Anyone know of a source for a reasonably accurate substitute (at least in terms of exterior dimensions) for the Lucas battery used in the 38-48 Saloons and Drop Heads? A U.S. supplier is preferred but not required (as long as they will ship). Likewise, maintenance-free is preferred but not required.
Ron
Hi Ron,
If you are meaning the battery that is mounted centrally and secured with lugs and tie down bolts I think you need to restrict your date range to something like 1938 & 1939. The post war cars used a longer lower battery that was mounted on the carb side of the scuttle.
I don’t think either type is easy to find (leastwise if fitted with lugs) but if you do find a source I would be very interested too.
Regards,
Peter
Thanks Peter, I was aware that the for the 1940 model the battery location was moved from the center of the scuttle to the left side (above the fuel pump(s) – presumably to minimize the adverse effects of heat from the exhaust manifolds – but I didn’t realize that the battery shape and/or dimensions had also changed.
Upon checking the 38-46 SPC, I see that while the Lucas numbers are the same for both 38-39 cars and 40-48 cars (STXW.11A), the Jaguar part number was changed (from 2514320 to 4010601/C1).
Do you (or anyone else out there) know the respective dimension of the two versions?
Regards,
Ron
The MK IV battery was a gigantic affair which I think was also shared with a Rolls Royce. Mounting lugs were formed into the case
The change came around the time of the first postwar cars . The local magazine test car of the first MK IV to arrive here still had the central battery . And already a scorch mark on the inside of the bonnet above the carbs.
The 1940 model we have her e had a heat shield mounted in front of the battery. I would suggest too well manufactured to be home made
For pre war cars , there was a lucas option of a bakelite battery cover , which can be useful in hiding a more modern battery. These have the mounting lugs incorporated . A bit like e long 12 v version of the XK 120 battery covers
All the old rubber cased batteries can have new cells installed , so it’s a shame that people threw them out. as they are almost irreplaceable now.
I was very fortunate that my local battery place still had a NOS Mk IV battery case in their store.
Here are pics of the prewar battery and the Mk IV arrangement. The MK Iv also shows the contrived 1 3/4" carb bodies mentioned in another post .
Hi Ron,
I can probably get you the dimensions of the post war case.
I’m pretty sure the battery photos you sent me some time ago are correct for the central location. You will know if it has the correct length because the lug hole spacing will match the threaded insert spacing on the scuttle.
Do you have doubts about its height?
Peter
www.antiqueautobattery.com has a big tar top #G27L/B
http://www.antiqueautobattery.com/batteries/british/G27L.html
This is probably what I will go with when it comes time to fire up my Mark V.
www.restorationbattery.com might be able to come up with something
www.mossmotors.com has a big tar top #459-400 but they might just be a markup retailer for antiqueautobattery.
https://mossmotors.smugmug.com/MossMotors/Moss-400000-thru-499999/i-pGL7KMJ/A
https://mossmotors.smugmug.com/MossMotors/Moss-400000-thru-499999/i-2LkPsBQ/A
Here’s what the battery covers look like They were standard on SS1s. They do a pretty good job of hiding a more modern battery . especially if t’s a black case. One can buy stick on moulded Lucas badges for the batteries
An important thing to remember with MK IV [ big] batteries is that the terminals are in the correct orientation. +ive at the rear on the LH side and _ive the rear on RHS . Other wise as the bonnet tapers towards the front , the terminals get a bit close to the bonnet
The original system of earthing just to the firewall has shortcomings in that it tends to affect the paint around the mounting point
I run another battery cable from the inside of the same stud , down the firewall and connect to the body mounting bracket
Peter,
The photos I sent you were of a Mk IV battery I got on eBay in 2011. At the time, I thought it should be the same as a 38-39, but if Brother Nantes is correct about the 38-40 batteries being smaller than the Mk IV (and presumably Mk V) batteries, then the one I bought on eBay is incorrect for 38-40 (and Ed’s pre-war photo seems to confirm this).
On the other hand, I just consulted the various Lucas catalogs that I have and the following are the listed dimensions for the STXW11A in the 1939 (400B) Catalog –
Length w/o lugs - 14-1/2 in.
Length including lugs - 15-5/8 in.
Length including cover - 15-5/8 in.
Width - 6-7/8 in.
Height including terminals -9-1/4 in.
Height including cover -10-1/8 in
Obviously, the 1939 dimenions would seem to contradict the fact that the pre-war batteries were smaller than the post-war ones. This would seem to be confirmed by the fcat that, as previously mentioned, the Jaguar SPC uses the same Lucas model number (STXW11A) for both 38-40 and 46-48 cars (although it’s possible that they changed the dimensions but kept the same Model No.).
Rob, I contacted Antique Auto Battery a while back and they said the longest battery they had was the GL27L that you referenced, but the length is 12 inches, which is a couple of inches shorter than the STXW11A figures cited above, although the width and height are close. Also, no lugs.
Regards,
Ron
Check out the Tanya Type 183 Classic Car Hard Rubber Battery 12V 65Ah –
https://www.tayna.co.uk/Type-183-Classic-Car-Hard-Rubber-Battery-P9750.html
Ron
Hi Ron,
The battery in the photos you sent me looks too tall for a MkIV. I would have thought it probably corresponds to the dimensions you are quoting and is thus correct for central location. I don’t have a MkIV case to hand but it’s definitely smaller in height and longer in length than the STXW11A dimensions.
I’m not convinced about using a lid if the battery is unsealed and requires frequent inspection and top-up but I guess Ed’s suggestion of using a lid in conjunction with a sealed battery is about the best pragmatic solution if you don’t have a proper lugged case.
Hidden under a lid any suitable sized black hard rubber battery would do even with the wrong terminal type.
Regards,
Peter
More on the Lucas Battery model number issue –
As previously noted, the Jaguar SPC uses the same Lucas model number for the 38-40 and 46-48 batteries (STXW11A) but the Lucas catalogues tell a slightly different story. Lucas Catalogue 400D published in 1954, lists the following model numbers –
1.5 L.
1939-40 & 1946-48 - SLG11A
2.5 & 3.5 L.
1939-40 - SG11A
1946 - SG11A
1947-48 - SLT13A
1949-54 – GT11A
What’s confusing is that the STXW11A model designation is nowhere in sight. That aside, the above numbers show no change (for 2.5L and 3.5L cars) until 1947, i.e., 39-40 and 46 are the same (SG11A). which suggests that is when the shape/size changed.
Ron
OK , the dimeansions of the big MK IV battery are…
17" between mounting holes
18" overall length
6 3/4" wide
8 " height to top of terminals
They were not all Lucas , there were a few brands making batteries to this dimension
I think there is a company in UK selling rubber cased batteries. One can always purchase them " dry charged" in which form they can be shipped afely and legally . When ready to use they can then be filled.
It probably is a little inconvenient to remove a battery cover to check water level. But we dedicated SS/ MK IV owners feel that no effort is too great.
And XK 120 owners have to do it
Ed, thanks for this info.
As I indicated above, there is some evidence (from the Lucas Catalogues) that this longer (by about three inches) and lower (by about an inch) battery was introduced on the '47 Mk IVs (all saloons), which means that the '46 MK IVs (all saloons) had the same battery as the 38-40 saloons and DHCs.
Regards,
Ron
I’ll add few cents to this discussion by asking what kind of part is this?
See picture below. May it be part of battery tray? I’ve found it in the trunk of my original MKIV.
Mateus,
Lols like a battery hold-down bracket to me. What are the dimensions?
Ron
Assuming that the mystery item shown in Mateusz’ photo is in fact a battery bracket, his dimensions look close to Ed’s numbers for the Mk IV battery, though not identical –
Ed -
17" between mounting holes
18" overall length
6 3/4" wide
Mateusz - 16.1", 18.5", 7.1"
Also I just realized why the Jaguar 2.5L SPC lists the same Lucas battery model designation (STXW.11A) for both the 1938-39 cars on the one hand, and the 1940 and the early post-war saloons (through 510412) on the other hand – although, as noted, above the Jaguar part no. is different for the two groups) While the 2.5L SPC was published in August, 1947, the cover bears the notation, “FROM 1938 TO 1946” and this Ieads me to conclude that it did not include the 1947 MY saloons.
By contrast, the 3.5 L SPC, which was published four months later in December 1947, does include info on 1947 MY cars (the cover reads “1938 TO 1947”), and it lists three different Lucas batteries –
(a) STXW.11A for 38-39 cars,
(b) STXW.11A for 40 cars and 46 saloons (through 610707); and
© SLTW.13A for 1947 saloons (after 610708).
ERGO --> the switch-over date from STXW.11A to the longer and shorter SLTW.13A occurred between August and December of 1947.
So, the more interesting question is --> How many people in the world care about any of this?
Regards,
Ron
I guess there are two categories of people who care about the appearance of the battery.
The obvious one is those who seek concours achievement.
The other is those who like to live in the past and can’t abide seeing modern fitments in their old technology.
That said, many owners don’t care and just want a pragmatic solution.
Each to his own.
Peter
Hmm yes , I’ve been thinking of a Holden 2002 and a Trimatic
Hmm! Me thinks the Cultural Attache is trying to wind me up.
