[v12-engine] Engine dimensions

V12-Engine
21

Joost you’re full of ideas! Nothing I love more than a free exchange of ideas
(well, except for actually working on my car).

Oh, and what are you doing with the intake too? I take it that the
stock intake manifold doesn’t accept the tubing from the turbos? Or
do you plan on attaching the tubing to the air filter base?

I’m fabricating my own intake manifolds. I haven’t decided for certain on a
design yet, but I have a pretty good idea. Not 100% from scratch, I’m going
to start with factory manifolds and butcher from there.

Just an idea I had: maybe you could build a complete dual-circuit
turbo system? One turbo on each bank, complete with it’s own
intercooler, then both tubes go to the intake manifold where
they’ll join in a T piece. It might take up less space that way,
plus you could brag about having two intercoolers. If you can mount
two of 'm.

Dual intercoolers have already been figured into the equation, as well as
which intercoolers to use, where to place them, etc. So we’re thinking along
the same lines here. Twin-turbos, twin-intercoolers. There will be a
crossover between banks unless I have a common plenum (have to see… depends
on what I can get away with).

In the book I downloaded from jag-lovers.org, there was a
description of the cooling system. The jag radiator design seems
overly complex. Wouldn’t it be easier / more efficient to have two
(smaller) radiators, one for each bank? Again, there might be
problems with finding the space to mount both of 'm, but if the
space is available, wouldn’t it work better? (perhaps improving the
cooling of the engine, as I learned that the V12 runs quite hot)

No, I’m using a single radiator but my cooling system will be a pretty strong
departure from factory otherwise. I know what I’m going to do, and will post
details once it’s done. Not sure when exactly in the project I’m going to do
the cooling system. Will probably be after the actual motor has been
assembled since certain dimensions may be dependent on where other things are
placed.

-Ted
'82 Jaguar XJ-S – 5.3L V12

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22

In reply to a message from Ted DuPuis sent Fri 30 Jan 2004:

Well, if I come up with any more ideas, usefull or not, I will
post 'm here…

What boost levels do you intend to run on? How much do you think
the engine can handle?

btw, I’ve posted a message in your thread about the head gaskets.–
The original message included these comments:

Joost you’re full of ideas! Nothing I love more than a free exchange of ideas
(well, except for actually working on my car).

–
Joost van Ekris
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–

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23

Well, if I come up with any more ideas, usefull or not, I will
post 'm here…

Sounds good

What boost levels do you intend to run on? How much do you think
the engine can handle?

10-15 psi. I think the engine could handle more, so long as you change the
pistons (lower compression) and ensure your cooling system is up to the task.
Of course, this is all theoretical. One day I will see what a 100% stock V12
can do. Just not yet.

btw, I’ve posted a message in your thread about the head gaskets.

You did? Could you send it to me again off-list (@Ted_DuPuis1)? I don’t see
it.

-Ted

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24

Dual intercoolers have already been figured into the equation, as well
as
which intercoolers to use, where to place them, etc. So we’re thinking
along
the same lines here. Twin-turbos, twin-intercoolers. There will be a
crossover between banks unless I have a common plenum (have to see…
depends
on what I can get away with).

I been trying to get him to go with more efficient liquid to air
intercoolers, but he won’t listen to me. Its like he thinks its his
project or something. :slight_smile:

details once it’s done. Not sure when exactly in the project I’m going
to
do
the cooling system. Will probably be after the actual motor has been
assembled since certain dimensions may be dependent on where other
things
are
placed.

Hopefully before your monster generates too much heat for the system to
dissipate.

BTW the TOOLS will go out Monday latest. (Might use them tonight)--------------------
Robert
73XJ12HE
87XJ-SC

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25

Ted,
Having turbos on my other two cars (Volvo turbos), I’ve had a little fun
playing with them and even rebuilt and old Garrett T3 on my old 740T.
My advice is to troll the 300ZX discussion/for sale boards as they have a
common mod where they upgrade the twin turbos to greater capacity and
routinely sell off the matched pair of the older OEM turbos for reasonable
prices.
PS I’ve seen Volvo 740 Turbo manifolds including turbo(Misubishi and Garrett
Air Research) and all plumbing go for < $150USD on the various volvo and
ebay sites. Rebuild kits and/or replacement cartridges are around
$100-150USD
Volvo 2.3L turbos pre 86 are oil cooled and don’t last long but post 85 with
water&oil cooling last forever in the Volvo applications.
Looking forward to your project pictures as I have always been keeping my
eye out for a pre HE engine to purchase as a turbo project someday. (Many of
my plans are a little behind now that I have 6 mo old twins)

