come-along will be relatively easy, after I convince my wife that
the weight will not collapse our bedroom floor!
The original message included these comments:
Incidentally, I removed the reaction plate by relieving the torsion
bar moment on the lower A arm with a floor jack then disconnecting
the upper A arm from the subframe, letting the suspension hang then
–
EdIrwin 62 FHC
Jefferson City Missouri, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Old Ed sent Sat 14 Jan 2012:
Safety first, Ed. Which leads to Lesson #3 of this exercise.
The picture I posted earlier:
depicting jackstands positioned near the ends of the monocoque
frame rails is NOT a stable configuration. As I am removing load
from the front end it is becoming apparent that the weight
distribution is shifting more toward the rear. The rear jackstands
are too close to the center of gravity and the rear overhang of the
car is biasing the weight distribution. To stabilise the situation
I’ve placed a few 50# bags of blasting grit inside the monocoque up
against the firewall, but to prop up the monocoque more safely will
require a sawhorse positioned inside the rear bulkhead.
More photos later.–
1968 E-type OTS since 1982, 1954 XK120SE OTS since 1991
Ontario, Canada
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Larry Kohler sent Sat 14 Jan 2012:
That is certainly the logical move, Larry, but you know how hard it
is to get the ball joint pin to dislodge sometimes. Dislodging the
lower ball join was simplicity itself because access is
unrestricted. Floor jack beneath to prevent movement, back off the
nut flush with the top of the pin, a few good raps with a mallet
and bronze drift and off she popped:
The upper joint will be just as easy to dislodge with the assembly
off the car.
But back to the question of stability, this is a view of how I have
the car jacked up, with the rear end overhang:
And this is how I stabilised it, with 150# of blasting grit. It
looks a bit mickey mouse, but the car is now quite solidly balanced.
This is a pretty solid car, except where the floors meet the sills.
It has to be a bit of a trick getting a badly rotted monocoque onto
a rotisserie.–
The original message included these comments:
Nicholas, Creative way of dealing with the upper A arm, I had never thought of
it, as I have just always split the top ball joint.
Larry
–
1968 E-type OTS since 1982, 1954 XK120SE OTS since 1991
Ontario, Canada
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Nickolas S. sent Sat 14 Jan 2012:
I’m a day away from dropping (or hoisting) my engine as well. I do
have a 4-post lift - aside from my air tools the best investment
I’ve ever made to support this hobby. I believe that I shouldn’t
have any trouble using the lift, keeping the car level, to lift the
car up once I have the engine on the dolly. Then I’ll just roll
the engine away. Am I missing something or will it be that simple?–
Charlie 1967 XKE 2+2
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from CGivans sent Mon 16 Jan 2012:
No, you’re not missing anything, Charlie. Once it’s on the dolly
the engine is completely free of the car. The difference between
lowering the engine vs lifting it comes down to what you need to
take off and what you can leave attached. You don’t need to take
off the damper and pointer but you do need to remove the oil filter
receiver. You also need to remove the engine mount brackets once
you’ve relieved the weight of the engine.–
The original message included these comments:
I’m a day away from dropping (or hoisting) my engine as well. I do
have a 4-post lift - aside from my air tools the best investment
I’ve ever made to support this hobby. I believe that I shouldn’t
have any trouble using the lift, keeping the car level, to lift the
car up once I have the engine on the dolly. Then I’ll just roll
the engine away. Am I missing something or will it be that simple?
–
1968 E-type OTS since 1982, 1954 XK120SE OTS since 1991
Ontario, Canada
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
Nick, thanks for sharing. These “lessons learned” by seasoned owners/mechanics are very helpful to those of us that stand at the crossroads of DIY vs. pay the professional, the latter not always an option.
