[xj40] Whats in 'Dry Fuel' additive?

XJ40
1

Last evening I put 325ml of ‘Wynns Dry Fuel’ in my tank.
The tank was about three quarters full so it must be a pretty dilute
mix.
(It was a precautionary thing, lately with high humidity and temperature
changes the conditions are good for condensation in the tank)

This morning (normally excellent starter) it started and ran for about 3
seconds then stopped.
After that it just ‘huffed’ a bit on the starter and once with the pedal
hard down to weaken the mixture it fired a couple of times but wouldn’t
catch.

On the Wynns bottle it says ‘Contains kerosene’ (it doesn’t say if it is
just and only kerosene); kerosene to me means paraffin.
If it is just kerosene, would it go to the bottom of the tank so that I
am now trying to start on paraffin instead of petrol?

The plugs show that fuel is getting to the cylinders, and when dried the
plugs spark OK and the rev counter moves showing maybe 100-150 RPM. when
cranking.
The battery is 2 years old and never been ‘stressed’ (the car normally
starts immediately) and if the car is not to be used for a day or so I
put a trickle charger on it.

Is the Wynns likely to be the cause of my non starting?
I’m leaving the plugs out overnight to ensure that the cylinders are dry
and the battery is on charge.

Any ideas?

Richard–
A.R.Mills
1992 XJ40 Daimler 4.0Ltr
Somerset; UK.

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2

In reply to a message from A.R.Mills sent Fri 30 Nov 2007:

That doesn’t sound good at all. ‘Dry Gas’, as it’s called in the
States, is pure alcohol, mainly Methanol, which makes water
soluable in gasoline so it will go through the engine and be
burned. Methanol is about 130 octane rating.
The material you added may have been intended for a diesel engine.
Kerosine is closer to diesel fuel than it is to gasoline. It runs
well in a jet engine, for instance.
It may be that the material ‘settles out’ instead of mixing with
gasoline and it’s supplying straight kerosine to the engine. You
may want to drain a gallon or two out (disconnect the fuel delivery
hose at the rear of the injector rail) and try again.–
The original message included these comments:

On the Wynns bottle it says ‘Contains kerosene’ (it doesn’t say if it is
just and only kerosene); kerosene to me means paraffin.
If it is just kerosene, would it go to the bottom of the tank so that I
am now trying to start on paraffin instead of petrol?
Is the Wynns likely to be the cause of my non starting?

–
Pete 70 XKE (193K) 88 XJ6 (244K) 88 XJ6 (234K) 60 Mini
Severna Park, Maryland, United States
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3

In reply to a message from A.R.Mills sent Fri 30 Nov 2007:

This stuff is supposed to allow the water to mix with the petrol,
rather than the the water sit at the base of the tank and rot it
from inside, it should form an ‘‘emulsion’’ that mixes with the
petrol.

I have never liked the idea, because your forcing water, a non
compressible liquid through the injectors.

Kerosene is usually included as a cleaner, and I think alcohol is
the ingredient that mixes with the water.

The cleaner only additives, that contain kerosene have never
caused me an issue.

Best to drain the tanks, then always keep topped off, to stop
condensation forming in the first place.

What your now pumping through, should be mixed and consistent in
the tank, not distiled into different levels.

Can you top off with as much fresh premium fuel as possible? Or
drain the tank?

Jamie–
The original message included these comments:

Last evening I put 325ml of ‘Wynns Dry Fuel’ in my tank.
The tank was about three quarters full so it must be a pretty dilute
Is the Wynns likely to be the cause of my non starting?

–
Jamie. XJR8, XJ6 85
Newtown, Powys, United Kingdom
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4

In reply to a message from A.R.Mills sent Fri 30 Nov 2007:

This stuff is supposed to allow the water to mix with the petrol,
rather than the the water sit at the base of the tank and rot it
from inside, it should form an ‘‘emulsion’’ that mixes with the
petrol.

I have never liked the idea, because your forcing water, a non
compressible liquid through the injectors.

Kerosene is usually included as a cleaner, and I think alcohol is
the ingredient that mixes with the water.

The cleaner only additives, that contain kerosene have never
caused me an issue.

Best to drain the tanks, then always keep topped off, to stop
condensation forming in the first place.

