can anyone tell me if the heat shield between the exhaust pipe
and the gearbox is made of asbestos? I am concerned and
worried as I have rattled and come into contact with that heat
shield while searching for the lost gearbox filler plug. That
triangular heat shield looked brand new; So what is the chance
of it being made of asbestos? If not then what is the fibrous
light grayish material that I saw. Thanks
William–
wc8
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from wc8 sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
I think there is a 100% chance it is made of asbestos. Cement
board from home supply store should be an acceptable substitute.
Still not a better fire proof insulator than asbestos on earth just
has some nasty side effects.–
Kris Gamble
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Kris Gamble sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
I should clarify that the original was surely asbestos. Really
doubt if anything that looks like it was make after 1975 has any
asbestos in it since it was basically outlawed by then.–
Kris Gamble
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Kris Gamble sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
If that car was restore which I believe it was it would not have
asbestos installed the new product looks just like it but it is safe–
The original message included these comments:
I should clarify that the original was surely asbestos. Really
doubt if anything that looks like it was make after 1975 has any
asbestos in it since it was basically outlawed by then.
–
Currently building 875880 OTS,
Gastonia, North Carolina, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Kris Gamble sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
weeee! asbestos.the ever present companion on many u.s.bases
around the planet(how I grew up)…goes well with the lead
paint we used to chew on when we were kids(50 and older
definitely applies)and leaded petrol.
alusuisse (which is alcan now) had a product called tempral.
heat resistant aluminium not loosing strength significantly
up to 300 C� or so. it may have another name by now, but i
doubt it would be easily weldable. it is,however,relatively
easy to form(read:hammer into shape with basic annealing and
shaping skills using a fire wrench,if needed).
it’ll look good too-if properly formed and polished.
thewytchdoktor ;-)–
v12fun=thewytchdoktor/94 xjs 6 litre a.k.a.dok -)
Winchester Virginia, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from wc8 sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
Yes, it’s asbestos but, no, you don’t have to worry about exposure
because it’s non-friable. Sand it or grind it or cut it with a saw
then you’d probably release some airborne fibres that might get
into your lungs if you’re not wearing a mask. Otherwise, the stuff
is safe.–
Nick Saltarelli '68 Cdn mkt E-type S1� OTS, '54 XK120SE OTS
Niagara, Ontario, Canada
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Kris Gamble sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
It wasn’t outlawed and was still being used in the building
trade and probably other items up to the early 90’s.
Dave–
The original message included these comments:
I should clarify that the original was surely asbestos. Really
doubt if anything that looks like it was make after 1975 has any
asbestos in it since it was basically outlawed by then.
–
'61 OTS
Pershore, United Kingdom
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from N�ck sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
If you have a reason to modify it or remove it, keep it wetted
while you work it. It is only a hazard when it is ingested by
breathing, wetting it will prevent it from becoming airbourne
particulate.–
The original message included these comments:
because it’s non-friable. Sand it or grind it or cut it with a saw
then you’d probably release some airborne fibres that might get
into your lungs if you’re not wearing a mask. Otherwise, the stuff
–
EdIrwin 62 FHC
Jefferson City Missouri, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from Dave K sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
Intitially it was banned in 1989 and then adjusted. It can still
be found in many items used by the consumer, including brake
pads/linings, clutch pads and cement board.
Ralph, 1970 FHC, 1R27295
Coastal NJ, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from RGK sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
Im no scientist, but its my understanding that the threat
of asbestos has been hugely exaggerated. As others have
mentioned we used to play with lead/mercury/gasoline and
asbestos and although im not recommending that, we are
still here and doing fine…you could always seal the edges
of the shield if you like…–
The original message included these comments:
Intitially it was banned in 1989 and then adjusted. It can still
be found in many items used by the consumer, including brake
pads/linings, clutch pads and cement board.
–
Peter Willetts 62 OTS, Laguna Niguel, Ca
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from PeteWilletts sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
I put the question of asbestos on this forum and getting
mixed opinions. One said its not asbestos, one says its
asbestos but in cement form. Another one said its asbestos
but sandwiched in aluminum sheets. The heat shield in my car
looks new with aluminum on one side facing down and a
fibrous greyish spongy side exposed and facing up. So,
bottom line, what is the chance of it being made of
asbestos? I am really concerned and worried as when I was
removing and rattling it to shake out the lost plug, some
dusty fibrous cottony like material loosened off and my face
was right against the heat shield without a mask.
this car I bought from classic showcase was
restored/maintained by George Camp when it was in S.
