Could anybody tell me how the hooter works, for example what is the brass 7in rod under the push bit on the steering wheel cover ,its got a white plastic top ,what does it do and most importantly how can I run a live wire to attach to the brass rod in the middle of the steering shaft, ,because as far as I can tell when the rod top which has a copper ring exposed is earthed by the contact with the plate on the horn push a circuit is made sounding the horns…if the power has to be introduced though the centre of the shaft attached to the brass
Buying a spare parts book (pretty pictures) and a workshop manual (clever words) is going to solve this and a hundred problems you haven’t yet confronted.
From memory, the horn relay is fed juice via the ignition switch and the horn push onlyy grounds the circuit rather than ever being live. The wire connects to an insulated brass wiper contact that touches the bottom of the rod. The rod runs up the hollow column and emerges through the nylon insulating bush. Touching the tip of the rod with an earthed wire will sound the horn if the ignition is on. Instead of a test wire, the steering pad or horn button earths the rod via the metal back of the pad and the spring to the metal column nut. Something like that.
Don’t trustme though, trust the books
Once again, Crespin not even tempted by a thread title! This recent self-discipline must arise from living in the US as opposed to the UK? I’d speculate old age but that certainly didn’t remove any silliness from my thoughts.
On the XJ-S, that same part is known for wearing through or breaking somehow and causing an intermittent short to ground, resulting in an occasional “beep” when you’re turning the steering wheel. Usually just as you pass the police officer directing traffic. It’s supposedly pretty easy to fix, though, just slipping a length of plastic tubing around the brass rod or some such.
Believe me, it was close. Favorite was “Shouldn’t this be in a Pub?”
The brass rod goes down the steering column where it contacts a slip ring fitted to the inner column. On the outer column is a brass contact “wiper” that rubs on the slip ring. To this wiper is connected the power wire, so 12v is fed via this to the slip ring, up the brass rod to the horn push. When you press the horn push, this applies earth to the horn circuit. The brass wiper arm has a hoop on the end to increase its surface area, but it can wear through and either fail to contact, or, in extreme cases, fall off. If there is no 12v at the brass rod, I would check out the slip ring connection, top end of the upper steering column.
The ‘spear’ described fits over the brass rod inside the hollow upper and lower shaft, Anthony maintaining connection when the steering wheel is adjusted up and down…
Particularly mind Peter’s point; the horn button grounds the horn relay (through the rods) when pushed - power is the applied to the horns by the relay - not from the steering wheel. When something shorts along the line, usually at the connection between the rod and the spring loaded connection to the slip-rings - horn hoots.
As an aside; no spare parts are listed for anything inside the steering column. With any fault within the column the column is supposed to be changed. This is part of the policy; after a crash, or whatever, the column is not to be repaired…
This doesn’t actually stop adventurous owners - other ways are available, like brass rod, springs and isolation material. It just makes for more ingenuity…
xj6 85 Sov Europe (UK/NZ)
Hehe !!! Work shop book might be better !
Yeah, having live volts in the column might not be a good thing.
I screwed up my “hooter”, I think. moving the relay sans an understanding of the
circuitry… Probably will never fix it!!!
I have little respect for tooters. Not even sure if the one in my Jeep works!!!
In lieu of, tooting, I think brake, steer or accelerate.
Even when the driver of a car in front of me snoozes, i do not toot, I merely wait a bit. they usually awaken and scoot…
A fellow had a stall at a stop sign. Cranks as he might, the car would not fire. A line formed. An impatient one bean and endless toot!!! Fellow number one walked back to speak with the tooting guy,. “You seem to be doing a better job than I, You go and get my car started, and I’ll take over the tooting”.
On my S1, the brass wiper\contact had worn through. I managed to build it up using solder; seems to work, but for how long is anyone’s guess.
The basic idea was likely that the wiper wears, Kevin - not the slip-ring…
The pressure of the finger is adjustable by bending, not much pressure is required - the current flow is very low
xj6 85 Sov Europe (UK/NZ)
Yes, I am aware that it’s the wiper that wears; in extreme cases it wears right through and then sharp edges are running on the slip ring. You can bend it to restore contact, but as the surface area is much reduced it won’t last long and may damage the slip ring. The solder restores the surfacre area and is sort of a lubricant, but also soft, so no idea how long it will last. Not sure if it’s available as a separate item, but it wouldn’t be impossible to fabricate a replacement. It’s well hidden, so only needs to be functional, not pretty.
On many non-Jaguars, there is no wiper and slip ring arrangement. Rather, a length of wire is simply wrapped around the column about three times. When you turn the steering wheel one way, it tightens these loops up a bit, and when you turn the wheel the other way they loosen a little. Always seems to work pretty well. I have wondered if it wouldn’t be a decent idea to replace the Jaguar setup with such a wire. It might even be a bit quieter, not making a scraping sound as the wheel is turned.
Having experienced the ‘self-tooting’ horn I explored such and other options, Kirbert - I decided against the ‘coiled’ wire. It would likely work, but was veeery unsightly - and not easily adopted…
But I learned a lot about the horn circuit during dismantling…
xj6 85 Sov Europe (UK/NZ)
No please keep asking the question, if you haven’t been looking at other posts you will not have seen that there are some sick Bas@&*ds on here with a very warped sense of humour.
Hooray. You googled how to wire a relay. Now google how to wire Jaguar horns and any other vehicle I can recall doing. Your pretty diagram shows a system that would operate the horns all the time the ignition was on. Clever. The power switch is not the ‘tooter’ LOL.
As you’ve been told, the horn button switches the ground connection, the ignition switch operates the power feed.
Well you haven’t actually said what year or model car you’re working on, have you? I assume calling or visiting any Jaguar parts specialist would go something like this:
“Hi I have an old Jag and I need a book showing the parts, and a workshop manual, but I’m embarrassed to say I don’t know which books to buy.”
“Hello Sir, I’m sure we can help. What year and model is the Jag?”
“According to the glovebox handbook and the advert I bought it from, it’s a Series 2 Daimler Double Six, 197( )”
“Jolly good. Nice car. It’s a rare beast but I’m going to go out on a limb here for you sir…I have a hunch the books you need might be the Series 2 Daimler Double Six Parts Catalogue and the Series 2 Daimler Double Six Service Manual. Would those be suitable do you think?”
“How do I know? I want you to tell me - you’re the expert!”
“Yes Sir, quite so. My little joke. It gets a bit quiet here sometimes with only the spark plugs for conversation.”
“You talk to spark plugs? Does it help?”
“Oh indeed Sir. Most helpful. On any given morning we might cover anything from pauline eschatology, to Kierkegaard’s influence on Barthian philosophy.”
“Really? I’ll take a dozen!”
“Thank you, sir. Will be anything else?”
“Well, as a matter of fact I’m having problems with my tooter. It keeps going of at odd times. Very embarrassing actually - catches me out any time from first thing in the morning to last thing at night. Seems to have a mind of its own sometimes. Frightens the ladies I must say!”
“How awful. Have you seen anyone about it?”
“Well I was thinking of showing the young mechanic near me. Handsome lad, very good with his hands. One of those chaps who’ll try anything if he can be of service. He’d drop everything and come over if it was an emergency. Doesn’t charge much either. I asked him recently, I said “Everard, how do you get by when you charge so little?”
“Customer satisfaction,” he said. “Satisfied customers come back for more, Mr Wooster.”
“The lad has a point, Sir.”
“He has several actually, in his ears, eyebrows, cheek and nose. Plus a dozen big ones on his leather collar.”
“How exotic sir. Shall I wrap these for you?”
“No, that’s fine. What do I owe you?”
“Three pounds ten shillings. Call it three guineas if you pop Everard’s address on this scrap of paper for me.”
“Righto! Three guineas it is. Tell him Bertie sent you. Must dash.
“Happy tooting mister, er, Wooster.”
Surely, you jest !!!
Nobody said you were disruptive or wanted you to be removed.
Most Brits seem to have a good sense of humour, it’s usually us Germans being accused of not having any
I feel at least partly responsible–encouraging British humour as it were (and, I admit, thoroughly enjoying it). I suppose Wodehouse is not among Mr. Matthews’ favourites.
Anthony, I must agree with you on this one I did feel Peters initial response was a bit harsh, but the Bertie Wooster bit was a BIT funny.
Please take your caps off.