Simon,
Nothing non-standard or Jaguar specific about the split-pins/cotter-pins
used by Jaguar on our XKs.
All such bought-in items were competently made to rigidly controlled British
Standard by many specialist companies, and of course being British they were
made in 1950s/60s to British Standard imperial wire sizes, and those used by
Jaguar are detailed in the various spare-parts catalogues with
“standard-part” coding, showing 1/64" increment in wire diameter, of varying
1/8" incremental length.
My earlier comment about metric sizes is a problem we have in Australia
today, not back in 1950s/60s when we also used Imperial system of
measurement. I would think USA would never have used metric wire size
split-pins.
In Australia the metric size split pins are all you can now get, thus as per
my earlier advice - I purchased in a whole lot of imperial size split pins
from USA, as to use a metric split pin in an original imperial split-pin
hole is inviting potential problems.
My view is very simple - use NEW split pins, made to standard imperial
sizes, select the right one for your application, install it properly, and
you will NEVER have a problem. Do anything different and you expose some
risk.
But I too can see no point using more modern type lock-nuts etc, although
many modern engine reconditioning companies may suggest it, as its easier
for them, but they cannot claim its any better. Chances are, they may not
have any staff who are familiar with split-pins and correct way to install
them.
Roger Payne - XK140MC OTS; E-Type 4.2 S.1 OTS; DSV8.
Canberra.-----Original Message-----
From: owner-xk@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xk@jag-lovers.org] On Behalf Of
Simon Tillier
Sent: Wednesday, 21 May 2008 10:34 PM
To: xk@jag-lovers.org
Subject: RE: [xk] piston rods and cotter keys
I did not mean that Jaguar made the cotter pins, which I definitely ignore
but indeed is not very likely, but used some made to their, or at least
non-standard, specification. However comments on this list also suggest that
it may be just a matter of dimensions when imperial dimensions pins have
been replaced by metric ones, which had been the case of my car. The metric
pins are necessarily slightly smaller in diameter than the imperial ones,
which allows some movement under acceleration, inducing friction, torsion,
shocks and finally frequent rupture.
Simon
-----Message d’origine-----
De�: owner-xk@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xk@jag-lovers.org] De la part
de D J
Envoy�: mercredi 21 mai 2008 13:52
��: xk@jag-lovers.org
Objet�: Re: [xk] piston rods and cotter keys
Sorry but I cannot let this go unanswered.
Jaguar did not make split pins. They bought them in. They’ve been used
for hundreds of years in everything from engines even to steering
components which are subjected to a regular salt bath every winter.
The real problem with those is getting the ‘legs’ out the bolt/stud.
They are however a use once only component. The problems only arise
when they get bent back and forward because some numptie can’t be
bothered to get a new one.
I defy anyone to produce credible evidence of a split pin which has
been fitted correctly and never removed, failing.
With the advances in metallurgy I prefer to put my faith in a split
pin which is under no real stress rather than a piece of nylon insert
over a 30 year period.
DJ
On 21 May 2008, at 12:05, Simon Tillier wrote:
A bit late comment: I had the same problem with my 140, and had to
replace
both the cotter pins and the oil pump after having found fragments
in the
sump and scratches in the pump. A specialist mechanic explained me
that this
happens when the cotter pins have been replaced by non-original
Jaguar ones,
which were much more resistant than the common ones and can hardly
be found
any more. Non-Jaguar pins often just break owing to vibrations,
friction,
acceleration or whatever. Since pins of the adequate quality can
hardly be
found, the solution is replacement of the original crenulated nuts
by more
recent, self-locking nuts (XJ6???).
Hope this helps
Simon
-----Message d’origine-----
De : owner-xk@jag-lovers.org [mailto:owner-xk@jag-lovers.org] De la
part
de
MikeSpoelker
Envoy� : lundi 19 mai 2008 15:03
� : xk@jag-lovers.org
Objet : Re: [xk] piston rods and cotter keys
In reply to a message from Ellis sent Sun 18 May 2008:
Ellis,
Your experience is not unusual. I’ve found too many of them in
pieces in the bottom of the sump. On ocassion, I find bits of them
ingested in the oil pump, where they cause much damage and flood
the engine with metal shavings to boot. There is really no good
engineering reason to use them. The installation of the pin
generally requires you to either under or over torque the bolt so
that the slots and the holes line up so you can fit the pin. What
sense does that make??? Not good on a threaded fastener that is
loaded almost purely in tension. In my opinion, they are
worthless, or worse, on a properly torqued threaded fastener. I
find the pins less objectionable on suspension bolts where the
applied loads are in shear. There the installed torque is not
critical, so a little loose to line up the slot-hole is no
potential issue.
Personally, I don’t use the cotter pins. Either use the later 4.2
nuts and bolts, which did away with them, or use GOOD (ARP or such)
aftermarket fasteners. And DO NOT be tempted to use a chemical
locker or nylon insert nut on a connecting rod bolt. Both are just
bad practice on conn-rods.
Regards,
The original message included these comments:
I pulled the sump on my 3.8 150 yesterday and to my dismay found
bits of
cotter keys in the sump. One nut on the #1’s bearing cap had no
trace
of
Ellis
–
Mike Spoelker 672027
Louisville, KY, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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