Carolina. He would be the one who would know whether this
restored classic has heat shields (especially the triangular
heat shield under the gearbox)that contains asbestos or not.
Does anyone know if Mr.George Camp would grant me the
privilege of hearing his opinion on this forum ?
William–
wc8
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
If it is the same as what was installed in my 65 Healey, it is asbestos. I had it tested and have the results filed away. Not sure I can find them now, but if anyone wants the exact numbers, I will try to find the test results sheet.
=============
In reply to a message from PeteWilletts sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
I put the question of asbestos on this forum and getting
mixed opinions. One said its not asbestos, one says its
asbestos but in cement form. Another one said its asbestos
but sandwiched in aluminum sheets. The heat shield in my car
looks new with aluminum on one side facing down and a
fibrous greyish spongy side exposed and facing up. So,
bottom line, what is the chance of it being made of
asbestos? I am really concerned and worried as when I was
removing and rattling it to shake out the lost plug, some
dusty fibrous cottony like material loosened off and my face
was right against the heat shield without a mask.
this car I bought from classic showcase was
restored/maintained by George Camp when it was in S.
Carolina. He would be the one who would know whether this
restored classic has heat shields (especially the triangular
heat shield under the gearbox)that contains asbestos or not.
Does anyone know if Mr.George Camp would grant me the
privilege of hearing his opinion on this forum ?
William
In reply to a message from PeteWilletts sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
I was glad to see Pete’s comments. I think I have detected a
growing sense of abject discomfort felt by some folks when
the topic of ‘‘asbestos’’ is raised. As others have said the
main potential risk is to breathe its dust, so wet it down
and wear a mask. if you wish to stabilize a surface to
prevent abrasion of dust particles then coat with epoxy to
seal the surface. There are more important issues to be
aware of in this resto hobby that some of us have…avoid
lead dust, don’t breathe lots of organic fumes etc.–
The original message included these comments:
Im no scientist, but its my understanding that the threat
of asbestos has been hugely exaggerated. As others have
mentioned we used to play with lead/mercury/gasoline and
asbestos and although im not recommending that, we are
still here and doing fine…you could always seal the edges
of the shield if you like…
Peter Willetts 62 OTS, Laguna Niguel, Ca
–
John M Holmes 1973 E Type SIII Supra 5Sp, 70 SII OTS 05XJ8L
Ontario, Canada
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from wc8 sent Fri 24 Jan 2014:
asbestos causes cancer-proven-nasty stuff!
i wouldn’t take a chance if you can’t find out for sure.
it’s your health and you only get one life.why gamble on
something like that shield.a safe replacement-no matter what
the expense-is cheaper than cancer treatments.
just being practical for once
thewytchdoktor–
v12fun=thewytchdoktor/94 xjs 6 litre a.k.a.dok -)
Winchester Virginia, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from wc8 sent Fri 24 Jan 2014:
Since you have the receipts for the resto, why not contact the
supplier of that part and ask them about its construction?–
Ralph, 1970 FHC, 1R27295
Coastal NJ, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from wc8 sent Fri 24 Jan 2014:
William here is my opinion. You contacted me via E mail
some time ago. You had a lot of questions and I provided my
phone number which you chose to not use. As I told you I
did a lot of work to that car years ago but have no records
of work on the shields. The car was sold more than a decade
ago and went to CA. I have no Idea what happened there or
anywhere else it may have been. I take exception to the way
you wrote this as though I was unwilling to discuss this
car. William not sure what you are up to but this is sure
an odd way to get there!–
The original message included these comments:
Carolina. He would be the one who would know whether this
restored classic has heat shields (especially the triangular
heat shield under the gearbox)that contains asbestos or not.
Does anyone know if Mr.George Camp would grant me the
privilege of hearing his opinion on this forum ?
William
–
George Camp
Columbia SC, United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from wc8 sent Thu 23 Jan 2014:
This topic comes up regularly, heres a link to a good
discussion of the topic and one post (Tom F.) that elucidates
the chemical composition of the material. http://tinyurl.com/lx9dwwy
Personally, I think the risk is exceedingly low and I am more
concerned with getting hit by a distracted driver. If you are
risk averse, don’t smoke. I have had the impression during my
professional career that the risk of mesothelioma from
asbestos exposure was closely related to smoking.
Be smart, wear protective gear where appropriate and wet the
material down when your working with it. JM2CW
Cheers,
Lynn–
The original message included these comments:
and the gearbox is made of asbestos? I am concerned and
worried as I have rattled and come into contact with that heat
shield while searching for the lost gearbox filler plug. That
–
Lynn G.
68/85 ots, 73 2+2, Boise, Id., United States
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
In reply to a message from wc8 sent Fri 24 Jan 2014:
This conversation is starting to get hysterical, and I don’t mean
in the funny sense. Asbestos is a known carcinogen, yes, but it is
not the bubonic plague. I would give zero thought to the exposure
you describe. About as much as you got from brake dust as a kid
standing on the corner of a busy street waiting for the light to
change. I personally know hundreds of people who were exposed to
friable asbestos - the nasty stuff - used to insulate steam lines
over 20-30 years of employment and none of them are affected,
mainly because none apparently carry the BAP1 gene mutation.
Mesothelioma is deadly but rare. Here’s a revealing statistic.
3,000 people in the US die of mesothelioma each year. Compare that
to 250,000 from coronary heart disease and stroke, 140,000 from
other lung cancers and lung diseases, 35,000 from hypertension,
25,000 from flu and pnuemonia, etc. etc.–
The original message included these comments:
bottom line, what is the chance of it being made of
asbestos? I am really concerned and worried as when I was
removing and rattling it to shake out the lost plug, some
dusty fibrous cottony like material loosened off and my face
was right against the heat shield without a mask.
–
Nick Saltarelli '68 Cdn mkt E-type S1� OTS, '54 XK120SE OTS
Niagara, Ontario, Canada
–Posted using Jag-lovers JagFORUM [forums.jag-lovers.org]–
G’Day William,
The most dangerous form of asbestos is the stuff with bluish fibres
(crocidolite), stuff on the OEM shield was white asbestos (chrysotile), not
as bad but still very dangerous. Mesothelioma generally takes 20-30 plus
years (but not always) to manifest itself after exposure, most people
diagnosed have had a ‘lot’ of exposure often over years during their ‘work’
with the stuff. Miners, fibrocement manufacturing workers, house builders
using the fibrocement sheets originally made with it using inappropriate
methods of cutting it, engine room artificers or boilermakers in the navy or
on locomotives where the exhaust, boilers and steam pipes were lagged with
the stuff regularly replacing the lagging, people in the insulation industry
putting the blanket batts of the stuff (rockwool) in roof or wall spaces
were the usual victims. Brake shoes/pads all used to contain it and some
car mechanics have contracted mesothelioma but not many, I bet a lot on this
list have cleaned dust out of the older style brakes before disks and
accidentally inhaled a bit of it (certainly I did around 1957 for the first
time on Ford brakes and fairly often thereafter), ask and I’ll bet no one on
the list who did this 30 years or more ago now has diagnosed mesothelioma.
So… bottom line a single ‘possible’ exposure that you describe will
likely be inconsequential (a fibre of just the right size would have to
lodge in lung tissue and not be cleared out with all other inhaled dust by
the normal mucous cleaning system in your lungs to ‘possibly’ have an
effect - some medical experts say ‘one’ fibre is enough others say yes that
is true but ‘every’ fibre that lodges does not cause mesothelioma - Occam’s
Razor would indicate you have to breathe a lot of fibres over some
significant period of time to really be at risk), have you ever won a multi
million dollar lottery, how old are you now? I suspect in another 30 years
you will likely have other more pressing health concerns (something else
will probably get you first even if you win the mesothelioma lottery with
such a minuscule exposure). In your circumstance I would not have ‘concern’
but certainly would act with prudence and not inhale any of the fibres of
whatever it is again. It is current practice with old fences, roofs etc
made with fibrocement containing asbestos here to get them removed
professionally OR just paint them to seal fibres in if not likely to be
broken/cut/drilled etc. You could with your current insulator buy some high
temp white engine paint in a spray can and give the loose surface a thin
coat, that paint would leave it still looking white, still with insulating
property and paint will not be damaged by heat from exhaust soaking through
first the aluminium then the fibres - if new and not an ‘original new old
stock’ part it is unlikely to be asbestos anyway but better safe than sorry.
Do not worry it will not happen
Cheers, John B. 67 2+2 in Oz-----Original Message-----
William,
George attends this forum, I’m sure he’ll respond.
pauls
…this car I bought from classic showcase was
restored/maintained by George Camp when it was in S.
Carolina. He would be the one who would know whether this
restored classic has heat shields (especially the triangular
heat shield under the gearbox)that contains asbestos or not.
Does anyone know if Mr.George Camp would grant me the
privilege of hearing his opinion on this forum ?
William
<<<<<<<<<From: “wc8” williamcmd@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [E-Type] Asbestos Heat Shields in 1961 restored e-type ots
