Chris,
You question regarding the brass spacer on your radiator. Is that in addition to the plate that has been soldered to the radiator? Or is this the spacer you’re referring to? See photo.
Bob K.
No, Bob - it is in addition to the plate soldered to the radiator.
Chris
There would not be any reason for an extra spacer in addition to the plate soldered to the radiator. Unless your bolts were too long.
But the soldered plate is necessary in order to get a good seal on the thermostat housing. The thin header tank would be too flexible without it.
One of my original bolt heads came loose, so I got some brass bolts and soldered them in.
The trick with soldering on the tag is to get both surfaces well tinned first, then the solder will flow in between them with not much heat.
Here’s another shot with the valence removed.
BTW the cast iron bottom elbow idea is not unique to the 120. My '38 and '50 pushrod cars have them. To solder them you have to braze some brass around the outside where you want the lead solder joint to be. If they are rusted away you can build them up with MIG and a sacrificial copper core which you crush to remove afterwards.
Bob K;
I subscribe to the “Random Number” theory with respect to the Marston Excelsior Ltd. Radiator.
My DHC (677556) is a June ‘53 production date… just twenty-one “numbers” (units/cars?)
after Chris’ DHC (this “equals” the “Order No.” difference) yet the radiator Serial Number is 3838 “units” BEFORE Chris’ DHC!!
The Marston Tag numbers are:
“Order No. P123 2.”
“Serial No. 3327”…
My DHC still has the original radiator shell & tag, albeit recored by Maine Radiator.
Charles Ch# 677556.
I can see no reason for it either, Rob. It would mean two gaskets instead of one with more potential for sealing problems. I wonder why a cork gasket was specified?
The bolts will now be too long, as the radiator rebuilder factored in the spacer when he cut to length the stainless bolts I supplied and soldered them in. I will have to trim them, but will make sure they are securely supported with the spare (badly corroded) thermostat housing bolted in place.
BTW, I’m envious of your TEX hose clamp!
Chris
Charles,
Although nobody can tell us what is “correct” in this case, I have to disagree with you.
First question is: do you really have a P123 2 order number or should that be P102 3 as I have noted this number from you in the past with serial number 3327.
If it is P123 2 this is from a much later radiator because order number P121 corresponds with the Jaguar Mk VIII/IX radiators.
Furthermore, the P102 3 order number is issued in the autumn of 1951 and I don’t believe that Jaguar would keep their stocks for more than 18 months (your car is from June 1953) while in the meantime many new order numbers have been issued: XK 120s of mid 1953 have the order number P102 9.
Could you please check once more?
Bob K.
Bob K;
I tried copying my Radiator Tag for you, but I guess I don’t have a/the program to do that… (I can “copy” it, I just can’t “attach” it!)
Bottom line, the numbers on my “Marston Excelsior Ltd. Leeds 12” tag read: “Order No. P123 2” and “Serial No. 3327”… These numbers are “stamped”, not “written” like I saw one image posted.
If I reported “P1023” at some previous time, I either mis-read or mis-typed… probably both ;-}
All I can say about my radiator is: this is the same radiator that has been in my DHC since May 1967 when I bought the Jag. I did talk to the original owner (I’m the second owner) about the Jag when I bought it, but didn’t know then what I know now (about these XK’s) so I probably did not ask the “right” questions… That said, I did ask if the XK had been in any accidents… other than a minor left wing “prang”, it had not… so, no reason to suspect a radiator change due to an accident…
Charles Ch #677556.
Charles,
You can simply attach any photo (if the file size is not too large, see hereafter) in the text you’ve typed in your reply. First look at the size of the photo file: anything over 1 Mb is far too large and the system will refuse it and report that.
If you hold your “arrow/cursor” on any photo in your file explorer, the size will appear on the screen. If required you can “downsize” the file by using the right knob on your mouse and change the format. Once you’ve copied the “downsized” photo, simply paste it in the text where you want it to appear.
I’ve explained all this as I really would love to see your radiator (not only the tag because I really accept the numbers you’ve quoted) as there is a large chance that it’s a (much) later radiator (because of your order number P123) and than an early one from this type (because of your serial number 3327). We should not exclude the possibility that your radiator has been replaced prior to 1967.
Bob K.
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Hello Bob,
I bought my XK in the New York area 25 years ago. It has been ever been in that area, The engine was untouched and also the radiator with some dings. The car is matching numbers, obviously untouched/original with the exception of a adjustable rear view mirror.
Yes I agree that nobody knows if anybody changed a leaking radiator for a second hand item.
Beat regards
Thomas
Bob K;
Hopefully, I have attached a pic of my Radiator Tag…
The radiator is boxed and stored out in my shop.
I removed the tag BEFORE I sent the Radiator to Maine Radiator…
just-in-case!!
image|690x360
Finally!! I hope the image is big enough!
I’ll try to take a pic of the Radiator tomorrow (approx 12 hours from now.
it’s 04:33am–GMT-6)
Charles Ch# 677556.
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Charles,
Your Marston tag is complete clear now.
Curious to see what your radiator will look like. Order number P121 was introduced in 1956 for the Mk VIII. So it would be logical if Order Number P123 would be from 1956 or later.
You will also notice that this P121 plate has the “MEL” lay-out that was introduced in late 1954 for the first XK 140s. But your P 123 plate has the previous lay-out. Another question mark…
Bob K.
Took the decision to do away with the brass spacer and yesterday I shortened the bolts a little. Here’s a pic of the existing alloy rad with the thermostat housing, and another of the restored rad with the spacer, before the bolts were shortened.
Bob K;
Gonna download eight pics of my restored radiator (hopefully they will upload!). Said unit is the same one fitted to my XK120 since I bought the DHC from the original owner in 1967. Only the “core” has been changed…
Based on my observations of XKs over the last fifty-odd years, it looks like an XK120 Radiator, to me…
Charles. Ch# 677556.
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Yes, Charles, there is no doubt that it is an XK120 radiator.
The anomaly is this tag on the rear of the top tank.
Normally they do not have anything there.
This may be a clue as to the history of yours.
It could be a repair tag from some unknown shop, or it could be an indicator of a later production for Jaguar’s spare parts division, i.e. after the XK120 was no longer being produced.
If you can decipher that, it may be of interest to this discussion.
Rob R;
I’ll try to check it out tomorrow… Wife has Dr. Appt, up in Ft. Worth, to get her legs wrapped (lymphadema-- swelling of the legs) This “event” takes place every three/four days… AND my knees are crapping-out, making walking no fun at all… Not a happy camper!
Charles Ch# 677556.
Charles,
Thanks for these pics. Nothing to add to what Rob already mentioned,
Again, I don’t know how to place your Marston tag. It’s a much later (1956/1957?) plate but by that year it would/should have been the “MEL” lay-out.
All I can think of is that this plate is a later addition (may be even a new one) with the wrong numbers stamped by someone who wasn’t aware of the Marston codes. But congratulations with this beautiful radiator.
I wish you both a “healthy” spring and stay safe!
Bob K.
Bob;
All I can say is THAT tag was soldered onto the radiator when I bought the DHC
in the spring of 1967…
Given I bought the Jag from the first owner and, based on his testimony, all service work
was done by Overseas Motors, the Jaguar Dealership, I have no reason to believe the tag,
OR the radiator are anything but original to the DHC.
Charles Ch# 677556.
ADDITIONAL INFO ON “RAD TAG”
Rob R;
Unboxed my radiator (again)… I was going to take a pic of the tag (on the back-side of the header tank) you had asked for… but I believe even a "Close-Up would be so shiny as to be unreadable… So…
I enlisted my best kindergarten drawing skills then took a pic of the results… as a “spoiler”, I believe I can say you were (are) 100% correct about the tag being a “Shop Identification” tag… more specifically. I believe it’s simply a “date code” used by the particular shop who fitted the Maine Radiator Core to my XK120’s Header and Bottom Tanks…
The “dots” on the sides of the tag appear to be “spot welds”. The horizontally “stacked” numbers are likely Day & Month (19 August), No clue what the “L” is. (take this thing and get the “L” outta here??) And, Yes… the shape of the metal tag is, indeed, a trapezoid… If “on purpose”, maybe to differentiate it from a “factory” tag??
I’ve already told you more than I know!
Charles Ch# 677556.
I sent my radiator to a local shop, today they called and said the radiator needed to be re-cored. So do I buy a rebuilt one or have the guy re-core it? If the latter, what information do I need to have him do it properly?
Maddy
I found the place that sells cores.
Maine Radiator in Lewiston ME
https://maineradiator.com/catalogs/
Your shop can get one from them.