[xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

I have replaced the CPS (NEW), the Ignition Module (NEW) and the Coil
(NEW). I have checked the compression, valve timing and spark plugs.
I can see spark at the plugs and fuel squirting out of the lossened
fuel rail. I have checked the fuel pump. The only thing I cannot
test because it is surrounded by steel tubing and no place to test is
the fuel pressure regulator.

That must be the problem because its the only thing I cannot test or
replace easily!!!

Its a good thing there was no dynamite in my tool box or that damned
thing would be history right now.–
Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Thu 9 Aug 2007:

I know how you feel about the dynamite Jim. Been there. would have
done it as well…

If you’ve got fuel coming out of the fuel rail at any sort of
pressure are you sure it’s not a problem with the injectors? Are
they opening? could be just a wiring break…

Dave–
Dave Collishaw Peterborough UK '79 S2 Daimler Sov '92 xj40
Peterborough, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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Well, the only checking I could do on the injectors was to put a
stethoscope on them while cranking and they are clicking…or at
least something is clicking…

My bigest problem is that I am working on the car alone so I cannot do
some tests that require two people so instead I just replace
components. The second problem is that at 95F in the shade, and I am
NOT in the shade, it doesn’t take much to tick me off.On 8/9/07, sparx dave@dcelectrics.plus.com wrote:

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Thu 9 Aug 2007:

I know how you feel about the dynamite Jim. Been there. would have
done it as well…

If you’ve got fuel coming out of the fuel rail at any sort of
pressure are you sure it’s not a problem with the injectors? Are
they opening? could be just a wiring break…

Dave

Dave Collishaw Peterborough UK '79 S2 Daimler Sov '92 xj40
Peterborough, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Thu 9 Aug 2007:

95 in the shade and you’re working in the sun? ooh.
I’m wondering now if you’re overfuelling. Are the plugs wet or
dry when you pull them?
If they are clicking and the plugs are dry maybe you’re right
about the regulator.
At the end of the day any I.C. engine just needs fuel/air in the
right ratio, compression, and a good spark at the right time.

Dave–
Dave Collishaw Peterborough UK '79 S2 Daimler Sov '92 xj40
Peterborough, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php

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The plugs are dry when pulled. But I have never pulled them
immediately after trying to start it.On 8/9/07, sparx dave@dcelectrics.plus.com wrote:

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Thu 9 Aug 2007:

95 in the shade and you’re working in the sun? ooh.
I’m wondering now if you’re overfuelling. Are the plugs wet or
dry when you pull them?
If they are clicking and the plugs are dry maybe you’re right
about the regulator.
At the end of the day any I.C. engine just needs fuel/air in the
right ratio, compression, and a good spark at the right time.

Dave

Dave Collishaw Peterborough UK '79 S2 Daimler Sov '92 xj40
Peterborough, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !


Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !

If it had fuel and spark then you should get a kick so obviously you are
missing at least one of them.

If you suspected the regulator you should be able to clamp off the outlet
and take it out of the circuit.
The fuel pressure would should jump high so you wouldn’t want to do very
long. The hose is rubber just after the regulator so you can clamp it with a
pair of vise grips.

Have you checked your oil? The regulator has a vacuum line attached. If the
diaphram ruptured on the regulator the fuel could get sucked into the
crankcase.

With your new ignition module do you notice and activity on the tach?----- Original Message -----
From: “Jim Isbell, W5JAI” jim.isbell@gmail.com
To: “sparx” dave@dcelectrics.plus.com
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 7:55 PM
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

The plugs are dry when pulled. But I have never pulled them
immediately after trying to start it.

On 8/9/07, sparx dave@dcelectrics.plus.com wrote:

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Thu 9 Aug 2007:

95 in the shade and you’re working in the sun? ooh.
I’m wondering now if you’re overfuelling. Are the plugs wet or
dry when you pull them?
If they are clicking and the plugs are dry maybe you’re right
about the regulator.
At the end of the day any I.C. engine just needs fuel/air in the
right ratio, compression, and a good spark at the right time.

Dave

Dave Collishaw Peterborough UK '79 S2 Daimler Sov '92 xj40
Peterborough, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at
http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !


Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !

I suggested clamping the return hose and Jim said it made no difference.
Another thought if you know you have good spark (remember it has to be
above 24Kv for the engine to fire) but the plugs are dry (an clamping the
return hose made no difference)it is possible that your tps has failed at
WOT and is telling the ecu you are flooded and the ecu will then fire the
injector solenoids on an incredible small cycle each revolution to dry out
the plugs.

Ive seen it but not on a jag, but at this point it might be worth
measuring the signal v you are getting out of the tps to make sure it
hasn’t failed and is sending a wot signal
Cheers
Barri-----Original Message-----
From: owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org] On
Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 5:28 PM
To: Jim.Isbell@gmail.com; sparx
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

If it had fuel and spark then you should get a kick so obviously you are
missing at least one of them.

If you suspected the regulator you should be able to clamp off the outlet
and take it out of the circuit.
The fuel pressure would should jump high so you wouldn’t want to do very
long. The hose is rubber just after the regulator so you can clamp it with
a
pair of vise grips.

Have you checked your oil? The regulator has a vacuum line attached. If
the
diaphram ruptured on the regulator the fuel could get sucked into the
crankcase.

With your new ignition module do you notice and activity on the tach?

----- Original Message -----
From: “Jim Isbell, W5JAI” jim.isbell@gmail.com
To: “sparx” dave@dcelectrics.plus.com
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 7:55 PM
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

The plugs are dry when pulled. But I have never pulled them
immediately after trying to start it.

On 8/9/07, sparx dave@dcelectrics.plus.com wrote:

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Thu 9 Aug 2007:

95 in the shade and you’re working in the sun? ooh.
I’m wondering now if you’re overfuelling. Are the plugs wet or
dry when you pull them?
If they are clicking and the plugs are dry maybe you’re right
about the regulator.
At the end of the day any I.C. engine just needs fuel/air in the
right ratio, compression, and a good spark at the right time.

Dave

Dave Collishaw Peterborough UK '79 S2 Daimler Sov '92 xj40
Peterborough, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at
http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting

services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar,
On
Line Books and more !


Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar,
On
Line Books and more !

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !

Thats an interesting idea and one we haven’t looked at yet.
Doesn’t the injector get shut off completely when you floor it while
cranking?

He hasn’t even got a kick out it even with starter fluid or gas directly
into the cylinder.

But a few days ago it did start up and idle for a couple of minutes(and then
died) so all the basic physical stuff must be correct.----- Original Message -----
From: “locost” locost7@msn.com
To: “‘Dave’” <@David_Boarder>; Jim.Isbell@gmail.com; “‘sparx’”
dave@dcelectrics.plus.com
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 9:14 PM
Subject: RE: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

I suggested clamping the return hose and Jim said it made no difference.
Another thought if you know you have good spark (remember it has to be
above 24Kv for the engine to fire) but the plugs are dry (an clamping the
return hose made no difference)it is possible that your tps has failed at
WOT and is telling the ecu you are flooded and the ecu will then fire the
injector solenoids on an incredible small cycle each revolution to dry out
the plugs.

Ive seen it but not on a jag, but at this point it might be worth
measuring the signal v you are getting out of the tps to make sure it
hasn’t failed and is sending a wot signal
Cheers
Barri

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org] On
Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 5:28 PM
To: Jim.Isbell@gmail.com; sparx
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

If it had fuel and spark then you should get a kick so obviously you are
missing at least one of them.

If you suspected the regulator you should be able to clamp off the outlet
and take it out of the circuit.
The fuel pressure would should jump high so you wouldn’t want to do very
long. The hose is rubber just after the regulator so you can clamp it with
a
pair of vise grips.

Have you checked your oil? The regulator has a vacuum line attached. If
the
diaphram ruptured on the regulator the fuel could get sucked into the
crankcase.

With your new ignition module do you notice and activity on the tach?

----- Original Message -----
From: “Jim Isbell, W5JAI” jim.isbell@gmail.com
To: “sparx” dave@dcelectrics.plus.com
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 7:55 PM
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

The plugs are dry when pulled. But I have never pulled them
immediately after trying to start it.

On 8/9/07, sparx dave@dcelectrics.plus.com wrote:

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Thu 9 Aug 2007:

95 in the shade and you’re working in the sun? ooh.
I’m wondering now if you’re overfuelling. Are the plugs wet or
dry when you pull them?
If they are clicking and the plugs are dry maybe you’re right
about the regulator.
At the end of the day any I.C. engine just needs fuel/air in the
right ratio, compression, and a good spark at the right time.

Dave

Dave Collishaw Peterborough UK '79 S2 Daimler Sov '92 xj40
Peterborough, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at
http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting

services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar,
On
Line Books and more !


Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar,
On
Line Books and more !

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !

Yes, you did suggest, and I tried, clamping the return line with no
results…BUT…as I think back to that test about a week ago, it
was when I had the erroneous idea that the return line was at the rear
of the fuel rail, not at the front of the rail and I was actually
clamping the input line, NOT the return line. I never did repeat that
test correctly because by the time I discovered my error three days
later I was on into checking out the spark. Which I am now done with.
So now that I am back to the fuel system I have ordered a regulator
that should be in the parts house at 9am. Hopefully I wont even have
to try that test again…#8-)On 8/9/07, locost locost7@msn.com wrote:

I suggested clamping the return hose and Jim said it made no difference.
Another thought if you know you have good spark (remember it has to be
above 24Kv for the engine to fire) but the plugs are dry (an clamping the
return hose made no difference)it is possible that your tps has failed at
WOT and is telling the ecu you are flooded and the ecu will then fire the
injector solenoids on an incredible small cycle each revolution to dry out
the plugs.

Ive seen it but not on a jag, but at this point it might be worth
measuring the signal v you are getting out of the tps to make sure it
hasn’t failed and is sending a wot signal
Cheers
Barri

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org] On
Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 5:28 PM
To: Jim.Isbell@gmail.com; sparx
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

If it had fuel and spark then you should get a kick so obviously you are
missing at least one of them.

If you suspected the regulator you should be able to clamp off the outlet
and take it out of the circuit.
The fuel pressure would should jump high so you wouldn’t want to do very
long. The hose is rubber just after the regulator so you can clamp it with
a
pair of vise grips.

Have you checked your oil? The regulator has a vacuum line attached. If
the
diaphram ruptured on the regulator the fuel could get sucked into the
crankcase.

With your new ignition module do you notice and activity on the tach?

----- Original Message -----
From: “Jim Isbell, W5JAI” <@Jim_Isbell_W5JAI>
To: “sparx” dave@dcelectrics.plus.com
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 7:55 PM
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

The plugs are dry when pulled. But I have never pulled them
immediately after trying to start it.

On 8/9/07, sparx dave@dcelectrics.plus.com wrote:

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Thu 9 Aug 2007:

95 in the shade and you’re working in the sun? ooh.
I’m wondering now if you’re overfuelling. Are the plugs wet or
dry when you pull them?
If they are clicking and the plugs are dry maybe you’re right
about the regulator.
At the end of the day any I.C. engine just needs fuel/air in the
right ratio, compression, and a good spark at the right time.

Dave

Dave Collishaw Peterborough UK '79 S2 Daimler Sov '92 xj40
Peterborough, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at
http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting

services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar,
On
Line Books and more !


Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar,
On
Line Books and more !

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !


Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !

Don�t know with the jag but on everything else the only thing that will
switch off the injectors is the cps, when it gets a WOT signal it puts the
injector through a really short cycle to “exercise the solenoid” but there
should be no gas injected other than that due to lag closure.

But you are right I had forgotten that Jim added starting fluid with no
effect

Cie est la vie
Barri-----Original Message-----
From: owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org] On
Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 6:30 PM
To: locost; Jim.Isbell@gmail.com; ‘sparx’
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

Thats an interesting idea and one we haven’t looked at yet.
Doesn’t the injector get shut off completely when you floor it while
cranking?

He hasn’t even got a kick out it even with starter fluid or gas directly
into the cylinder.

But a few days ago it did start up and idle for a couple of minutes(and
then
died) so all the basic physical stuff must be correct.

----- Original Message -----
From: “locost” <@Barri_Herman>
To: “‘Dave’” dboarder@sympatico.ca; Jim.Isbell@gmail.com; “‘sparx’”
dave@dcelectrics.plus.com
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 9:14 PM
Subject: RE: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

I suggested clamping the return hose and Jim said it made no difference.
Another thought if you know you have good spark (remember it has to be
above 24Kv for the engine to fire) but the plugs are dry (an clamping
the
return hose made no difference)it is possible that your tps has failed
at
WOT and is telling the ecu you are flooded and the ecu will then fire
the
injector solenoids on an incredible small cycle each revolution to dry
out
the plugs.

Ive seen it but not on a jag, but at this point it might be worth
measuring the signal v you are getting out of the tps to make sure it
hasn’t failed and is sending a wot signal
Cheers
Barri

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org] On
Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 5:28 PM
To: Jim.Isbell@gmail.com; sparx
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

If it had fuel and spark then you should get a kick so obviously you are
missing at least one of them.

If you suspected the regulator you should be able to clamp off the
outlet
and take it out of the circuit.
The fuel pressure would should jump high so you wouldn’t want to do very
long. The hose is rubber just after the regulator so you can clamp it
with
a
pair of vise grips.

Have you checked your oil? The regulator has a vacuum line attached. If
the
diaphram ruptured on the regulator the fuel could get sucked into the
crankcase.

With your new ignition module do you notice and activity on the tach?

----- Original Message -----
From: “Jim Isbell, W5JAI” jim.isbell@gmail.com
To: “sparx” dave@dcelectrics.plus.com
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 7:55 PM
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

The plugs are dry when pulled. But I have never pulled them
immediately after trying to start it.

On 8/9/07, sparx dave@dcelectrics.plus.com wrote:

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Thu 9 Aug 2007:

95 in the shade and you’re working in the sun? ooh.
I’m wondering now if you’re overfuelling. Are the plugs wet or
dry when you pull them?
If they are clicking and the plugs are dry maybe you’re right
about the regulator.
At the end of the day any I.C. engine just needs fuel/air in the
right ratio, compression, and a good spark at the right time.

Dave

Dave Collishaw Peterborough UK '79 S2 Daimler Sov '92 xj40
Peterborough, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at
http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for
exciting

services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar,
On
Line Books and more !


Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar,
On
Line Books and more !

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar,
On
Line Books and more !

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !

Well, maybe I had two problems, a weak ignition module that was
marginal but had not yet caused any problems and then the pressure
regulator failed completely causing the original; shutdown. We will
know if that analysis is right in the morning.

The thing that kept me on the spark trail was that everyone kept
saying a white/yellow spark was not hot enough and it needed to be
blue AND the fact that I got no bangs when I squirted starting fluid
into the intake. AND, the replacement ignition module that I was
given DID improve the spark intensity. AND the clamping of the return
hose (though it was the wrong hose) did not improve the situation. So
one error on my part, and several seemingly enforcing symptoms on the
cars part, led me to some incorrect conclusions. At least tomorrow I
will have an answer to the fuel pressure line of investigation.

It could still be the temp sender or the ECM for that mater…#8-)On 8/9/07, locost locost7@msn.com wrote:

Don’t know with the jag but on everything else the only thing that will
switch off the injectors is the cps, when it gets a WOT signal it puts the
injector through a really short cycle to “exercise the solenoid” but there
should be no gas injected other than that due to lag closure.

But you are right I had forgotten that Jim added starting fluid with no
effect

Cie est la vie
Barri

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org] On
Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 6:30 PM
To: locost; Jim.Isbell@gmail.com; ‘sparx’
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

Thats an interesting idea and one we haven’t looked at yet.
Doesn’t the injector get shut off completely when you floor it while
cranking?

He hasn’t even got a kick out it even with starter fluid or gas directly
into the cylinder.

But a few days ago it did start up and idle for a couple of minutes(and
then
died) so all the basic physical stuff must be correct.

----- Original Message -----
From: “locost” locost7@msn.com
To: “‘Dave’” dboarder@sympatico.ca; Jim.Isbell@gmail.com; “‘sparx’”
dave@dcelectrics.plus.com
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 9:14 PM
Subject: RE: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

I suggested clamping the return hose and Jim said it made no difference.
Another thought if you know you have good spark (remember it has to be
above 24Kv for the engine to fire) but the plugs are dry (an clamping
the
return hose made no difference)it is possible that your tps has failed
at
WOT and is telling the ecu you are flooded and the ecu will then fire
the
injector solenoids on an incredible small cycle each revolution to dry
out
the plugs.

Ive seen it but not on a jag, but at this point it might be worth
measuring the signal v you are getting out of the tps to make sure it
hasn’t failed and is sending a wot signal
Cheers
Barri

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xj40@jag-lovers.org] On
Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 5:28 PM
To: Jim.Isbell@gmail.com; sparx
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

If it had fuel and spark then you should get a kick so obviously you are
missing at least one of them.

If you suspected the regulator you should be able to clamp off the
outlet
and take it out of the circuit.
The fuel pressure would should jump high so you wouldn’t want to do very
long. The hose is rubber just after the regulator so you can clamp it
with
a
pair of vise grips.

Have you checked your oil? The regulator has a vacuum line attached. If
the
diaphram ruptured on the regulator the fuel could get sucked into the
crankcase.

With your new ignition module do you notice and activity on the tach?

----- Original Message -----
From: “Jim Isbell, W5JAI” <@Jim_Isbell_W5JAI>
To: “sparx” dave@dcelectrics.plus.com
Cc: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 7:55 PM
Subject: Re: [xj40] Good thing theres no Dynamite in my tool box

The plugs are dry when pulled. But I have never pulled them
immediately after trying to start it.

On 8/9/07, sparx dave@dcelectrics.plus.com wrote:

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Thu 9 Aug 2007:

95 in the shade and you’re working in the sun? ooh.
I’m wondering now if you’re overfuelling. Are the plugs wet or
dry when you pull them?
If they are clicking and the plugs are dry maybe you’re right
about the regulator.
At the end of the day any I.C. engine just needs fuel/air in the
right ratio, compression, and a good spark at the right time.

Dave

Dave Collishaw Peterborough UK '79 S2 Daimler Sov '92 xj40
Peterborough, United Kingdom
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Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

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services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar,
On
Line Books and more !

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services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !


Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Fri 10 Aug 2007:

I had a problem with mine that it wouldn’t start, and no matter
what I checked I could find no fault. Eventually it would give
a ‘‘kick’’, but that’s all. I decided right or wrong to crank the
living daylight out of it, which I did while I had jump leads
connected to another running car. I cranked it so long I had to
give it the occasional rest to allow the starter to cool a bit, but
eventually it gradually improved and started to run.
I’ve no idea to this day what was wrong with it, but it’s been no
problem since.
Not a very technical answer I agree, and maybe of no use in Jim’s
case (my plugs were wet after cranking showing I was getting
fuel),but my experience.
If the spark improved after you sorted the ignition Jim It was
money well spent, but it rubs against the grain for me to take good
parts off and replace them without knowing if they are causing the
problem.
The number of times I’ve had cars brought to me with ‘‘I’ve changed
the battery, starter, and alternator, can you find out why it won’t
start?’’…

Dave–
Dave Collishaw Peterborough UK '79 S2 Daimler Sov '92 xj40
Peterborough, United Kingdom
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In reply to a message from sparx sent Fri 10 Aug 2007:

Check the relay to the computer,mine did the same thing and it
turned out to be the relay.–
The original message included these comments:

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Fri 10 Aug 2007:


1993 XJ40 4.0 L
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In reply to a message from JEFFMOE sent Fri 10 Aug 2007:

Which relay’s that Jeff?
Even though my car’s been fine since I’ve still got that ‘‘long way
from home/middle of nowhere’’ uneasiness.

Dave–
The original message included these comments:

Check the relay to the computer,mine did the same thing and it
turned out to be the relay.


Dave Collishaw Peterborough UK '79 S2 Daimler Sov '92 xj40
Peterborough, United Kingdom
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In reply to a message from sparx sent Fri 10 Aug 2007:

It is the group of relays on the firewall under the hood,Ithink it
is the 2nd one from the end on the right.I think it is called ECU
relay. Jeff–
1993 XJ40 4.0 L
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Well, I better try it because the new fuel regulator did NOT do the
trick!!. Then off to the dynamite store.On 8/10/07, JEFFMOE jeffmoses@bellsouth.net wrote:

In reply to a message from sparx sent Fri 10 Aug 2007:

It is the group of relays on the firewall under the hood,Ithink it
is the 2nd one from the end on the right.I think it is called ECU
relay. Jeff

1993 XJ40 4.0 L
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Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !

In reply to a message from Jim Isbell, W5JAI sent Fri 10 Aug 2007:

Jim,

Your car does not have that relay identified by Jeff - it
was put in that location on the '93 / '94 models only.

It’s proper name is the EMS Main Fuel Injection relay and on
your '88 car it is under the dash on the passenger side on
the component panel - the one in a red base.

So, where are you up to now???

IIRC, you have fitted a new (or replacement used?) CPS,
Ignition Amplifier, Ignition Coil, Distributor cap, rotor
and HT wires, Spark Plugs and what else?

It’s been going on for so long now, I’ve lost track of what
you have checked. So let’s start again.

Have you checked:-

  • That the tacho registers RPM when you crank the engine?
  • The spark at the plugs?
  • The correct firing order of the plugs (1, 5, 3, 6, 2, 4)?
  • That the plugs are wet with gas when it doesn’t fire?
  • The fuel pressure in the fuel rail?
  • The compression in each cylinder?
  • The timing - valve and ignition?
  • Is the throttle plate opening?

If all of those are good, the damn thing must run - unless
the EMS ECU is up the spout.–
The original message included these comments:

Well, I better try it because the new fuel regulator did NOT do the
trick!!. Then off to the dynamite store.


Bryan N, '91 Sovereign 4.0 L, RHD
Cambridge, United Kingdom
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In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Fri 10 Aug 2007:

one thing to add:

  • no obstruction to the air flow through the air filter and MAFS–
    The original message included these comments:

Have you checked:-

  • That the tacho registers RPM when you crank the engine?
  • The spark at the plugs?
  • The correct firing order of the plugs (1, 5, 3, 6, 2, 4)?
  • That the plugs are wet with gas when it doesn’t fire?
  • The fuel pressure in the fuel rail?
  • The compression in each cylinder?
  • The timing - valve and ignition?
  • Is the throttle plate opening?


Cliff - '93 XJ40 Sovereign (4.0L)
Lancaster/South Carolina, United States
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Any fuel pressure test of the fuel rail pressure is a test of the
back pressure regulator which should be fairly obvious since there
would be no pressure if the back pressure regulator were not in the
line. Numerous people have used rigs like the very nice one posted
by Bryan N in the archives. Also a simple check of the archives will
revewal that when back pressure regulator fail its noticable by
dumping fuel into to the air inlet big time.

Jay 90 VDP Majestic
PS you are obviously not a hydryaulics engineer

At 02:01 PM 8/9/2007, Jim Isbell, W5JAI wrote:

I have replaced the CPS (NEW), the Ignition Module (NEW) and the Coil
(NEW). I have checked the compression, valve timing and spark plugs.
I can see spark at the plugs and fuel squirting out of the lossened
fuel rail. I have checked the fuel pump. The only thing I cannot
test because it is surrounded by steel tubing and no place to test is
the fuel pressure regulator.

That must be the problem because its the only thing I cannot test or
replace easily!!!

Its a good thing there was no dynamite in my tool box or that damned
thing would be history right now.


Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

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exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary
/ Calendar, On Line Books and more !

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  • no obstruction to the air flow through the air filter and MAFS

removed MAF device to squirt starter fluid straight into the intake.
There are no obstructions. Air cleaner is clean.

Have you checked:-

  • That the tacho registers RPM when you crank the engine?

The Tach jiggles when cranking does NOT actually register RPMS.

  • The spark at the plugs?

Yes.

  • The correct firing order of the plugs (1, 5, 3, 6, 2, 4)?

I was never changed. The car was running in full gallop when it died.

  • That the plugs are wet with gas when it doesn’t fire?

NO.

  • The fuel pressure in the fuel rail?

Yes

  • The compression in each cylinder?

Not checked, but not necessary unless you can come up with a scenario
that would kill ALL 6 cylinders at the same instant in full flight.

  • The timing - valve and ignition?

All is well here, timing chain tight and complete all valves are
working. Again the failure has to be something that affects all 6
cylinders simultaneously.

  • Is the throttle plate opening?

Yes.

To reiterate for any newcomers. The car was at full gallop when it
quit and coasted to the side of the road dead and not starting.
Therefore the failure has to be something that affected ALL cylinders
at the same instant. A broken timing chain, spark, or fuel delivery.
The timing chain is fine. Also it has started TWICE and run for 30 to
60 seconds. It runs fine and smooth, no missing cylinders. Thus, the
timing chain did NOT jump a gear and all valve and mechanical timing
is correct and the compression is affirmed.

NEW Components in order of application:

  1. CPS
  2. Ign Amp
  3. Spark Coil
  4. Fuel Pressure Regulator

Items tested:

  1. Fuel Pump… reached 100psi + against a dead end. Can hear it running
  2. Distributer Cap…examined and its fine…not a likely suspect
    anyway because all failing at once not likely.
  3. Spark plugs all regapped again, not a likely suspect since all
    failing at once would be very high odds.
  4. Rotor…fine
  5. Fuel quantity…full tank and flow at fuel rail
  6. Injectors…they are clicking when cranking…havent tested beyond
    that as having ALL 6 go at the same time is unlikely
  7. Distributor is tight and correctly timed.

Items NOT tested or examined:

  1. ECM
  2. CP wheel

The problem with a lot of theories is that they either do not match to
the sudden catastrophic failure of ALL cylinders at the same instant
or they do not hold up to the fact that the engine has started TWICE
since the failure and run for 30 tp 60 seconds in perfect tune.

What ever failed has to be something that can correct itself for short
periods…leaves out wrong firing sequence…AND that will cause total
failure without even a pop from ANY cylinder…rules out spark plug
failure, piston failure, valve failures.

With both these criteria to meet it is hard to think of something that
would apply.

Jim Isbell
“If you are not living on the edge, well then,
you are just taking up too much space.”

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !On 8/10/07, Cliff Archie rcarchie@nationalgypsum.com wrote: