This request is for any Forum member who has an unrestored Series 3 E-type V12. The question only pertains to Series 3 cars Thank You.
I’m attempting to confirm when Jaguar was producing the Series 3 E-type they first primed the body. Next, before applying the color coat, the LH Firewall area where the Vehicle Chassis Number is stamped they placed a small piece of tape over the number. After the car was painted the tape was removed. Rumor has it this was done to make the Chassis Number easier to read. Can this be verified or discounted?
If anyone who owns a S3 E-type and can locate the stamped Chassis Number the question is: Body color or Primer color? Of course any pictures provided would help to set the subject to rest. Any and all assistance is most appreciated.
Dick
I have a Series III OTS; unfortunately, I had the car repainted in 1985 so I can’t help,
Good Luck – this is gonna be interesting. Watching this one . . .
I have had my 71 OTS since late 1982 and the number stamped on the firewall has always just been painted body colour - in my case black. Was quite readable. I have no idea about tape being put over the number but mine seems to have just been painted along with the rest of the panel.
No point in including pics as the area has since been repainted - but I remember it well as it was necessary to prove car identity when imported to Aust and then subsequently registered. Was black and readable without any scrapping.
Hi Dick,
The tape scenario is a myth. We currently have four S3 cars in work that are original, unmolested cars, plus another four that have been painted, but where the bulkhead has not been repainted and is clearly original; none have had tape put over the VIN. Further, we have handled hundreds of S3 cars over the years and none have been as you described.
My observation is that the bulkhead only got lick and a promise regarding top coat colour, with many examples showing the Red Oxide primer through the colour in areas. Accordingly, there has not been anywhere near enough paint applied to make the VIN hard to read.
Yes, I have S3 OTS, #1S20183 build date Feb 17th 1972, still unrestored. It has been oversprayed in white (original colour) but the engine bay has not and the hood (top) and the interior have never been apart.
I can confirm and find photos once I get back in the office.
I also documented and found interesting that the bonnet catches were mounted when the car was painted at the factory
(Series 3 only I believe) so there is body colour paint on the catches and the seals under them. Under the seals is only dark primer, just like the chassis number under the heater.
But the large(ish) rubber plugs in the front if the sills have not been there in the paint shop as I could clerly see the white paint sprayed inside the sill with a borescope. Those paint streaks also show a bit of how the paint was originally applied.
The photo I have of the vin# on the LH side on the body is not very good as I have never removed the heater and the number is pretty much hidden by the heater.
When you say firewall I think you actually do mean the firewall? I have the chassis number also in the firewall but I thought that had been done by the Belgian importer.
It says * • 1S20183 •* exactly like that, with the asterisk at both ends.
BUT I think Dick was referring to the factory stamping on the LH side of the body, on the slanted surface under the heater, which on my car appears to have had a piece of tape on it when the car was painted and then the tape was torn away do the number does not have body colour paint on it, only some dark primer.
Cheers!
Ps. Clsusager’s book has a photos of this, but IIRC does not comment about the paint etc.
Sorry not following the meaning of your post - yes I am talking about the 1S%%%% number stamped on the slanted surface of the firewall under the heater. The generic name of the complete panel that separates the cabin from the engine bay is called a firewall. I think we are saying the same thing. The number was stamped by the manufacturer not an importer as my car is a UK car and did not get imported from anywhere when new.
OK, we all should have that, but additionally, at least some cars in Europe had the importer add another chassis number in a place which was easier for the MOT to see.
Here are my photos.
That place under the heater shows:
ES3V12
*1S20183
In the first one you can also see faintly some factory white paint inside the sill though the hole in the panel. None of the bonnet catch holes had any paint inside them.
I suspect they started doing this already much earlier, I can post some paint shop photos as early as June 1966.
The details of by front subframes have marking that I am unaware of what they mean (could just be markings at production to match a jig or something.
The handwritten 29/12 most likely is the manufacturing date of the front subframe of my car, being December 29th in 1971 as the car was assembled on February 17th 1972.
First I would like to thank one and all who responded, providing what information they could. Thank You. As for Pekka you have debunked the “Chassis Number taped myth”. Your great archive photographs captured a portion of how Jaguar painted the cars at the factory… Your photos clearly show Jaguar did, indeed, tape over the Chassis stamped number on the bulkhead firewall area BEFORE painting. Did they do this throughout the production years of the S3? That remains a question to be answered but Pekka’s photos confirm the practice was real…
Pekka, your photos are a most valuable record and I thank you for sharing with the Forum. All members should commend you for having foresight to record such minor details, all so important to the history and legacy of the S3 E-type.these many years later.
Again, a hearty “Thank You” to all who responded and three cheers to Pekka. Well done all.
My Car is original (1971) and the number was painted with primer and body colour. I believe the whole car was dipped in paint with the engine frames fitted.
Hi Chris,
Welcome to the Forum. Is you car a Series 2 6 cylinder or a Series 3 V12? Updating your profile with vehicle info will go a long ways for members who want to assist.
Not sure whether S3 cars were dipped in primer but they were hand painted. No robots back in the day! The process was not standardized as some had the VIN taped over and probably the majority did not. The car was painted with the engine frames fitted along with the doors, boot lid and bonnet.
Hi Dick, Thanks for the welcome and pointing me in the right direction. I have just updated my profile to show E-Type series 3. V12. In the process of rebuilding following a fire in the engine bay. Hence the question I posted about the Jaguar special tool JD25. Which has been answered very efficiently with a drawing showing dimensions which my manual dosen’t have.
Chris
There were round small decals tgat were either isoection marks or just to tell that a subassembly was ready to be mounted. I found one inside the radio console, one on the steering column (underside).
Mine is from February 1972 (tha car will soon have it ‘s 50th birthday! ) and I aggree to some kind if dipping and painting with the subframes and bonnet catches attached to the body, but for the chassis number on the body they had it taped over before primer and paint was applied, so then the tape was removed later, it left that part unpainted, as you can see in the photos. Maybe they started doing it after some time of 2+2 production in 1971 when they realized that due to the location the number was very difficult to read? Just a thiought.
Ahh, the welder probably did that date marking. It’s on one of the front corners of the front subframe, you can see the black fresh air tube next to it.
) and I aggree to some kind if dipping and painting with the subframes and bonnet catches attached to the body, but for the chassis number on the body they had it taped over before primer and paint was applied, so then the tape was removed later, it left that part unpainted, as you can see in the photos. Maybe they started doing it after some time of 2+2 production in 1971 when they realized that due to the location the number was very difficult to read? Just a thiought.