Hi all,
Is it really necessary to drain the trany fluid etc as per the Haynes manual
to remove the starter motor on a 3.6?
any “Gotchas” I should be wary of?
regards
Tom
88 xj40 3.6
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I knew that sooner or later it would - but I kept putting
off the evil day. In fact, I have almost boasted about it on
this forum - but no longer! 
For some years now, often only on the first start of the
day, but sometimes (rarely) on later starts too, the
engagement mechanism (the thing we used to call ‘the
Bendix’) of the starter motor failed to immediately
disengage when the engine fired, resulting in a second of
‘graunching’ noise coming from the starter before it did so.
Never affected the cranking though, so I was content to let
it ‘graunch’ occasionally before I plucked up courage to
have a go at removing the ‘backwards’ top mounting bolt to
replace the starter.
Today, when I started the car to reverse out of the garage
there was no ‘graunching’. Instead, after the engine fired,
it was replaced by a loud whirring / whistling sound from
the starter motor. Popping the bonnet, it was obvious that
the starter was not disengaged and was still turning with
the engine. A rapid shut-down by yours truly followed
leaving one immobilised XJ40. [I figure that allowing it to
continue running with the engine would soon cause a
conflagration in the engine bay!]
Having for some months (years?) anticipated the need to get
a replacement starter, I had a short list of possible
sources in the UK for an exchange re- manufactured unit. [In
view of the difficulty in replacing it, I don’t consider a
used unit of unknown origin/condition to be a sensible
alternative - I do not want to do this job twice!]
Unfortunately, none of the places I called had immediate
availability of an exchange unit and I wanted to tackle the
job this weekend. [No doubt the place with a room full of
re-manned starters available in the UK is not on my list]
I eventually tried the Bosch site http://tinyurl.com/2kymhw
this lunchtime and found they had a dealer close to my home
who didn’t have a factory re-manned unit in stock, but could
have one for me by 1530 this afternoon. Costs a little more
than others have advertised for exchange units, but it is
factory re-manufactured in Germany, comes with a Bosch new
parts guarantee and I don’t have to wait for mail order
delivery next week.
Hopefully I can get the old one off and return the core to
them next Monday. I will report on the success or otherwise
of this task if my bloodied hands can still operate the
keyboard by then! :-)–
Bryan N, '91 Sovereign 4.0 L, RHD
Cambridge, United Kingdom
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In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Fri 14 Sep 2007:
good luck with the project…i opted to pay a local independent
Jag mechanic $500 to replace mine a few years ago for just the
reasons you state…i really did not have the time at that point
and did not have the use of a lift…the shop told me the best way
they have found to replace the starter is to lower the rear of the
engine slightly by removing the tranny/rear engine mount…that
allows easier access to the top mounting bolt…they were able to
replace the starter and solenoid in about 2 hours…–
Cliff - '93 XJ40 Sovereign (4.0L)
Lancaster/South Carolina, United States
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In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Fri 14 Sep 2007:
After 4 hours of effort - abject FAILURE!
After setting the car up on front wheel ramps and
disconnecting the battery, I thought I would see how tight
the ‘easy’ starter motor attachment bolt was - the one which
is facing the correct way on the bottom of the starter and
is readily accessible from below. I figured that if that was
very tight, so would be the top bolt, so I would be wasting
my time trying to get at the upper bolt from above (removing
the wiper motor or not) because although, even if I could
just about get a cranked open ended on to the upper bolt, no
way would the hex head retain its shape if a lot of force
was required to ‘crack’ it loose.
The bottom bolt was tight, so tight I split a 13mm socket on
it! The problem was either Loctite on the threads during
initial installation 16 years ago or dissimilar metals
corrosion in the aluminium housing - or both. As a
consequence, it seemed obvious that I would need to
disconnect the rear tranny mounting to lower the bell
housing to get access with a good 13mm socket on the head of
the top bolt. I managed to lower the tranny mount five or
six inches without anything fouling (like the cooling fan on
the radiator as the engine tilted)
What a pain that was! You cannot see the head of the top
bolt, the head being very close to and masked by a
stiffening web on the bell housing and there is a 2’’ thick
dense foam pad squashed between it and the underside of the
tranny tunnel so it is difficult to even feel the darn bolt
head, never mind ensure that any socket is fitting squarely
on it.
Eventually I had to hack away at the foam padding with a
bread saw (don’t tell the missus!) to clear a way for the
socket/ wobbler / extension(s) until I could get a firm grip
on the bolt head.
And then the fun started! No way, on the occasions when the
socket never slipped off the bolt head, could I ‘crack’ that
bolt. I added an 18’’ extension to the rachet handle and all
I succeeded in doing was to split another 13mm socket and
break two 3/8 drive wobblers. Jeeez that bolt is TIGHT!
I toured the local stores (small town!) to find a �’’ drive
13mm socket and the only one available was a 12 point job,
not my preferred 6-point type and using that with �’’ drive
extensions was clearly going to round off the bolt head
before it came loose.
At that point I quit! The thought of rounding off that bolt
head in that location doesn’t bear contemplation - I had
visions of the engine / tranny coming out to drill the bolt out.
So, I put it all back together and am left with an
immobilised XJ40 awaiting discussions on what to do next
with my trusted local independent Jag specialist. Probably
he will have to have the car on a trailer to fit the
replacement starter. Negotiations start on Monday.–
The original message included these comments:
Hopefully I can get the old one off and return the core to
them next Monday. I will report on the success or otherwise
of this task if my bloodied hands can still operate the
keyboard by then!
–
Bryan N, '91 Sovereign 4.0 L, RHD
Cambridge, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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Bryan
As I said in a recent post, it took me about 5 hours to change my starter
the way you are trying. It was a hell of a job but I was able to shift the
bolts with 6 point sockets and a U/J and 18" of extensions (all 1/2") to get
on the back one squarely. I just shoved all the foam forwards out of the
way. The bolts went with a load crack as the corrosion between the
aluminium and steel broke. (that is what the trouble is). When I refitted
the bolts I used copper grease. I also spent ages reconnecting the wiring
to the starter as it is almost impossible to get at.
Of course with a lift it would be a lot easier.
NW----- Original Message -----
From: “Bryan N” sophistic@btopenworld.com
To: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2007 3:28 PM
Subject: Re: [xj40] Starter Motor
In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Fri 14 Sep 2007:
After 4 hours of effort - abject FAILURE!
Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !
Sorry to hear it…with all the help you have given, one would expect
“Kharma” to be working overtime in your favor. You don’t think it would be
worth using one of the “spray and pray” type products and letting it soak
awhile; then trying again with a 6 point socket?
Best, Alan----- Original Message -----
From: “Bryan N” sophistic@btopenworld.com
To: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2007 7:28 AM
Subject: Re: [xj40] Starter Motor
In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Fri 14 Sep 2007:
After 4 hours of effort - abject FAILURE!
After setting the car up on front wheel ramps and
disconnecting the battery, I thought I would see how tight
the ‘easy’ starter motor attachment bolt was - the one which
is facing the correct way on the bottom of the starter and
is readily accessible from below. I figured that if that was
very tight, so would be the top bolt, so I would be wasting
my time trying to get at the upper bolt from above (removing
the wiper motor or not) because although, even if I could
just about get a cranked open ended on to the upper bolt, no
way would the hex head retain its shape if a lot of force
was required to ‘crack’ it loose.The bottom bolt was tight, so tight I split a 13mm socket on
it! The problem was either Loctite on the threads during
initial installation 16 years ago or dissimilar metals
corrosion in the aluminium housing - or both. As a
consequence, it seemed obvious that I would need to
disconnect the rear tranny mounting to lower the bell
housing to get access with a good 13mm socket on the head of
the top bolt. I managed to lower the tranny mount five or
six inches without anything fouling (like the cooling fan on
the radiator as the engine tilted)What a pain that was! You cannot see the head of the top
bolt, the head being very close to and masked by a
stiffening web on the bell housing and there is a 2’’ thick
dense foam pad squashed between it and the underside of the
tranny tunnel so it is difficult to even feel the darn bolt
head, never mind ensure that any socket is fitting squarely
on it.Eventually I had to hack away at the foam padding with a
bread saw (don’t tell the missus!) to clear a way for the
socket/ wobbler / extension(s) until I could get a firm grip
on the bolt head.And then the fun started! No way, on the occasions when the
socket never slipped off the bolt head, could I ‘crack’ that
bolt. I added an 18’’ extension to the rachet handle and all
I succeeded in doing was to split another 13mm socket and
break two 3/8 drive wobblers. Jeeez that bolt is TIGHT!I toured the local stores (small town!) to find a �’’ drive
13mm socket and the only one available was a 12 point job,
not my preferred 6-point type and using that with �’’ drive
extensions was clearly going to round off the bolt head
before it came loose.At that point I quit! The thought of rounding off that bolt
head in that location doesn’t bear contemplation - I had
visions of the engine / tranny coming out to drill the bolt out.So, I put it all back together and am left with an
immobilised XJ40 awaiting discussions on what to do next
with my trusted local independent Jag specialist. Probably
he will have to have the car on a trailer to fit the
replacement starter. Negotiations start on Monday.–
The original message included these comments:Hopefully I can get the old one off and return the core to
them next Monday. I will report on the success or otherwise
of this task if my bloodied hands can still operate the
keyboard by then!–
Bryan N, '91 Sovereign 4.0 L, RHD
Cambridge, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !–
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.487 / Virus Database: 269.13.19/1008 - Release Date:
9/14/2007 8:59 AM
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In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Fri 14 Sep 2007:
Bryan. Get a 6 point impact wrench socket. You won’t split that. If
you have access to a compressor and impact wrench it makes it
a ‘‘not too bad of a job’’.
Jim Moore(88 XJ40)–
James Moore
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In reply to a message from James Moore sent Sat 15 Sep 2007:
Norm, Alan, Jim,
Thinking along those lines. Couldn’t find a 13mm impact
socket in my scout around the town today, but now I’ve
calmed down (amazing what a couple of single malts will do!)
I think I’ll pursue that line before getting a professional
involved.
Thanks for the thoughts.–
The original message included these comments:
Bryan. Get a 6 point impact wrench socket. You won’t split that. If
you have access to a compressor and impact wrench it makes it
a ‘‘not too bad of a job’’.
–
Bryan N, '91 Sovereign 4.0 L, RHD
Cambridge, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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After spending two weeks changing my water pump wherein it took me
hours to breaks some M8 bolts out of the aluminum block spread out
over days while waiting for penetrating oil to work, that taking
bolts out of an aluminum engine after 17 years is not for the
impatient or faint hearted. About the time I went and bought some
pieces of pipe to use as extensions, I was finally able to move one
of the bolts on the AC compressor mounting so I could get the belt
off in order to replace the main belt which was shredded when the
water pump bearing blew out. I’ve always had the $$$ and found
someone even if it was the dealer 100 miles away to do difficult work
like that but this time couldn’t otherwise I woulda etc.
Jay 90 VDP
At 09:28 AM 9/15/2007, Bryan N wrote:
In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Fri 14 Sep 2007:
After 4 hours of effort - abject FAILURE!
snip
The bottom bolt was tight, so tight I split a 13mm socket on
it! The problem was either Loctite on the threads during
initial installation 16 years ago or dissimilar metals
corrosion in the aluminium housing - or both. As a
consequence, it seemed obvious that I would need to
disconnect the rear tranny mounting to lower the bell
housing to get access with a good 13mm socket on the head of
the top bolt. I managed to lower the tranny mount five or
six inches without anything fouling (like the cooling fan on
the radiator as the engine tilted)
snip
Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !
Alan
Frankly the spray and pray stuff no matter what
brand doesn’t seem to break the aluminum oxide
that builds up on the chrome plated fine thread
metric steel bolts. When I broke mine out after
days of soaking and praying they came with a loud
snap even on the water pump using 6 point sockets
and extensions on the biggest rachet I could get
in the tiny space. The tips were white or rusty
depending on whether or not the chrome plate was
still there. There was no evidence the penetrating oil got in there.
Most lying on my back or hanging over the fender
for hours at a time. A lift is what you need to work on these cars.
I’m putting off removing the oil cooler block
under the filter for now due to access issues but
its right up there on the to do list with hopes the bolts come out.
Jay 90 VDP Majestic
At 02:04 PM 9/15/2007, Alan Grossman wrote:
Sorry to hear it…with all the help you have given, one would expect
“Kharma” to be working overtime in your favor. You don’t think it would be
worth using one of the “spray and pray” type products and letting it soak
awhile; then trying again with a 6 point socket?Best, Alan
----- Original Message -----
From: “Bryan N” sophistic@btopenworld.com
To: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2007 7:28 AM
Subject: Re: [xj40] Starter MotorIn reply to a message from Bryan N sent Fri 14 Sep 2007:
After 4 hours of effort - abject FAILURE!
After setting the car up on front wheel ramps and
disconnecting the battery, I thought I would see how tight
the ‘easy’ starter motor attachment bolt was - the one which
is facing the correct way on the bottom of the starter and
is readily accessible from below. I figured that if that was
very tight, so would be the top bolt, so I would be wasting
my time trying to get at the upper bolt from above (removing
the wiper motor or not) because although, even if I could
just about get a cranked open ended on to the upper bolt, no
way would the hex head retain its shape if a lot of force
was required to ‘crack’ it loose.The bottom bolt was tight, so tight I split a 13mm socket on
it! The problem was either Loctite on the threads during
initial installation 16 years ago or dissimilar metals
corrosion in the aluminium housing - or both. As a
consequence, it seemed obvious that I would need to
disconnect the rear tranny mounting to lower the bell
housing to get access with a good 13mm socket on the head of
the top bolt. I managed to lower the tranny mount five or
six inches without anything fouling (like the cooling fan on
the radiator as the engine tilted)What a pain that was! You cannot see the head of the top
bolt, the head being very close to and masked by a
stiffening web on the bell housing and there is a 2’’ thick
dense foam pad squashed between it and the underside of the
tranny tunnel so it is difficult to even feel the darn bolt
head, never mind ensure that any socket is fitting squarely
on it.Eventually I had to hack away at the foam padding with a
bread saw (don’t tell the missus!) to clear a way for the
socket/ wobbler / extension(s) until I could get a firm grip
on the bolt head.And then the fun started! No way, on the occasions when the
socket never slipped off the bolt head, could I ‘crack’ that
bolt. I added an 18’’ extension to the rachet handle and all
I succeeded in doing was to split another 13mm socket and
break two 3/8 drive wobblers. Jeeez that bolt is TIGHT!I toured the local stores (small town!) to find a �’’ drive
13mm socket and the only one available was a 12 point job,
not my preferred 6-point type and using that with �’’ drive
extensions was clearly going to round off the bolt head
before it came loose.At that point I quit! The thought of rounding off that bolt
head in that location doesn’t bear contemplation - I had
visions of the engine / tranny coming out to drill the bolt out.So, I put it all back together and am left with an
immobilised XJ40 awaiting discussions on what to do next
with my trusted local independent Jag specialist. Probably
he will have to have the car on a trailer to fit the
replacement starter. Negotiations start on Monday.–
The original message included these comments:Hopefully I can get the old one off and return the core to
them next Monday. I will report on the success or otherwise
of this task if my bloodied hands can still operate the
keyboard by then!–
Bryan N, '91 Sovereign 4.0 L, RHD
Cambridge, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php –Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !–
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.487 / Virus Database: 269.13.19/1008 - Release Date:
9/14/2007 8:59 AMVisit the Jag Lovers homepage at
http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services
and resources including Photo Albums, Event
Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !
Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !
In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Sat 15 Sep 2007:
Bryan, I think you will have to move up to 1/2’’ drive socket,
extension and universal joint in combination with an air impact
drive, if available. If unable to gain use of a pneumatic system I
have a 12Volt emergency wheel nut impact gun which I have used on
stubborn bolts and/or nuts from time to time. The 3/8’’ drive gear
is just not sufficiently strong enough in many instances.
Hope you have success, especially after having gone to the trouble
of lowering the engine/transmission. Just a caution, if you have
not considered it. Don’t allow too much stress on the water hoses
or radiator when lowering the rear of the engine.
Cheers from ‘Down Under’
Tony–
The original message included these comments:
After 4 hours of effort - abject FAILURE!
The bottom bolt was tight, so tight I split a 13mm socket on
–
L1011 XJ40
Wingham NSW 2429, Australia
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In reply to a message from Tristar sent Sun 16 Sep 2007:
Tony,
Today being Sunday, there was little chance of me finding
somewhere with a set of impact wrench sockets on sale.
However, the Halfords store in the next town are open to day
and they do have an impressive array of sockets and wrenches
behind locked glass screens in their store. (Looked like a
display case in a jewellery store - they must think we are a
bunch of thieving ***** in this area!)
Unfortunately, their stock of � ‘’ drive 6-point impact
wrench sockets only went down to 17mm and their �’’ drive
standard sockets in 13mm size (the size I need) were all
12-point - and I failed with one of those yesterday.
I think an impact gun would probably help if only I could be
certain that the socket is a good snug fit on the bolt head
Still, tomorrow is another day and there is (or was) a good
tool stockist in another town I’ve used before (not open on
Sunday unfortunately) so perhaps I will get lucky then and
can have another bash later.–
The original message included these comments:
Bryan, I think you will have to move up to 1/2’’ drive socket,
extension and universal joint in combination with an air impact
drive, if available. If unable to gain use of a pneumatic system I
have a 12Volt emergency wheel nut impact gun which I have used on
stubborn bolts and/or nuts from time to time. The 3/8’’ drive gear
is just not sufficiently strong enough in many instances.
–
Bryan N, '91 Sovereign 4.0 L, RHD
Cambridge, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !
Bryan,
Sorry to hear of your problem, today I removed my startermotor to give it a
check up, it took about 20 minutes to remove and about 15 to replace. The
reason for the easy run was that I have the head and of course the inlet
manifold off. But even then I had to add an extension pipe to a 13mm open
end ring spanner to crack the top bolt.I do think that it is the flat flange
on the head of the bolts that locks them.
Hope your luck improves.
Grant Jarick
Wagga Wagga
Australia
93XJ40 3.2----- Original Message -----
From: “Bryan N” sophistic@btopenworld.com
To: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 12:28 AM
Subject: Re: [xj40] Starter Motor
In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Fri 14 Sep 2007:
After 4 hours of effort - abject FAILURE!
After setting the car up on front wheel ramps and
disconnecting the battery, I thought I would see how tight
the ‘easy’ starter motor attachment bolt was - the one which
is facing the correct way on the bottom of the starter and
is readily accessible from below. I figured that if that was
very tight, so would be the top bolt, so I would be wasting
my time trying to get at the upper bolt from above (removing
the wiper motor or not) because although, even if I could
just about get a cranked open ended on to the upper bolt, no
way would the hex head retain its shape if a lot of force
was required to ‘crack’ it loose.The bottom bolt was tight, so tight I split a 13mm socket on
it! The problem was either Loctite on the threads during
initial installation 16 years ago or dissimilar metals
corrosion in the aluminium housing - or both. As a
consequence, it seemed obvious that I would need to
disconnect the rear tranny mounting to lower the bell
housing to get access with a good 13mm socket on the head of
the top bolt. I managed to lower the tranny mount five or
six inches without anything fouling (like the cooling fan on
the radiator as the engine tilted)What a pain that was! You cannot see the head of the top
bolt, the head being very close to and masked by a
stiffening web on the bell housing and there is a 2’’ thick
dense foam pad squashed between it and the underside of the
tranny tunnel so it is difficult to even feel the darn bolt
head, never mind ensure that any socket is fitting squarely
on it.Eventually I had to hack away at the foam padding with a
bread saw (don’t tell the missus!) to clear a way for the
socket/ wobbler / extension(s) until I could get a firm grip
on the bolt head.And then the fun started! No way, on the occasions when the
socket never slipped off the bolt head, could I ‘crack’ that
bolt. I added an 18’’ extension to the rachet handle and all
I succeeded in doing was to split another 13mm socket and
break two 3/8 drive wobblers. Jeeez that bolt is TIGHT!I toured the local stores (small town!) to find a �’’ drive
13mm socket and the only one available was a 12 point job,
not my preferred 6-point type and using that with �’’ drive
extensions was clearly going to round off the bolt head
before it came loose.At that point I quit! The thought of rounding off that bolt
head in that location doesn’t bear contemplation - I had
visions of the engine / tranny coming out to drill the bolt out.So, I put it all back together and am left with an
immobilised XJ40 awaiting discussions on what to do next
with my trusted local independent Jag specialist. Probably
he will have to have the car on a trailer to fit the
replacement starter. Negotiations start on Monday.–
The original message included these comments:Hopefully I can get the old one off and return the core to
them next Monday. I will report on the success or otherwise
of this task if my bloodied hands can still operate the
keyboard by then!–
Bryan N, '91 Sovereign 4.0 L, RHD
Cambridge, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php –Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !
Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !
In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Sun 16 Sep 2007:
Well, I know when I’m beat!
Procured a couple of 13mm, 6 point, �’’ drive impact sockets
(one standard, one deep socket) and started the whole
operation again. I hacked away great chunks of that blasted
foam which was restricting access to the top bolt and,
making sure that the socket sat squarely on the bolt head,
tried again to ‘crack’ it.
Working in the restricted space between the garage floor and
the bottom of the lowered tranny, it is not possible to
properly control the extended socket wrench and get enough
force on the breaker bar to be effective. After the socket
twisted off the bolt head a few times I realised that all I
was likely to achieve was a rounded hexagon on the bolt -
and the consequences of that do not bear thinking about!
So I quit for the second time and phoned my local Jag
independent. He confirmed that the older they are, the
tougher they are to crack (added corrosion I guess) and he
has broken �’’ drive wobblers in the course of getting that
bolt out - but has always achieved it … ultimately, and
with the benefit of a lift. So he agreed to have a go at my
car if I could get it to him, some 25 miles away.
Therein lies a problem, because with the starter stuck in
mesh, he confirmed that if I tried to drive it I would
probably burn out the starter and possibly the car!
I then remembered a recent ‘bonus’ added to my classic car
insurance. In addition to the European-wide breakdown and
accident recovery which it automatically includes, they have
now included ‘home start’ and recovery to a repair garage
at no cost to me if it cannot be fixed in my driveway.
Guess where my car is going tomorrow on a flatbed?
So, looking on the bright side (!), although I was cursing
myself for not attacking the starter removal sooner when I
first heard the occasional short ‘graunching’ noise on
start-up, I figure I would still have had exactly the same
problem earlier as later - being forced to hand the car
over to a professional to do the job.
Whereas earlier I had not been covered by my insurance for
‘home start’ free recovery to a repair shop, this year I
am, so that is not going to be an additional cost to add to
what I guess will be a sizeable bill for my Jag Indy to do
the starter replacement.
Small mercies and all of that good stuff! :-)–
The original message included these comments:
Still, tomorrow is another day and there is (or was) a good
tool stockist in another town I’ve used before (not open on
Sunday unfortunately) so perhaps I will get lucky then and
can have another bash later.
–
Bryan N, '91 Sovereign 4.0 L, RHD
Cambridge, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Mon 17 Sep 2007:
i know how tough it is to admit you need help…i have always
hated to rely on others to do a job in which I have the needed
knowledge and tools to do myself…sometimes it is a matter of not
having the time…sometimes it is a matter of not having the proper
equipment…and sometimes it requires a little ‘soul searching’ to
decide if this car is worth the time, effort and cost to keep it
alive…at 231,000 miles that process can sometimes take a LONG
time to work through in my brain…but at the end of the day when
things are back together and the car once again is whole and I am
cruising down the road in style and comfort it somehow all becomes
clear why I put up with the aggravations…–
The original message included these comments:
Well, I know when I’m beat!
Working in the restricted space between the garage floor and
the bottom of the lowered tranny, it is not possible to
properly control the extended socket wrench and get enough
force on the breaker bar to be effective. After the socket
twisted off the bolt head a few times I realised that all I
was likely to achieve was a rounded hexagon on the bolt -
and the consequences of that do not bear thinking about!
So I quit for the second time and phoned my local Jag
independent. He confirmed that the older they are, the
tougher they are to crack (added corrosion I guess) and he
–
Cliff - '93 XJ40 Sovereign (4.0L)
Lancaster/South Carolina, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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Some times you luck out. Best of luck breaking it out or having it broken out.
I feel your pain after changing the water pump in that regard.
Jay
At 02:18 PM 9/17/2007, Bryan N wrote:
In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Sun 16 Sep 2007:
snip
Whereas earlier I had not been covered by my insurance for
‘home start’ free recovery to a repair shop, this year I
am, so that is not going to be an additional cost to add to
what I guess will be a sizeable bill for my Jag Indy to do
the starter replacement.Small mercies and all of that good stuff!
snip
Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !
Have you ever tried giving the starter a good whack? I used to have an older
car that used to get stuck and one good whack would cause the bendix to
disengage. Of course it was probably somewhat more accessable.----- Original Message -----
From: “Bryan N” sophistic@btopenworld.com
To: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 3:18 PM
Subject: Re: [xj40] Starter Motor
In reply to a message from Bryan N sent Sun 16 Sep 2007:
Well, I know when I’m beat!
Procured a couple of 13mm, 6 point, �’’ drive impact sockets
(one standard, one deep socket) and started the whole
operation again. I hacked away great chunks of that blasted
foam which was restricting access to the top bolt and,
making sure that the socket sat squarely on the bolt head,
tried again to ‘crack’ it.Working in the restricted space between the garage floor and
the bottom of the lowered tranny, it is not possible to
properly control the extended socket wrench and get enough
force on the breaker bar to be effective. After the socket
twisted off the bolt head a few times I realised that all I
was likely to achieve was a rounded hexagon on the bolt -
and the consequences of that do not bear thinking about!So I quit for the second time and phoned my local Jag
independent. He confirmed that the older they are, the
tougher they are to crack (added corrosion I guess) and he
has broken �’’ drive wobblers in the course of getting that
bolt out - but has always achieved it … ultimately, and
with the benefit of a lift. So he agreed to have a go at my
car if I could get it to him, some 25 miles away.Therein lies a problem, because with the starter stuck in
mesh, he confirmed that if I tried to drive it I would
probably burn out the starter and possibly the car!I then remembered a recent ‘bonus’ added to my classic car
insurance. In addition to the European-wide breakdown and
accident recovery which it automatically includes, they have
now included ‘home start’ and recovery to a repair garage
at no cost to me if it cannot be fixed in my driveway.Guess where my car is going tomorrow on a flatbed?
So, looking on the bright side (!), although I was cursing
myself for not attacking the starter removal sooner when I
first heard the occasional short ‘graunching’ noise on
start-up, I figure I would still have had exactly the same
problem earlier as later - being forced to hand the car
over to a professional to do the job.Whereas earlier I had not been covered by my insurance for
‘home start’ free recovery to a repair shop, this year I
am, so that is not going to be an additional cost to add to
what I guess will be a sizeable bill for my Jag Indy to do
the starter replacement.Small mercies and all of that good stuff!
The original message included these comments:
Still, tomorrow is another day and there is (or was) a good
tool stockist in another town I’ve used before (not open on
Sunday unfortunately) so perhaps I will get lucky then and
can have another bash later.–
Bryan N, '91 Sovereign 4.0 L, RHD
Cambridge, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php –Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !
Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !
In reply to a message from Dave sent Tue 18 Sep 2007:
Dave, did you mean that Bryan should try a ‘‘technical tap’’?–
The original message included these comments:
Have you ever tried giving the starter a good whack? I used to have an older
–
L1011 XJ40
Wingham NSW 2429, Australia
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
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Something like that…
If nothing else it might relieve some frustration…----- Original Message -----
From: “Tristar” ary61359@bigpond.net.au
To: xj40@jag-lovers.org
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 9:56 PM
Subject: Re: [xj40] Starter Motor
In reply to a message from Dave sent Tue 18 Sep 2007:
Dave, did you mean that Bryan should try a ‘‘technical tap’’?
The original message included these comments:
Have you ever tried giving the starter a good whack? I used to have an
older–
L1011 XJ40
Wingham NSW 2429, Australia
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php –Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting
services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On
Line Books and more !
Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !
In reply to a message from Dave sent Tue 18 Sep 2007:
Dave,
Yes, I did that on Day One - together with next door’s cat!
As you say, it is not really that accessible to vent too
much spleen on it. (The starter that is, not the cat)–
The original message included these comments:
Have you ever tried giving the starter a good whack? I used to have an older
car that used to get stuck and one good whack would cause the bendix to
disengage. Of course it was probably somewhat more accessable.
–
Bryan N, '91 Sovereign 4.0 L, RHD
Cambridge, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
–Support Jag-lovers - Donate at http://www.jag-lovers.org/donate04.php –
Visit the Jag Lovers homepage at http://www.jag-lovers.org for exciting services and resources including Photo Albums, Event Diary / Calendar, On Line Books and more !