Patrick
82 XJS HE
98 V70 R AWD
85 740T (upgraded water cooled turbo)

probably should have clarified that. It’s easy to tell with these turbos if
it’s a GM8, because it says so on the little panel with a serial # and
everything. Specifically, I’m looking to spend <$250-300 on a used turbo.
Would, of course, pay more for a new/rebuilt one. Mileage is of minimal
importance to me, if it’s really in bad shape I can rebuild it myself. I’m
going to go junkyard hopping this weekend for one, but if anyone happens to
be going junkyard hopping I would appreciate it if you’d take a few minutes
to look around. For reference, when you spin these turbos they should spin
VERY freely and VERY easily, virtually no effort involved, and there should
be zero shaft play.

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26

You can add this one as well. NAYYY, but I was reasonably happy with their
W58 conversion…especially at the cost.
Patrick
82 XJS HE Supra 5 speed Canada

http://www.dellowauto.com.au/main.html

In reply to a message from Robert Warnicke sent Thu 29 Jan 2004:

Are there any other gearboxes, besides the 3 speed, available for
the V12 engine?

Yes. Anything you want.

http://www.conversioncomp.co.nz/results.html?category=Jaguar&submit.x=24
&submit.y=28

http://www.johnscars.com/

http://www.vintagejag.com/Store/articles.htm

http://www.keislerauto.com/--------------------
Robert
73XJ12HE
87XJ-SC

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27

I been trying to get him to go with more efficient liquid to air
intercoolers, but he won’t listen to me. Its like he thinks its his
project or something. :slight_smile:

Gee, I wonder why that is! :stuck_out_tongue: Suffice it to say that you like your
water-to-air intercoolers and I (for this purpose) like my air-to-air
intercoolers. If I were drag racing I’d use water-to-air for sure, though.
Remember, I love doing highway pulls where there is a whole bunch of air
flowing through at high velocity. :slight_smile:

Hopefully before your monster generates too much heat for the system to
dissipate.

We’ll see. I wouldn’t call it a monster, but the cooling system should be
pretty much taken care of by that point. We shall see.

BTW the TOOLS will go out Monday latest. (Might use them tonight)

No problem. I have plans for using them next weekend. Going to pull apart the
old motor (at least some of it).

-Ted

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28

Patrick,

Thanks for the advice. My mom used to have a Volvo S70 GLT before she got the
Infiniti last summer. That was a fun car. Very durable, too, especially
considering how I treated it. Anyway.

The turbos you suggested are certainly options, although I don’t really think
they would be very well suited to my application. I’ve done the math with a
lot of turbos (not those, but many others) and ones in that class are
basically just too small to run as a pair. For a long time that’s what I was
thinking of doing, though.

I made some progress this weekend (although not as much as I had planned),
next weekend will probably be some more major progress, when I can actually
pull the motor apart at least part way and start having the cams and pistons
made.

-Ted
'82 Jaguar XJ-S – 5.3L V12

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !

29

In reply to a message from Ted DuPuis sent Mon 2 Feb 2004:

Wow, that engine looks better and better the more I read about it.

I just finished reading the chapter in the book about alternative
gearboxes. The Supra 6 speed box fits! That is one of the greatest
gearboxes ever, and it can handle pretty much all the power you can
throw at it.

Who makes bellhouses that can mate the Getrag 6-speed to the Jag
engine?–
Joost van Ekris
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–

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30

In reply to a message from Ted DuPuis sent Fri 30 Jan 2004:

On Friday, 30 January, 2004 Ted said:

‘‘10-15 psi. I think the engine could handle more, so long as you
change the pistons (lower compression)’’

Ted,

Are you going indicating that you are going to turbocharge your
car with the stock pistons and 11.5:1 CR?

Scott–
84XJ-S(JagZilla)ported heads,TransGo,Flowmaster/Monza
Mississippi, United States
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31

Hi Scott,

Good to hear from you! No, I’m indicating that I don’t know English!! If I use
HE heads I’m going to lower the CR to 9.0:1, if I use Pre-HE heads I’m going
to use the stock 7.8:1. With the 11.5:1 CR I think that the engine could
handle 4-6 psi, no more. Of course, I haven’t tested that so it’s just
theory.

How ya been?!

-Ted

Ted,

Are you going indicating that you are going to turbocharge your
car with the stock pistons and 11.5:1 CR?

Scott

84XJ-S(JagZilla)ported heads,TransGo,Flowmaster/Monza
Mississippi, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !