Series 1 or 2 windshield install query

Hey membership,

Looking to see if anyone has gone through the same thought process for where I am now and if a solution was found. I have installed a new windshield into the gasket and it is entered into the groove in the gasket completely around the circumference.
I would like to get some calk between the gasket and the metal windshield frame to prevent water ingress over the years and rust the frame. Without the locking strip in place, I can peel open the gap between the gasket (impossible once the locking strip is in place) and metal lip, put in a bead of calk, and let it close up. Then the locking strip could be installed immediately, before the sealant begins to harden preventing the excess sealent from oozing out in a controlled manner. Don’t want the sealant to harden before the gap is tightened up, otherwise the gap will stay too large.
Practice in installing the locking strip is called for, as well as a suitable lubricant - in my case easy water clean-up personal lubricant.
Anyone have an approach that might make for a less time critical method - the hardening time of the sealant is key, I am using liquid butyl window sealant - maybe a slower hardening sealer like silicone would be better - anybody use that?
Brad

Do NOT use silicone. It needs air to cure. If it’s not exposed, it stays in the same state as in the tube.

I hired a 30yr pro to do my last one (420G…seal on lip, like a S2) in the driveway for $100 cash, my mate who owns a body shop for 40yrs subs him to do his screens instead of himself…that tells you everything…I got mates rates

anyway, here is what he did…some bad news for you…he placed the (silicone) between the metal lip and rubber seal 1st, none between the glass and seal, inserted the seal, then the glass, then locking strip, all very quickly indeed

It was a good investment, as he struggled to get the (rear) glass in, and used more strength and skill than I would have ever dared (or even had)

here is a pic of what he used

**
The good book prescribes a thin bead of sealant, glass edge and seal, and on the face of the seal channel that abuts body metal, Brad…

The construction of the S1/2 layout relies on the ‘ridge’ to keep water out of the cabin - and drain water harmlessly away, letting the joint dry out between wettings. And the car paint effectively protects the body from rusting and the ‘loose fitting’ seal protects the paint…

Your method is risky; it prevents water drainage - and sticks the screen to the paint. Which is the weakness of the S3 set-up; no drain, sealing, adhering to the paint, may lift the paint - and the bared metal starts rusting. And never stops…:slight_smile:

Frank
xj6 85 Sov Europe (UK/NZ)
**

1 Like

The silicon in the tubes I buy ALWAYS gets hard eventually :slight_smile:

Yes, key word here. I should have explained further. Takes a couple years. I have some partial tubes of odd colors of 100% silicon caulk that are still usable after a year.

@awg
Not bad news at all. Dow Corning 580 is an adhesive. I’ve used a few times. Takes 7 days to cure.

@jagged1
Brad,
What Frank said…ditto

Thanks for all the info guys. Locking strip all in now - another 5 hours spent. I couldn’t bring myself to not use any sealant at all - rather water doesn’t get in there in the first place than rely on the draining process. (sorry Frank). Only sealed the top section and down the A pillar to just around the bottom corners. The gasket-to-cowl seal along the bottom is very tight once the locking strip is in. Doubt much water will ever get in there, and if it does, gravity will tend to drain it. My weekend plan is still on track - Friday to get the glass into the gasket, Sat. to get the locking strip in place, tomorrow I tackle the chrome strips. Not looking forward to that, but like all these tasks, by the time I’m done, the right technique will be obvious. (any tips would be welcome) Think I will only re-install the center chrome clip that bolts through the gasket. There has to be something there to cover the gap, and after removing the plastic back-up base, it will be unobtrusive. Still some peace of mind that the windshield won’t fly out when I sneeze.
After much searching and consideration I used a non-silicone, non hardening, caulk that seemed ideal. “ProForm PF 218, Glass-seal Sealer” Got it at a body shop supplier. Excess sealant still squeezed out of the gap (as the locking strip pressed in) 30 minutes after application. Locking strip would have been completely impossible to install without the special tool I got from amazon and some personal lubricant from the drug store.

I did question “Bulldog”, the windscreen guy about Silicone, as I had heard like you that is not the right stuff to use. He replied it must be “neutral cure”

He is like Rainman on all substances to do with these matters, I ring him up and ask what to use, he quotes the maker and type number right off his head

its a good job anyhow, not entirely sure how he didnt make a mess, he worked so quick it was like a magician.

my reason for saying it was “bad news” is there is no way this can be replicated once the seal is in.

Sealing up leaks with any substance is seen as an inferior “bodge”

Having said that, I would try and seal water running into the groove between rubber & metal, if there was one

I have a screen to do that is urethane-on-rubber-on-metal…I will be getting him out again

after loosing some chrome trim at speed, I never wanted that to happen again

the trim is very hard to obtain

(my) seals are not ideally molded to receive the trim (a known issue)

I used small blobs of urethane 6" apart to bond the chrome to rubber, taped & weighted to make it flush, filled the gaps with the Silicone 280, it is softer, and I will be able to use a razor knife to cut them free in future if ever needed

looks good, and never ever will fly off, no matter what speed

Silicone will migrate into the window laminate adhesive and turn it milky in color.

**
It’s your car, Brad - but water has an uncanny ability to enter…:slight_smile:

Frank
xj6 85 Sov Europe (UK/NZ)
**

I put the locking strip into my series one rear windscreen today, eight hours work and very sore hands but the fit of the seal to the glass and the metal seems excellent with no lifting anywhere not even on the bends. The service manual page N10 suggests a sealant both above and below applied using a copper nozzle on a pressure gun. I didn’t have either sealant or copper nozzle so I skipped that step. I hear what you are saying about water ingress Frank but in fact the old very brittle gasket I took out and replaced had no sign of any sealant and no rust in the metal either so I’m hoping for the same good luck. I’ll check if ever there’s heavy rain which given I’m going touring in Ireland in August will no doubt occur.
Next job is to bet the chrome strips back in. Any tips?

Ian
.

Hey Ian - sounds like your windshield install is one day behind mine. I installed one of the chrome trim strips on the front windshield. Very frustrating, I despaired at getting it done even with my son’s help. I pre-lubricated under the retaining lips with personal lubricant from the drug store and started with a straight end to anchor the strip. Projecting out to the side corners/vertical run is key, as the radiuses of the gasket and strip have to line up exactly - can’t be offset from each other. Had to give up on a small, 1 inch wide plastic (cut down putty knife) in the hard corners. Finally I discovered that a 2.5 or 3 mm allan key with a ball-end worked slowly but surely with lots of lube to flip the retaining lip over the chrome. The ball-end key looks similar to the ball-end tools I see in videos and on supplier web sites. Exhausted after the driver’s side strip - passenger side tomorrow. Brad

someone hosing the windscreen is a the correct test to see if there is any leak

for the chrome strips, even if they do fit within the lips, a dab of adhesive on the corners, the ends, and 2x chrome locking locking ends is strongly advised imo.

This glues the chrome to the rubber.
Its not uncommon to see XJ missing one or more, and they are very hard to obtain

Brad,

“non-silicone, non hardening, caulk” is the clue - it won’t glue the rubber to the paint - as per Frank’s advice - and will keep its sealing properties over decades. I used it to seal a car that was badly leaking from the windshield back in the mid 1990s, still own it and can confirm that it is still waterproof. It was a 3M product, IIRC, NAYY.

Good luck

Jochen

75 XJ6L 4.2 auto (UK spec)

Hey Ian - update if you haven’t installed the chrome strips yet. I just finished installing the second strip - took 1 hour as opposed to 5 hours for the 1st one. Used a ball -end allan key (inserting the ball-end) as mentioned, inserting it on an oblique angle under the rubber lip - say 30 degrees off horizontal. Still managed to get one tiny tear of the lip until I discovered the optimum way to use the allan key. If going from right -to - left, rotate the key clockwise as you work it along - it grabs and lifts the rubber up and over the chrome. Job flew by doing this. I think this might work even better than the pro tool, as those cant be rotated and don’t have a hex profile to grab the lip when rolling.
Brad

1 Like

Thanks Brad. I’m off traveling Thursday and my hands are still sore from the locking strip install but I’ll certainly try your method when I do get back to it early July.

Ian

Can you please elaborate on that Jochen ?
Is something you put with the windshield in place ?
Mine is leaking, no signs of rust yet, and I’m looking for a solution. It would be great If I could avoid taking the glass out.

Aristides

@Aristides1.

The stuff I use is Teroson 4100. It’s a black non hardening sealant. It skins over after a few weeks, cleanup is with turpentine.

What I do is run a bead inside the “U” which goes over the sheetmetal, then fit the seal to the body. Then I fit the glass and flip the rubber lip over the glass using a rope. Then I run a thin bead between the glass and the rubber, and fit the lockstrip.

I’ve done 5 or 6 screens - the first couple of times I sweated bullets, but now it only takes two of us about 45 min to get a screen in and sealed.

If your car is leaking between the glass and the rubber, then you can leave the screen in the car, just remove the locking strip, stick the nozzle between the glass and the rubber and run a bead of sealant in there, then refit the locking strip. If the rubber is old and hardened then you may struggle to get the locking strip back in - Vaseline or wire pulling soap helps, and you really need the right tool for fitting the lockstrip.

If your car is leaking at the metal-rubber gap then you’re probably better off to remove the glass and fit a new seal.

1 Like

**
I trust it is S1 or S2 screen, Aristides…?

And if it is leaking into the cabin? In principle the sheetmetal ‘ridge’ forms the barrier preventing water ingress into the cabin. The sealant to be applied sparingly as a thin bead, on the seal channel front abutting the ridge. This, together with the thin strip of sealant applied to the glass edges, will stop water creeping past the ridge into the cabin. The advantage of this set-up is that water can drain/dry, if required, along the unsealed ‘gap’ between the seal and the rest of the body metal. This keeps the paint unaffected - preventing rusting…

Sealant applied between the body surrounds and seal defeats the intent of the lay-out. So it is important to find out if the leak is between the glass and the seal, when the remedies proposed by Andrew are appropriate…

Indeed, if the leak is between the glass and the seal; applying sealant between the body and the seal may be counterproductive…

Frank
xj6 85 Sov Europe (UK/NZ)
**