What your now pumping through, should be mixed and consistent in
the tank, not distiled into different levels.

Can you top off with as much fresh premium fuel as possible? Or
drain the tank?

Jamie–
The original message included these comments:

Last evening I put 325ml of ‘Wynns Dry Fuel’ in my tank.
The tank was about three quarters full so it must be a pretty dilute
Is the Wynns likely to be the cause of my non starting?

–
Jamie. XJR8, XJ6 85
Newtown, Powys, United Kingdom
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5

Thank you Jaguarpete and Jamie for your replies.

I made sure it said ‘For Petrol and Diesel Engines’ on the bottle before
I parted with my pennies (well pounds actually).

It smells just like paraffin, feels like paraffin and looks like
paraffin sooo!!
There is no methanol smell at all but that could be covered by the
paraffin smell.

First on the to do list then is drain lots of fuel, then spin the engine
to clear out anything in the injector rail, then new plugs, a drop of
fresh petrol, the all important cup of coffee and try again.

Richard

In message , ghound james.austin@iecd.co.uk writes>In reply to a message from A.R.Mills sent Fri 30 Nov 2007:

This stuff is supposed to allow the water to mix with the petrol,
rather than the the water sit at the base of the tank and rot it
from inside, it should form an ‘‘emulsion’’ that mixes with the
petrol.

I have never liked the idea, because your forcing water, a non
compressible liquid through the injectors.

Kerosene is usually included as a cleaner, and I think alcohol is
the ingredient that mixes with the water.

The cleaner only additives, that contain kerosene have never
caused me an issue.

Best to drain the tanks, then always keep topped off, to stop
condensation forming in the first place.

What your now pumping through, should be mixed and consistent in
the tank, not distiled into different levels.

Can you top off with as much fresh premium fuel as possible? Or
drain the tank?

Jamie

The original message included these comments:

Last evening I put 325ml of ‘Wynns Dry Fuel’ in my tank.
The tank was about three quarters full so it must be a pretty dilute
Is the Wynns likely to be the cause of my non starting?

Jamie. XJR8, XJ6 85
Newtown, Powys, United Kingdom

Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services
and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and
more !

–
A.R.Mills
1992 XJ40 Daimler 4.0Ltr
Somerset; UK.

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6

James

Water is no more “non-compressible” than petrol or paraffin!

NW----- Original Message -----
From: “ghound” james.austin@iecd.co.uk
Subject: Re: [xj40] Whats in ‘Dry Fuel’ additive?

I have never liked the idea, because your forcing water, a non
compressible liquid through the injectors.

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7

In reply to a message from A.R.Mills sent Sat 1 Dec 2007:

This is not good. IMHO kerosene/paraffin/diesel have no place in a
petrol tank and vice versa. Ethanol/isopropanol/acetone etc are the
solvents that mix with both water and hydrocarbon fuels (polar/non-
polar liquids IIRC). Water in praffin has a solubility of precisely
zero and forming an emulsion is easier said than done, especially
once the kerosene is dispersed in petrol anyway. There’s no need
for it if you use an alcohol as solution is the way to go, not
emulsion. There was a good reason why the Scandinavians and
Russians used put strong vodka in their fuel tanks at the start of
winter. You don’t want puddled water turning to ice and blocking
your fuel system.–
66 2+2, 73 OTS, 76 DD6 Coup�, 85 XJS 5-spd conver, 93 XJ12
Cambridge, United Kingdom
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8

In reply to a message from PeterCrespin sent Sat 1 Dec 2007:

hmmmm I can’t imagine a company making a fuel additive that
(koowingly) HARMS the fuel system … just think of the
liability! … (?)

(btw, I’m confused - we have TWO admins now?)–
The original message included these comments:

This is not good. IMHO kerosene/paraffin/diesel have no place in a
petrol tank and vice versa. Ethanol/isopropanol/acetone etc are the

–
&:-)) Paul '88 XJ6 VDP 138k (black w. doeskin)
Garland, Texas, United States
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9

In reply to a message from AttyDallas sent Sun 2 Dec 2007:

Sorry, no, ignore me, I’m a newbie Admin on the XJ list but
recently bought an XJ81, hence checking in here now and again but
not as Admin. Maybe I’ll learn a way of swithcing the colour off on
other lists but don’t bank on it! ;-0

Kerosene won’t harm anything - it will disperse in petrol and you
won’t know it’s there in small amounts. But it won’t significantly
disperse water either AFAIK. If you look at products such as ‘HEET’
specifically sold to remove water, the ingredient is always listed
as primarily an alcohol of one sort or another, not kerosene.–
The original message included these comments:

hmmmm I can’t imagine a company making a fuel additive that
(koowingly) HARMS the fuel system … just think of the
liability! … (?)
(btw, I’m confused - we have TWO admins now?)

–
66 2+2, 73 OTS, 76 DD6 Coup�, 85 XJS 5-spd conver, 93 XJ12
Cambridge, United Kingdom
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10

In reply to a message from PeterCrespin sent Mon 3 Dec 2007:

All,

Just for clarification, here is the Material Safety Data
Sheet for the Wynns ‘Dry Fuel’ that Richard put in his tank
which lists all of the ingredients - including ‘kerosene’!

http://www.wynns.be/resources/documents/71867/71867_EN.pdf--
The original message included these comments:

Kerosene won’t harm anything - it will disperse in petrol and you
won’t know it’s there in small amounts. But it won’t significantly
disperse water either AFAIK. If you look at products such as ‘HEET’
specifically sold to remove water, the ingredient is always listed
as primarily an alcohol of one sort or another, not kerosene.

–
Bryan N, '91 Sovereign 4.0 L, RHD
Cambridgeshire, United Kingdom
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11

In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Mon 3 Dec 2007:

So, apply some of the first aids indicated to the engine :stuck_out_tongue:

It should be that the fuel lines are clogged, filter element,
undiluted water in fuel line, etc.

Daniel–
The original message included these comments:

http://www.wynns.be/resources/documents/71867/71867_EN.pdf

–
Huaorani Warrior, '92 XJR 4.0, manual gearbox, VIN 653523
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12

Thank you Bryan,

I couldn’t find that page when I did a ‘search’. (Maybe a bit of
mistyping).
I see that the paraffin is only 25%, that means I had 81ml in about 35
litres of fuel which is if my sums are right, a minuscule amount, about
0.2%.
However, knowing that these beasties have been known to go into ‘deep
sulk’ non start mode for no immediately obvious reason, I asked the
question because that was the last thing I had done to the car.

Just to do something I drained about a gallon of fuel through the pipes
using the fuel pump and drained the injector rail and then pumped fuel
from the tank through to refill the pipery. It didn’t start so it likely
hadn’t been the fuel.
I put in new plugs, made sure the distributor was clean and dry and left
the battery on charge all night.
Mid morning I sauntered up to the car and when it least expected it I
turned the key. It started and ran faultlessly.

So I do NOT blame the Wynns, I assume it was a ‘Jaguar thing’. It hadn’t

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13

In reply to a message from A.R.Mills sent Tue 4 Dec 2007:

I would suspect of any electronic component (CPS, coil,
amplificator?). If that happens again, check the tach when
crancking. Not that I hope it happens, of course.–
Huaorani Warrior, '92 XJR 4.0, manual gearbox, VIN 653523
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14

In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Mon 3 Dec 2007:

Sint Niklaas - passed it many a time as a kid on the way to see all
our relatives in Antwerp. I had forgotten Wynns had a factory in
Belgium.

So the 3 alcohols (pentanol, ethanol and isopropanol) make up 40%,
kerosene (much cheaper) makes up 25% and refined paraffin oil makes
up 5%. Which leaves about 30% of a non-poisonous, non-costly, non-
declarable liquid ingredient. No prizes what it probably is…

H2O or I’m a Dutchman…–
The original message included these comments:

Just for clarification, here is the Material Safety Data
Sheet for the Wynns ‘Dry Fuel’ that Richard put in his tank
which lists all of the ingredients - including ‘kerosene’!
http://www.wynns.be/resources/documents/71867/71867_EN.pdf

–
66 2+2, 73 OTS, 76 DD6 Coup�, 85 XJS 5-spd conver, 93 XJ12
Cambridge, United Kingdom
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